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[Sad Affleck]

You're 100% correct, but in my opinion, it does more damage to the cause than good when you deliberately skew the argument by using used components, or eBay prices, or anything along those lines...

I don't think the argument is skewed but it might be a necessary evil anyway to get the main point across. A video titled "$800 new PC vs PS4 Pro" is not going to generate any sort of worthwhile discussion as very few people will look past the initial price to examine the overall value proposition. Also, it wouldn't be at all suitable for examining an old PC's performance with a GPU upgrade.

I think the video and the whole series is meant to get the ball rolling on the value over time discussion and it achieves that goal. That's why I've been saying that people taking this as buying advice are missing the point. The takeaway from it isn't that you should scrounge eBay and build a $400 PC out of used parts to compete with the PS4 Pro. The conclusion should be that the extra money you'll pay for a PC is worth it as you will get a lot of mileage out of it and it won't be hopelessly outdated in two years, as many people still seem to think.

 

[jono51]

Fuck this guy. He didn't actually spend $450. Other people have said he rigged the comparison, and I believe them. (And that in itself is making me feel a lot better, and less nauseous, after watching that horrifying video).

Stop lying and making up fake news to make the PlayStation 4 Pro look bad.

There is no better value deal in gaming right now than the PS4 Pro. And not only that, but it has the best games too. You also don't have to deal with drivers, cables, installation issues, hardware issues, or anything else. You just plug and play.

 

[CryptiK]

Fuck this guy. He didn't actually spend $450. Other people have said he rigged the comparison, and I believe them. (And that in itself is making me feel a lot better, and less nauseous, after watching that horrifying video).

Stop lying and making up fake news to make the PlayStation 4 Pro look bad.

There is no better value deal in gaming right now than the PS4 Pro. And not only that, but it has the best games too. You also don't have to deal with drivers, cables, installation issues, hardware issues, or anything else. You just plug and play.

Lmao spoken like someone that doesnt have a clue.

drivers: Firmware updates
cables: The PS4 Pro is completely wireless :O
installation issues: Wut?
hardware issues: ye man PS4 Pro never has hardware issues. There isnt totally a thread complaining about how loud it is and it certainly doesnt break.

 

[Skux]

Am I the only one who finds the whole potato meme to be the work of immature, PC gaming children lacking in wit? The work of a child/manchild who feels owning a PC is a status symbol, making them superior over others who happen to own a console.

I say this as someone who owns a 6700K/1080 GTX & enjoys playing games on my PS4 Pro and XO.

Potato masher refers to the PC, not the console.

 

[Kal]

In the case of the PS4 and PS4 Pro it is to significantly outperform two $400 consoles. The idea is that if you opted to build a good gaming PC instead of buying a PS4 at launch you can easily stay ahead of the upgraded PS4 Pro with a simple GPU upgrade. This is what the video shows you. The upfront cost of a PC might seem scary to consumers used to the razors-and-razorblades model of console gaming but over time it is actually as good if not better value for money.

The video creator even says so in his intro. The point of his videos is to show that PC gaming can offer as good or even better value for money than consoles, not to push any sort of PC master race narrative. There are a lot of people who are completely misinformed on the topic of PC gaming costs, there's nothing wrong with letting them know that PC gaming isn't just about monster rigs. PC gaming on a budget is absolutely possible when one overcomes the initial sticker shock.

At the bolded bit; then why not compare it against a used PS4 Pro? It seems he's gone above and beyond to get the cheapest components for the PC but is unwilling to do the same for the PS4 Pro. This is why a lot of people are saying the comparison is disingenuous. If the point of the video was to show that PC gaming can be cheap and accessible then it could have been done without mentioning any console. There is some valuable information in the video but the whole thing is undermined by the way it was presented.

Slightly OT. Currently have a PS4 and I'll be getting a Pro as soon as I get a 4K TV (waiting for a price drop on the LG OLEDs - hopefully after CES 2017) but I've been considering also getting a PC (over an XBOX One) for a while now mostly because I want the best graphics possible. I was looking at prices yesterday and holy shit these things are not cheap!!! I'm not talking about graphics comparable to the PS4/Pro but PCs that can drive full 4K with Ultra details. I was looking at places like scan.co.uk and I found this https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator/x99-carbon-titan-x but it costs £2646.04!!! I have never built a PC before; roughly how much will I save if I buy the parts and build it myself? And I assume with a PC like that I wouldn't have to upgrade anything for 3 or more years?

 

[CLEEK]

300€ for a 1060? Really?

Is that because of Brexit?

€ or U.K.

Pick one.

 

[KOHIPEET]

In hungary, that GPU alone costs 342 US dollars where you can get a PS4 pro for about 438 US dollars.

 

[Sad Affleck]

At the bolded bit; then why not compare it against a used PS4 Pro? It seems he's gone above and beyond to get the cheapest components for the PC but is unwilling to do the same for the PS4 Pro. This is why a lot of people are saying the comparison is disingenuous. If the point of the video was to show that PC gaming can be cheap and accessible then it could have been done without mentioning any console. There is some valuable information in the video but the whole thing is undermined by the way it was presented.

I've been following the channel so I believe I can answer that. He didn't set up the Potato Masher Pro system today. Once the price of the PS4 Pro was revealed he made plans for a new build for the Potato Masher Pro and he settled for a GPU upgrade for the old system because that's basically what the PS4 Pro is, a PS4 with a new GPU. This all happened before the console's release. Once the budget was in place he used it to buy the best graphics card he could. The price of the Pro was used as a ballpark figure for the available budget. The video doesn't say that it compares a $450 PC to a $400 Pro so there really is nothing disingenuous about it. The budget for the PC can't change because it has been set in stone even efore the console's release. The available data is still valid, noone is stopping you from comparing this $450 PC to a $350 used PS4 Pro.

Slightly OT. Currently have a PS4 and I'll be getting a Pro as soon as I get a 4K TV (waiting for a price drop on the LG OLEDs - hopefully after CES 2017) but I've been considering also getting a PC (over an XBOX One) for a while now mostly because I want the best graphics possible. I was looking at prices yesterday and holy shit these things are not cheap!!! I'm not talking about graphics comparable to the PS4/Pro but PCs that can drive full 4K with Ultra details. I was looking at places like scan.co.uk and I found this https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator/x99-carbon-titan-x but it costs £2646.04!!! I have never built a PC before; roughly how much will I save if I buy the parts and build it myself? And I assume with a PC like that I wouldn't have to upgrade anything for 3 or more years?

Top of the line hardware is overpriced, cards like the TitanX are luxury items for those looking for the best performance available. You can get close to the same amount of performance for much less money and you will save money if you build it yourself.

 

[Kal]

I've been following the channel so I believe I can answer that. He didn't set up the Potato Masher Pro system today. Once the price of the PS4 Pro was revealed he made plans for a new build for the Potato Masher Pro and he settled for a GPU upgrade for the old system because that's basically what the PS4 Pro is, a PS4 with a new GPU. This all happened before the console's release. Once the budget was in place he used it to buy the best graphics card he could. The price of the Pro was used as a ballpark figure for the available budget. The video doesn't say that it compares a $450 PC to a $400 Pro so there really is nothing disingenuous about it. The budget for the PC can't change because it has been set in stone even efore the console's release. The available data is still valid, noone is stopping you from comparing this $450 PC to a $350 used PS4 Pro.

If the point of the vid was a direct comparison then price should be taken into consideration as well. I've just watched initial Potato Masher Pro vid and it seems he was trying to build on the existing Potato Masher while staying within the PS4 Pro price limit (also taking into account the trade-in price of the original PS4). That seems fair until you realise that the Potato Masher itself was built using gifted/discounted/used items. It doesn't help that the Potato Masher was labelled a "console killer" which tells me he has an agenda or that he is bending the "rules" to suit his narrative.

Also - and this is not his fault at all - I'm guessing that the videos are mostly relevant to people living in the States that can take advantage of cheaper hardware at least compared to those of us in Europe

Top of the line hardware is overpriced, cards like the TitanX are luxury items for those looking for the best performance available. You can get close to the same amount of performance for much less money and you will save money if you build it yourself.

Thanks - I'm completely clueless when it comes to building PCs but I'm not particularly daunted by it; I'm sure I'll be asking you pros on GAF for lots of advice when I'm ready

 

[Aztechnology]

In hungary, that GPU alone costs 342 US dollars where you can get a PS4 pro for about 438 US dollars.

https://www.pcx.hu/sapphire-rx480-4gb-gddr5-nitro-11260-02-20g-videokartya-642609

The 480 4Gb can be had for about $100 less. Still obviously not as cheap as U.S, but would give you pretty much the same performance.

I only had to do rudimentary research to find that. So I imagine you could probably even find better deals.

 

[StromboliProtocol]

Nonsense

Case, power supply, ram and motherboard cost at least 50$ each. No way you could have CPU and GPU, cables, fans, thermal paste with the 200 remaining dollars.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Lmao spoken like someone that doesnt have a clue.

drivers: Firmware updates
cables: The PS4 Pro is completely wireless :O
installation issues: Wut?
hardware issues: ye man PS4 Pro never has hardware issues. There isnt totally a thread complaining about how loud it is and it certainly doesnt break.

It's a troll post, don't worry about it.

 

[Aztechnology]

It's a troll post, don't worry about it.

Nonsense

Case, power supply, ram and motherboard cost at least 50$ each. No way you could have CPU and GPU, cables, fans, thermal paste with the 200 remaining dollars.

I think this one above yours is too.

 

[Labombadog]

I'm an avid PC gamer but the title is very misleading. If there are people interested in getting into PC gaming there is no way they are going to build a rig for that price to get that performance. This is only for people that already have a pretty good PC and want to upgrade their GPU.

On to the video: I like how unbiased he was (for the most part) overall. Basically, if you sit far away from your TV (as most console users) and prefer a controller for Battlefield One then the PS4 Pro is the pick for you. Otherwise, PC.

 

[Aztechnology]

I'm an avid PC gamer but the title is very misleading. If there are people interested in getting into PC gaming there is no way they are going to build a rig for that price to get that performance. This is only for people that already have a pretty good PC and want to upgrade their GPU.

On to the video: I like how unbiased he was (for the most part) overall. Basically, if you sit far away from your TV (as most console users) and prefer a controller for Battlefield One then the PS4 Pro is the pick for you. Otherwise, PC.

He isn't that far off.

i5 750 $40

Arctic Alpine 11 Cooler $10

Intel DZ68DB Motherboard $60

8GB AMD DDR3 Ram $20

Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB $240

EVGA 430W PSU $40

WD 320GB HDD $20

Azza CSAZ Case $20

Windows $25

Total $475

To be fair you can get a PS4 Pro for $380

From earlier if you really wanted to go that route. But yes the point is not that you're building a PC that is a 1:1 price to performance next to a console. Just the fact the PC has many many more features, options and uses makes that kind of silly to do as well. But hey it's something to try and battle misconceptions that are rampant today.

Something to consider is one of the points being made was that he didn't need to build a new computer for this, instead he was able to use his system he's had for a while now and simply upgrade the GPU. Much like the PS4 Pro is essentially just a GPU upgrade.

As I posted on the previous page and gave a builds for including K/M etc. Is that it costs about 50% more upfront for what I would consider to be recommended baseline for future proofing reasons (although if you just saw it as a static platform like a console you could definitely trim some fat and lower the price further there) That's the beauty of it and something that needs to be considered. The PC as you said can have their parts upgraded independently. Now with the essential death of Moore's law, more than ever does it make sense to buy a PC as your actually have to do even less upgrading than before and could focus on the largest performance jumps for gaming. With that being said if you're going the PC route I'd recommend looking into an i5 or i7 for that reason.

 

[SapientWolf]

If you're going to buy an old ass CPU for gaming then at least buy a 6 core Xeon.

This one is funny because I tried to tell people that the i5-750 still beasts in BF1 but no one believed me.

 

[johnny956]

In the case of the PS4 and PS4 Pro it is to significantly outperform two $400 consoles. The idea is that if you opted to build a good gaming PC instead of buying a PS4 at launch you can easily stay ahead of the upgraded PS4 Pro with a simple GPU upgrade. This is what the video shows you. The upfront cost of a PC might seem scary to consumers used to the razors-and-razorblades model of console gaming but over time it is actually as good if not better value for money.

The video creator even says so in his intro. The point of his videos is to show that PC gaming can offer as good or even better value for money than consoles, not to push any sort of PC master race narrative. There are a lot of people who are completely misinformed on the topic of PC gaming costs, there's nothing wrong with letting them know that PC gaming isn't just about monster rigs. PC gaming on a budget is absolutely possible when one overcomes the initial sticker shock.

Except the original potato masher was used and gifted parts too

 

[Sad Affleck]

Except the original potato masher was used and gifted parts too

No, this is false. First of all, the budget they set themselves back when they priced the system was that of a used PS4 so the argument about picking used parts is meaningless. Second, the only part that was gifted to them was the case and they included its price in the budget anyway.

 

[LilJoka]

He isn't that far off.

i5 750 $40

Arctic Alpine 11 Cooler $10

Intel DZ68DB Motherboard $60

8GB AMD DDR3 Ram $20

Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB $240

EVGA 430W PSU $40

WD 320GB HDD $20

Azza CSAZ Case $20

Windows $25

Total $475

To be fair you can get a PS4 Pro for $380

CPU is incompatible with that board.

To the posts saying get an old 6c xeon, socket 1366 boards are rare and expensive now.

 

[belvedere]

No, this is false. First of all, the budget they set themselves back when they priced the system was that of a used PS4 so the argument about picking used parts is meaningless. Second, the only part that was gifted to them was the case and they included its price in the budget anyway.

The Pro isn't $450.

 

[What A Time To Be Alive]

This thread made me realize how fucking stupid some people are smh

Cool video tho. Like the Potato Masher series :3

 

[BlackClouds]

Youtube creators not having journalistic ethics. Color me surprised. This is the fake news, post truth, no facts era after all. Though I will say that it's possible to get something similar to the ps4 pro for around $500 (without OS) with brand new components. There's some crafty builds out there. I'm fine with the truth.

I dislike those vids using used components without any warranties, so if something goes bad you're out of luck. Those on a real strict budgets (not kids with strict parents) can't afford for stuff to go bad. So these videos are amusing to me, and they are popular, easy views.

 

[Tarrin]

I love this series.

But hot damn for me to build that PC, or a better "budget" one will cost me 600-800 bucks. My PS4 Pro was 80* bucks. *thanks to EB Games promotions.

I hate the Canadian dollar.

 

[Sad Affleck]

The Pro isn't $450.

We're discussing the original Potato Masher hardware. The $450 price isn't random either.

 

[Aztechnology]

CPU is incompatible with that board.

To the posts saying get an old 6c xeon, socket 1366 boards are rare and expensive now.

OK well I found other boards for even cheaper that are and have decent features. Mostly around $50-60. Can't speak for the old Xeon board but it still changes nothing.

 

[pager99]

Man people get butthurt that the ps4 pro is good value,at least thats what it seems to me

 

[Aztechnology]

Man people get butthurt that the ps4 pro is good value,at least thats what it seems to me

Not at all. I definitely advocate it's a good machine. It's more there's tons of people still perpetuating that PC's can't even come close in terms of value, or that they are too complicated and on and on. Which are damaging misconceptions and doesn't really help anyone. So I can't see the point in it. It's just more fanboy stuff.

Think of all the threads talking about PC gaming in any way, and people feel the need to come in and talk about how controller and couch is more comfortable or some other inane BS that is misleading.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Man people get butthurt that the ps4 pro is good value,at least thats what it seems to me

Are we reading the same thread? All I'm seeing is "unfair comparision", "that PC isn't $450", and so on. It seems to me that a lot more people are hurt that a cheap PC is actually the way to go.

 

[baconcow]

A quick look shows me that the 1060 sells for $340 CAD, here. I paid $400 for my PS4 Pro, new, day 1. Seems his idea is incompatible with our prices.

 

[Aztechnology]

A quick look shows me that the 1060 sells for $340 CAD, here. I paid $400 for my PS4 Pro, new, day 1. Seems his idea is incompatible with our prices.

So you paid $100 under retail for your PS4. That's $297 USD. Well at least there's one thing you guys get cheaper than the U.S.

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01LR207T8/

Or you just got a really special deal? Either way still definitely a reality, just like people getting very great times deals, used parts or anything else. We don't have to just compare MSRP on things. There lots of times you can get serious serious deals on parts too. 1060 and 480 both respectively have gotten down into the $160-180 regions too. PSU's have been into the teens. Cases for a ten. CPU's for outrageous deals on and on.

 

[pager99]

Are we reading the same thread? All I'm seeing is "unfair comparision", "that PC isn't $450", and so on. It seems to me that a lot more people are hurt that a cheap PC is actually the way to go.

Youd be a fool to try and build a 400 dollar pc to compete with pro

 

[Aztechnology]

Youd be a fool to try and build a 400 dollar pc to compete with pro

In what gaming alone? This is where the conversation falls apart every damn time. It's not a console. It's not limited like a console. Ipso facto we can't dire toy compare them 1:1 in price. I mean the flat reality is we at least have to include a few years of PS+ if we're doing this shit right? So what's our budget instead then $550? $600? How long do you plan to keep your pro?

I'm losing my bleeping mind.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Youd be a fool to try and build a 400 dollar pc to compete with pro

The people who built the Potato Masher did exactly that and it doesn't seem very foolish...

 

[Huge Succeeded]

within first 45 seconds

"this video is not to pick on consoles, just to show what a budget pc can do"

and so clearly the reasonable response is to bitch about how they're picking on consoles

not to mention accusations of fake news, oh my god.

The people who built the Potato Masher did exactly that and it doesn't seem very foolish...

"Battlefield 1 at 4K - Upgraded Potato Masher vs. PS4 Pro" would have probably been a less frustrating title for some, I can admit

 

[pager99]

In what gaming alone? This is where the conversation falls apart every damn time. It's not a console. It's not limited like a console. Ipso facto we can't dire toy compare them 1:1 in price. I mean the flat reality is we at least have to include a few years of PS+ if we're doing this shit right? So what's our budget instead then $550? $600? How long do you plan to keep your pro?

I'm losing my bleeping mind.

I mean you can quote the plus subscription costs but theres savings in the console market too in the trade in and used games market and im not stupid I know a pc is different from consoles but this a thread about someone comparing them regardless

 

[Aztechnology]

I mean you can quote the plus subscription costs but theres savings in the console market too in the trade in and used games market and im not stupid I know a pc is different from consoles but this a thread about someone comparing them regardless

Think about the amount of people who go primarily digital now though. I totally get what you are saying, it's one of the reasons I still own a console. Games I don't really plan to play long term, I'll often buy on Pro and sell to recoup the cost. Which is great. But there's no doubt in my mind that's going away in time.

 

[Briarios]

In what gaming alone? This is where the conversation falls apart every damn time. It's not a console. It's not limited like a console. Ipso facto we can't dire toy compare them 1:1 in price. I mean the flat reality is we at least have to include a few years of PS+ if we're doing this shit right? So what's our budget instead then $550? $600? How long do you plan to keep your pro?

I'm losing my bleeping mind.

... the conversation is completely about gaming, if it weren't, there wouldn't be a comparison with a GAME console. If you're looking at other things you can do with a computer, get a Raspberry Pi.

You're losing you're mind because you're coming into a conversation and trying to change what it's about, and no one is buying.

 

[Aztechnology]

... the conversation is completely about gaming, if it weren't, there wouldn't be a comparison with a GAME console. If you're looking at other things you can do with a computer, get a Raspberry Pi.

You're losing you're mind because you're coming into a conversation and trying to change what it's about, and no one is buying.

That's not completely true. The modular nature amongst other things has to be considered. It is a contributing factor in what allowed him to do that with his PC.

Except not. I'm losing my mind because we can never have a rational conversation where PC is even next to the word consoles. It's impossible. I've been trying for years. People just bring their cognitive dissonance or extreme biases in full force. The greatest irony is all the crap about PC master race and yet in GAF it's the opposite. PC is some maligned entity for the majority.

 

[KOHIPEET]

https://www.pcx.hu/sapphire-rx480-4gb-gddr5-nitro-11260-02-20g-videokartya-642609

The 480 4Gb can be had for about $100 less. Still obviously not as cheap as U.S, but would give you pretty much the same performance.

I only had to do rudimentary research to find that. So I imagine you could probably even find better deals.

LOL. That's a bit above 246 dollars, not 100. You need 242 HUF to get 1 USD.

 

[Aztechnology]

LOL. That's a bit above 246 dollars, not 100. You need 242 HUF to get 1 USD.

I'm just going off what the exchange is telling me.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

Fuck this guy. He didn't actually spend $450. Other people have said he rigged the comparison, and I believe them. (And that in itself is making me feel a lot better, and less nauseous, after watching that horrifying video).

Stop lying and making up fake news to make the PlayStation 4 Pro look bad.

There is no better value deal in gaming right now than the PS4 Pro. And not only that, but it has the best games too. You also don't have to deal with drivers, cables, installation issues, hardware issues, or anything else. You just plug and play.

i agree. i love Sony Interactive Entertainment America LLC. buy a ps4 pro or you're not a real gamer

in fact, if you own a non-ps platform, you should go post on somewhere like reddit or gamefaqs

 

[Bl@de]

Stop lying and making up fake news to make the PlayStation 4 Pro look bad.

 

[ty_hot]

buys a 300+ GPU to justify the 'upgrade' while I could uprade my PS4 for a PRO for 100 euros + 2 games (literally any 2 used games).

 

[Sad Affleck]

Man people get butthurt that the ps4 pro is good value,at least thats what it seems to me

How do you determine if the PS4 Pro is good value?

 

[Aztechnology]

buys a 300+ GPU to justify the 'upgrade' while I could uprade my PS4 for a PRO for 100 euros + 2 games (literally any 2 used games).

It's not $300 in the U.S there's deals here for the 1060 6GB semi-frequently for around $200.

 

[KOHIPEET]

I'm just going off what the exchange is telling me.

Yeah I thought. Didn't mean to be rude.

Bottom line is, this potato masher might be competitive with the PS4 Pro in the US, but here in my country, it just isn't.

However, this video kind of proves you don't necessarily have to spend thousands of dollars to build a capable PC.

(I've tried to build the same pc -I couldn't find the case, and there is no specific info about type of memory and peripherals- still, without a monitor, the result is around 765 US dollars. This just show how ridiculously expensive consumer electronics are in the EU. Shame really.)

 

[icecold1983]

No, this is false. First of all, the budget they set themselves back when they priced the system was that of a used PS4 so the argument about picking used parts is meaningless. Second, the only part that was gifted to them was the case and they included its price in the budget anyway.

no it wasnt

 

[Sad Affleck]

no it wasnt

Yes, it was.

https://youtu.be/uZR-a35sxLg

(I've tried to build the same pc -I couldn't find the case, and there is no specific info about type of memory and peripherals- still, without a monitor, the result is around 765 US dollars. This just show how ridiculously expensive consumer electronics are in the EU. Shame really.)

You can build something similar if you buy used parts and a new card like they did. I live in europe and there are a lot of used core i5-based systems for sale at respectable prices. A GTX 1060 6GB is out of the question but a Euro Masher with a GTX 1060 3GB, RX480 4GB or RX470 4GB is doable.

 

[icecold1983]

Yes, it was.

https://youtu.be/uZR-a35sxLg

you could get used ps4s for 250 and sometimes less in early 2015

 

[Sad Affleck]

you could get used ps4s for 250 and sometimes less in early 2015

They built the Potato Masher in December 2014, I have no idea how much a used PS4 in decent condition was sold for then. It doesn't matter anyway, since the Potato Masher performs better than the PS4 in the vast majority of titles the value proposition of both platforms is, I think, very similar.