If we are to believe what was said in the video they showed at the conference, they spoke with the devs themselves to find out what they need to get to 4K. Now, if they took that feedback to heart, I think they should be able to do so. Will it be at Ultra or 60FPS? Probably not. At High or Medium settings @ 30FPS, probably.
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Devs can use Scorpio's 6 teraflops however they wish(wont force 4k), says Spencer
- Thread starter JayWood2010
- Start date
If we are to believe what was said in the video they showed at the conference, they spoke with the devs themselves to find out what they need to get to 4K. Now, if they took that feedback to heart, I think they should be able to do so. Will it be at Ultra or 60FPS? Probably not. At High or Medium settings @ 30FPS, probably.
Future PhaZe
Member
I expect many will try to maximize the value of their console by trading it in for a One S and then trading that in later for a scorpio. Much like the phone trade in games that go on today.
Blame MS.
It's basically like this:
So what's special about Scorpion? Why should we wait?
- Well, we designed it for TRUE 4K Xbox One gaming as standard, no compromises!
So, I won't get any benefit on a 1080p TV?
- Yeah, that's right.
Ah, that sucks.
- Oh wait, actually, devs can do whatever they want, they don't have to just use it for 4K!
But what about that standard 4K gaming you were talking about?
- ... ¯\_(ツ
_/¯The messaging is stuck between a rock and hard place in terms of wanting to clearly differentiate from Sony's upgrade with the 'standard 4K' mantra of most of the messaging on the one hand, without wanting to alienate 1080p users on the other hand.
I've said this, I think people are trying to be confused more than actually being confused. I look at it like...do I want a low-mid range video card or a mid-high range video card. Still play the same things, games still do the same ish...but the graphics will vary on which card you have. But no, neogaf.
RowdyReverb
Member
No, I'm pretty sure the sky is falling
My feelings exactly.
At a cheaper price. Right. And?
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
He is saying people without 4ktv, cannot see the benefit of the 4k video gaming, which this console is capable of delivering. It somehow got twisted that it wouldn't deliver more than that.
He's here saying that devs can use the extra horsepower for other stuffs, whether if its to dedicate all of them to run the game at better framerate and whats not. I am struggling to see what's so confusing here.
He's here saying that devs can use the extra horsepower for other stuffs, whether if its to dedicate all of them to run the game at better framerate and whats not. I am struggling to see what's so confusing here.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Pretty much this. I feel like there are some people who are forcing themselves to be confused here.
there's reading between the lines and being psychic.
you're claiming it's "obvious" to know someone is saying "it's the devs choice how they use the power" when he explicitly states that "only 4k TV owners will see a benefit and that if you own 1080 TV's you should just buy a one-s"
i'm a logical thinker, but i ain't no mind reader.
Blame MS.
It's basically like this:
So what's special about Scorpion? Why should we wait?
- Well, we designed it for TRUE 4K Xbox One gaming as standard, no compromises!
So, I won't get any benefit on a 1080p TV?
- Yeah, that's right.
Ah, that sucks.
- Oh wait, actually, devs can do whatever they want, they don't have to just use it for 4K!
But what about that standard 4K gaming you were talking about?
- ... ¯_(ツ
The messaging is stuck between a rock and hard place in terms of wanting to clearly differentiate from Sony's upgrade, without alienating 1080p users.
In your example, why isn't the discussion ending after they said
"- Oh wait, actually, devs can do whatever they want, they don't have to just use it for 4K! "
How come people are saying "but what about what you said before" instead "oh, you misspoke before, gotcha, so it's up to devs".
Doesn't that seem like a reasonable stance?
professor_t
Member
Blame MS.
It's basically like this:
So what's special about Scorpion? Why should we wait?
- Well, we designed it for TRUE 4K Xbox One gaming as standard, no compromises!
So, I won't get any benefit on a 1080p TV?
- Yeah, that's right.
Ah, that sucks.
- Oh wait, actually, devs can do whatever they want, they don't have to just use it for 4K!
But what about that standard 4K gaming you were talking about?
- ... ¯\_(ツ
The messaging is stuck between a rock and hard place in terms of wanting to clearly differentiate from Sony's upgrade, without alienating 1080p users.
I think this is their problem. If they completely abandon the Xbox One, gamers who just bought the system in the past 3 years will be pissed, and many of them comprise their customer base. Hence, the emphasis on 4k - as opposed to other, more complex improvements to graphical fidelity.
However, if they maintain compatibility with the Xbox One, they're leaving a lot of potential on the table with a 6 TF system, thereby stunting the growth of their shiny new console.
It's a rock and a hard place, and most of it still originates with the mistakes they made with the Xbox One.
Meaning 4K owners will see the benefit because Scorpio will be pushing 4K.
As an example of how this will likely be handled, look at how Apex works on pc. You can set an output resolution and have the rest of the settings adjust accordingly to what the device capabilities afford at that given resolution. This could be handled in the background on the console based on the output resolution set at the console level. Heck, devs don't even have to do that automatically, they could look at output res of console and have a different set of configurations for each. The automated method would allow for future hardware to adjust to the new power gracefully without patches though. Like Halo 5 will on Scorpio, at least to 1080p.
What about when he corrected himself?
I didn't mean it's obvious that someone that says "only 4k tv owners will benefit" means "it's up to devs to choose the right resolution".
I meant it's obvious he misspoke initially and backtracked. I'm just wondering what is so confusing now that we know he misspoke and admitted to backtracking.
Edited my post a bit.
GinoFelino
Member
Well, 'and', that doesn't jive well with your 'for people who want 4K now' argument.
If anything, I get the impression you're trying to wave away the notion of confusing communication/purpose.
People who want 4K now will also want the Scorpio next year. A pure 1080p bare-bones Xbox One S for cheap would've made more sense following your logic, right?
Yeah, except - correct me if I'm wrong - but chronologically his 4K heavy comments in the Eurogamer interview published today seemingly came after the comments in the video published on Monday. So it's a bit like he's suggesting different things in different interviews all within a short timeframe - it's not clear he's correcting himself rather than just sending contradictory messages depending on which end of the messaging problem he's addressing. I'm not sure he's putting one corrected thing on the record so much as putting different things on the record depending on what he feels the concerns of the question are (competitive differentiation vs dev flexibility). If there's confusion, it's his responsibility.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Blame MS.
It's basically like this:
So what's special about Scorpion? Why should we wait?
- Well, we designed it for TRUE 4K Xbox One gaming as standard, no compromises!
So, I won't get any benefit on a 1080p TV?
- Yeah, that's right.
Ah, that sucks.
- Oh wait, actually, devs can do whatever they want, they don't have to just use it for 4K!
But what about that standard 4K gaming you were talking about?
- ... ¯_(ツ
The messaging is stuck between a rock and hard place in terms of wanting to clearly differentiate from Sony's upgrade with the 'standard 4K' mantra of most of the messaging on the one hand, without wanting to alienate 1080p users on the other hand.
He'a referring to the 4k benefit (aka the main selling point of scorpio) when he say that, which is true. You wont benefit from the resolution bump if you are using just a full hd tv.
Backfoggen
Banned
Once E3 is over we're going to need a final statement about everything from MS. It's a total mess atm.
The problem is that the Eurogamer article (where he says that 4K = Scorpio and 1080p = XB1 S) seems to be newer than the Videogamer video discussed here.
At least the article was posted today and the video is from yesterday.
The solution is really simple, they just need to come out and say that Scorpio is aimed at enabling 4K gaming, but if the person choose to run it at a lower resolution he gets other benefits (like enhanced framerate, image quality, effects, etc)
Thebeardofknowledge
Banned
This corporate sucking up shit is just embarrassing
I bet you guys agreed with the original Xbox one plan to huh ?
SpartanN92
Banned
This 4K gaming push feels like a bad idea...FFS make a solid 1080p 60fps game with incredible effects, graphics, AI etc.
What I'm scared of is another Halo 5 situation where you see a lot sacrificed (Animation frame rate, Resolution, Graphics/Textures, Effects, AI) in order to hit a particular goal. In Halo 5's case it was 60fps. I feel like we will see the same thing out of Halo 6 only the goal becomes 4K AND 60fps.
What I'm scared of is another Halo 5 situation where you see a lot sacrificed (Animation frame rate, Resolution, Graphics/Textures, Effects, AI) in order to hit a particular goal. In Halo 5's case it was 60fps. I feel like we will see the same thing out of Halo 6 only the goal becomes 4K AND 60fps.
until his next interview, nothing is confusing. right now it's a developer choice...of course tomorrow it could just be aimed at 4k TV owners...so who knows. they need to sort out their messaging either way.
SneakyStephan
Banned
So which one is it?
Please buy the xbox one s
Please be excited for the xbox scorpio
Marketing trying to have their cake and eat it too
you're acting like the majority of devs would choose performance over eye candy, when - time and time again - they've done the opposite, choosing 1080p30 over 1080p60 with less eyecandy or 900p60. (most devs, that is. Not all of them) - they're so afraid of people yelling "parity" and "downgrade" that they'll rather have games run at unstable frame rates over people doing pixelcounting or looking at preview screenshots vs. release.
framerare doesn't sell games, because responsiveness and fluidness can only be felt playing a game, but doesn't transport well via screenshots or promo videos. And since demos are all but dead, we'll be getting so many 4k30 games, with maybe 1080p60 for multiplayer.
Always-honest
Banned
Well then, Mr. Spencer. I guess they'll be targetting 1080P at 60 fps with all bells and wistles then. Because fuck 4 K for now.
Abilidebob
Member
I don't get it. Does the concept of downsampling simply doesn't work for consoles?
FacelessSamurai
..but cry so much I wish I had some
NeoGAF being confused at a Microsoft product on purpose? Never happened before right...
GinoFelino
Member
Soooo, sucking up to the corporate teat simply because I do not see the outrage?
Do I prefer the games that come from MS? Sure. I like my Halp's and what not. As of right now though, I do not own any console and play exclusively on my PC. I don't really care one way or the other to be honest, I just do not see what is making people so upset "at this time". If the message is muddled a year from now and the Scorpio release is imminent, then by all means outrage away. Otherwise this all just seems like people looking to be outraged instead of actually being so.
SplitYourInfinities
Member
Thebeardofknowledge
Banned
Again Microsoft PR fuck up
Clearly said In the video controller wasn't included
Try again
MS being confused about their own product seems to happen regularly, which is the problem, suppose it's a good thing they have some time to figure it out and get their message straight though.
GHG
Gold Member
Your answer as to why that happened is in the post you linked.
Just like the answer as to why people are confused with Microsoft's messaging is also right in front of your face. But you are choosing to ignore it.
GinoFelino
Member
How was it on purpose?
I know it would be really idiot of them not including the controller, but it clearly said that in the video and we had nintendo launching the 3DS without the power adapter, so dumb things happen once in a while.
SplitYourInfinities
Member
In the video description it says (literally): "Includes the newly streamlined Xbox Wireless Controller". Of course the OP had to go with the line that said otherwise.
Liamario
Banned
They've announced the console so far ahead, that they don't even know what it is themselves.
They just announced too soon. They haven't set a lot of the features in stone. They don't know how devs are going to approach development on the console. The announcement was premature.
They just announced too soon. They haven't set a lot of the features in stone. They don't know how devs are going to approach development on the console. The announcement was premature.
People did grasp what it was until MS started contradicting themselves.
Thebeardofknowledge
Banned
Some of these posters are far smarter than they let on.
if you're taking that stance that we shouldn't comment "at this time" i'd argue they shouldn't have even announced it "at this time"
if they wanted a better reaction, they should have just said "we're focusing on Xbox one and S right now, we'll talk about scorpio at a later date" that's a viable response for something so far away from a company not wanting to shit on their existing products. either that or just be consistent. one or the other. spencer decided on option C. talk a lot with inconsistent messaging...that's worked out for them so well in the past.