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[omonimo]

That only applies to the GPU though so confers no advantage to the CPU making the claim that a 9% clock speed advantage has a 15% realworld advantage false unless he has a detail explination in some other area.



Not likely. GDDR5 does not have any inherant functional disadvantages compared to DDR3.

That's not true at all. GDDR5 it's a ram specilized for graphic, never seen a pc use GDDR5 for the cpu and what could imply. So should give some complication. I don't said it's impossible to turn around this.

 

[Hermii]

This also explains the low traffic.

Let's face it guys: the amount of traffic you see in this GTA remaster is the MOST you will EVER see in a GTA game on these platforms.

It's only downhill from now: this is a remaster. Yet the traffic isn't up to par with how we were expecting it.
The true next-gen GTA will be way more demanding, hence less traffic.

Curious about the PC version.

A next gen gta coming out years from now will be coded from the ground up for this tech and will be way the hell better optimized than any remaster. Also by that time the os footprint will hopefully have been reduced significantly so imo your conclusion is flawed.

 

[Qassim]

it runs at 30 FPS the majority of the time, quit being nitpicky. this is getting as bad as PC gamers with the nitpicking, i hate how this greater focus on tech has brought out the non gamers to scrutinize little details. Back in the ps1 and ps2 era we played games where characters looked like block people and they were some of the best games ever. Threads like this just need to be banned already.

Or.. you could ignore threads like these. Some people are interested in the tech of games, if you're not, that's great - stop polluting these threads.

 

[QaaQer]

Right, I understand that they wanted to go cheap and cool, but would it have been technically possible (without a LOT of extra work) for AMD to create an APU with a faster CPU and the same GPU as is currently used? Or was using Jaguar CPU's the best option without a year or so of extra work?

Its possible, amd has several other apus with desktop steamroller and pilerdriver cores.

 

[Ateron]

Right now I'm more annoyed at the sluggy controls and floaty aim. They need to tighten that deadzone, this game would be even better if they managed to sort that out.

The fps is not perfect, but it holds up pretty well most of the time (ps4 version here). This game is beautiful and there's a lot going on at all times, and still manages to run pretty well, minor exceptions aside. The ps4 is the better version but the x1 version is also good.

 

[Teletraan1]

Seriously not even joking the Genesis and snes cpu's were awesome for the time period.

The SNES cpu was a huge bottleneck compared to the Genesis CPU. Launch SNES games had all kinds of horrible frame rate issues. Sports games ran like molasses compared to their genesis counterparts. A lot of games had to include special processors in the cartridge by the end of that generation. Games built around these limitations did look amazing though. As dr. apocalipsis said it really was a 90s Jaguar core.

 

[brobban]

it runs at 30 FPS the majority of the time, quit being nitpicky. this is getting as bad as PC gamers with the nitpicking, i hate how this greater focus on tech has brought out the non gamers to scrutinize little details. Back in the ps1 and ps2 era we played games where characters looked like block people and they were some of the best games ever. Threads like this just need to be banned already.

It's a thread about the framerate comparison of a game on 2 different plattforms. If you're not interested, why even enter?
Once upon a time we were satisified with movies not having color and sound, but guess what, standards change.

"Non gamers", get of your high horse. Been playing games since early 80s, and for the last 15 years I've always had issues with games not holding the low standard of 30 fps. Hell, I couldn't even play Perfect Dark due to the shitty framerate.

 

[Marlenus]

That's not true at all. GDDR5 it's ram specilized for graphic, never seen a pc use GDDR5 for the cpu and what could imply. So should give some complication.

Ok GDDR5 costs more and the bandwidth offers no benefit for the majority of CPU tasks. Like I said there are no functional disadvantages to using GDDR5 vs DDR3.

 

[omonimo]

SNES cpu was like 1990s Jaguar core. PPU on the other hand...



That you have no clue of what are you talking about.



AMD just don't have the tech.

It's quite easy say such thing without explain anything eh. You trying to say an overheated cpu at 9% give so much relevant difference in the performance compared the whole hardware in both console? Lol, yeah Mr expert.

 

[Marlenus]

It's quite easy say such thing without explain anything eh.

These chips have built in thermal protections. If a CPU or GPU overheats it will reduce the clockspeed until the temperature is no longer too high. This is called throtlling

 

[XxRampage07xX]

This also explains the low traffic.

Let's face it guys: the amount of traffic you see in this GTA remaster is the MOST you will EVER see in a GTA game on these platforms.

It's only downhill from now: this is a remaster. Yet the traffic isn't up to par with how we were expecting it.
The true next-gen GTA will be way more demanding, hence less traffic.

Curious about the PC version.

I only believe it when I see it.

 

[ninjablade]

The performance video is designed to showcase the worst case scenarios, though. Having put hours into the game I can safely say that slowdown is barely an issue. The game holds a very steady frame-rate the vast majority of the time (on PS4 at least). It's doing some pretty impressive effects as well, though, which I wouldn't want to see cut as they add a tremendous amount to the visuals.


Don't forget the original version of ZOE2. An absolute travesty. The fact that HexaDrive came along and reworked the whole thing into something infinitely superior should show how important optimization really is.

that's all i needed to hear, thanks.

 

[omonimo]

These chips have built in thermal protections. If a CPU or GPU overheats it will reduce the clockspeed until the temperature is no longer too high. This is called throtlling

Well, I'm not refering to throtlling when I asked to him what meant.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

This is a stress test.

The developers deliberately are trying to cause more taxing events on screen so as to observe the frame rate.

AC:U on PS4 runs in the high teens and low 20s simply by playing the game as intended. It chugs even during very standard scenes.

AC:U is doing a hell of a lot more in-game too.. hence the lower framerate.

 

[Teletraan1]

This also explains the low traffic.

Let's face it guys: the amount of traffic you see in this GTA remaster is the MOST you will EVER see in a GTA game on these platforms.

It's only downhill from now: this is a remaster. Yet the traffic isn't up to par with how we were expecting it.
The true next-gen GTA will be way more demanding, hence less traffic.

Curious about the PC version.

Why do people want more traffic? It is a videogame, doing these missions with "realistic" traffic density would not be fun at all. Has anyone ever driven in a large city? It is not fun and you sure as shit aren't going to barreling around.

 

[omonimo]

You are, easily, the most uninformed, uninteresting and salty Sony fanboy in recent times on this forum.



This is an open game, so spikes of unpredictable loads happens. And Jaguar cores are pretty weak.

What all of you try to present as a single 9% CPU overclock on Xone, is more like ~15% increased performance, given the memory setup for both consoles.

But the most funniest thing of those 2 days, is all that people being pretty happy with PS4 version having more grass here and there, when it's pretty obvious that the game was defined around Xone limitations, so they probably left enough GPU budget unused on PS4 for improving drastically the antialiasing or lighting. Hilarious.

Talking of fanboy, I think it's bannable give me the fanboy. What a wonderful guy.Still curious to know how xone could gain 15% of more performance from the simple ovearheat of 9% because this is pure gold.

 

[Orayn]

While I would normally balk at anything on the new consoles going sub-30, GTA V on PS4 is such a huge improvement over PS3 that I'm finding it hard to complain. Bloodborne will probably have some drops too, so I'm going to avoid being too harsh now so I don't seem like a hypocrite later.

That said, I'm looking forward to seeing this on PC with even higher frame rates and hopefully some form of VR support.

 

[pixellated_man]

Having looked at the performance video from start to finish, it is clear the Xone version drops frames in more situations than the ps4 version. The drops on ps4 seem to be mostly confined to certain scenarios, namely heavy traffic scenes, where the Xone version dips as well but not quite as much. I suggest everyone have a look at the video before posting...will avoid uninformed posting and pointless back and forth arguments. On the whole both versions run well enough in my opinion, with the ps4 version being a little more consistent, and certainly a big improvement over last gen versions.

 

[Marlenus]

Well, I'm not refering to throtlling when I asked to him what meant.

What else could you be refering to based on what you quoted? That silicone increases in resistivity as temperature increases? That does not really affect performance unless you exceed safe operating limits and that is when throttling kicks in.

 

[Krakatoa]

Do we know if the tests on the Xbox was performed using an external drive?

 

[Marlenus]

Talking of fanboy, did you have edited your post with the insult stuff, before I could seen it, eh? I think it's bannable. What a wonderful guy.Still curious to know how xone could gain 15% of more performance from the simple ovearheat of 9% because this is pure gold.

It is an overclock, but not really as they would have re-binned the chips for the new speed grade.

An overclock is taking a 3.0 ghz cpu and running it at 4+ like is common with Intel CPUs.

 

[Metfanant]

too many multiquotes so ill just run with it...

- So we're dealing with a game that runs pretty damn solidly for the most part on both consoles, each seemingly has specific areas where they outperform the other...

does it say in the article (cant get to DF here at work, its blocked) if they took any sort of global "average" framerate?? Obviously there would be some discrepancy as you will never get perfectly like for like scenes in an open world game. But i would imagine after playing a game like this on each console for 5, 10, 15 hours gathering footage and data and TRYING to stress the engine you would get enough to get a pretty good average number...id be interested to see which is higher.

it SEEMS to me that the PS4 version looks like it might have the overall better framerate when looking at things from a global perspective though...

- I'm not buying that either version is really CPU bound, as it seems more like some optimization would smooth them both out, but i think something can obviously be said for the additional clock speed of the Xbone CPU...

- PS4 looks better, performance is probably a wash...sounds about right...

could Sony upclock? id imagine they could, but i dont think they will. Cerny seems to have engineered the console with GPGPU in mind, and Sony really expects developers to start to leverage that additional GPU power not just for rendering, but for the offloading of CPU tasks. It will be interesting in the future to see how devs balance that. How much of the PS4's GPU advantage do they dedicate to rendering, and how much to CPU tasks...

i think, like El Torro said, its more likely that Sony free up a CPU core for games through OS optimization than giving us an upclock on the CPU...(hey Sony, im sure the developers wouldnt mind another gig of that RAM back as well!)

But the most funniest thing of those 2 days, is all that people being pretty happy with PS4 version having more grass here and there, when it's pretty obvious that the game was defined around Xone limitations, so they probably left enough GPU budget unused on PS4 for improving drastically the antialiasing or lighting. Hilarious.

or in the case of this game, any GPU budget could have/should have been used for offloading CPU tasks and using GPGPU as the PS4 was designed...though Cerny himself said those types of techniques would come later on in the consoles lifecycle...

 

[-griffy-]

AC:U is doing a hell of a lot more in-game too.. hence the lower framerate.

And GTAV doesn't even drop to nearly the extent AC:U does and is also doing a considerable amount in game as well by any objective measure.

AC:U and GTAV are not even remotely the first games to drop below 30 on these consoles, by the way.

 

[omonimo]

What else could you be refering to based on what you quoted? That silicone increases in resistivity as temperature increases? That does not really affect performance unless you exceed safe operating limits and that is when throttling kicks in.

Well, I ask him what it has to do to what I have said in the post before, not what mean tech wise because I haven't understood the link with the matter of my post.

 

[Piggus]

This also explains the low traffic.

Let's face it guys: the amount of traffic you see in this GTA remaster is the MOST you will EVER see in a GTA game on these platforms.


Curious about the PC version.

That's a bold claim considering GTAV had much better traffic density than GTAIV.

Either way, the traffic really isn't that bad. It's a lot better than in the previous gen version. At a certain point you have to take gameplay into consideration when dealing with traffic density.

 

[Milestoned]

TIL that people can't accept 2-3 dropped frames every 20 minutes or so (based on my gameplay experience) in an open world game where you can almost everything.

I guess those people are playing racing games only because every other genre will drop some frames then and now.

 

[Orayn]

or in the case of this game, any GPU budget could have/should have been used for offloading CPU tasks and using GPGPU as the PS4 was designed...though Cerny himself said those types of techniques would come later on in the consoles lifecycle...

Despite being called "general purpose," GPGPU isn't a super flexible thing that you can turn to whenever you're CPU-bound. Devs may get more creative with it in the future, but a lot of the time it's simply not going to be an option.

 

[Summer Haze]

I'm glad the PS4 version stays solid during shoot-outs. That's one thing I hated on the PS3 version. It was such a pain in the ass to aim because of the judder.

 

[NullPointer]

it runs at 30 FPS the majority of the time, quit being nitpicky. this is getting as bad as PC gamers with the nitpicking, i hate how this greater focus on tech has brought out the non gamers to scrutinize little details. Back in the ps1 and ps2 era we played games where characters looked like block people and they were some of the best games ever. Threads like this just need to be banned already.

Not when you're driving through downtown, which isn't a rare occurrence at all.

Good to see it finally being mentioned by Digital Foundry. Its a real bummer to see Rockstar can't keep to a solid framerate even under normal driving conditions downtown, even with a remastered last gen game.

 

[brobban]

TIL that people can't accept 2-3 dropped frames every 20 minutes or so (based on my gameplay experience) in an open world game where you can almost everything.

I guess those people are playing racing games only because every other genre will drop some frames then and now.

It's much more often than that. Been playing for about 4 hours, mainly in the city. And there are framedrops quite often when speeding through it. People are more or less sensitive to things like this, and for some (me), It's annoying.

 

[ttech10]

Why do people want more traffic? It is a videogame, doing these missions with "realistic" traffic density would not be fun at all. Has anyone ever driven in a large city? It is not fun and you sure as shit aren't going to barreling around.

Tthe first thing I did on GTA:IV was edit the popcycle.dat file to have more vehicles (and peds), even though that game had a traffic density slider. Default max was still too low for my liking. Yes there were traffic jams in certain areas, but for me that made the game more fun.

I haven't gotten my hands on this new GTA yet, but I imagine I'll be left wanting more vehicles.

 

[rjcc]

I wonder if the frame drops are affected by caching. I had them driving through downtown the first day I played it, but now, with not a ton more playtime, I haven't seen it chugging.

 

[Windom Earle]

AC:U is doing a hell of a lot more in-game too.. hence the lower framerate.

lol, I hope you are not serious. AC is doing copy/pasted NPCs and that's about it.

 

[Fox_Mulder]

can't wait to read next update

 

[nelchaar]

They both drop below 30fps. They're both crap.

 

[NullPointer]

Yes there were traffic jams in certain areas, but for me that made the game more fun.

We have very different ideas of fun ;p

 

[Summer Haze]

They both drop below 30fps. They're both crap.

No.

 

[cyberheater]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that maybe both consoles are a bit underpowered. Which is a shame.

Do you think devs are still coming to grips with the hardware/development environment/tool chain/SDK etc... ?

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

So all that balance and no bottleneck talk from last year was all for nothing because they put a junkpile cpu in the box.

 

[Curufinwe]

It's not DF, it's Leadbetter.

That distinction is worth pointing out. Thanks for doing so.

 

[dr. apocalipsis]

or in the case of this game, any GPU budget could have/should have been used for offloading CPU tasks and using GPGPU as the PS4 was designed...though Cerny himself said those types of techniques would come later on in the consoles lifecycle...

GPGPU isn't a magic pill that will cure all diseases. That would require a major rewrite on the GTA engine for a port that already hits 30 safely.

Improved AA was much easier for them to implement given the GPU's differences. This is a case of parity, such as old PS360 times, and not AC:U.

 

[Orayn]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that maybe both consoles are a bit underpowered. Which is a shame.

Do you think devs are still coming to grips with the hardware/development environment/tool chain/SDK etc... ?

I think devs are familiar enough with the tools at this point, though there's still room for SDK updates that allow them to eke out a bit more performance.

 

[Milestoned]

It's much more often than that. Been playing for about 4 hours, mainly in the city. And there are framedrops quite often when speeding through it. People are more or less sensitive to things like this, and for some (me), It's annoying.

Which platform? I've got the PS4 version and I'm usually quite sensitive for frame drops, but this remaster is FAR from the mess we got on PS360. I can easily ignore those, in my case, infrequent drops.

 

[Windom Earle]

I really wonder if they will bother looking at the ocean.

As for the framerate issues... It sucks. PS4 is rock solid despite racing through the city which sucks for me. This is the one area that annoyed me the most in the last gen versions. On the other hand, drops in action scenes and overall more drops is pretty much equally bad. Can't wait for the PC version!

 

[Marlenus]

Before to ask if it was possible, should be ask to you how could been possible? I'm not an expert but I don't think it's that easy realize a new faster cpu without overheating problem, especially with such little dimensions.

It would have been quite easy from an engineering perspective, it would have required a beefier cooler because it would have used more power but that is not an issue. The reason they did not go for that was added cost.

 

[shandy706]

It's quite easy say such thing without explain anything eh. You trying to say an overheated cpu at 9% give so much relevant difference in the performance compared the whole hardware in both console? Lol, yeah Mr expert.

That you have no clue of what are you talking about.

You are, easily, the most uninformed, uninteresting and salty Sony fanboy in recent times on this forum.

This is an open game, so spikes of unpredictable loads happens. And Jaguar cores are pretty weak.

Talking of fanboy, I think it's bannable give me the fanboy. What a wonderful guy.Still curious to know how xone could gain 15% of more performance from the simple ovearheat of 9% because this is pure gold.

or..

 

[Marlenus]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that maybe both consoles are a bit underpowered. Which is a shame.

Do you think devs are still coming to grips with the hardware/development environment/tool chain/SDK etc... ?

More that porting code from the previous gen to current gen is not a straightforward task. They run totally different base architectures.

 

[gofreak]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that maybe both consoles are a bit underpowered. Which is a shame.

Do you think devs are still coming to grips with the hardware/development environment/tool chain/SDK etc... ?

It's a port-over, in the first year of the generation.

In other words...yes, to your last question

Or to put it another way, I'm sure GTAVI in 2 or 3 years will blow this out of the water, on the same consoles.

 

[Tom Penny]

This is a rare instance were they should have gone 900p for a solid 30 FPS.

 

[Kezen]

it runs at 30 FPS the majority of the time, quit being nitpicky. this is getting as bad as PC gamers with the nitpicking, i hate how this greater focus on tech has brought out the non gamers to scrutinize little details. Back in the ps1 and ps2 era we played games where characters looked like block people and they were some of the best games ever. Threads like this just need to be banned already.

You are in a tech thread, it's no wonder people tend to be very "nitpicky". People are understandably not much concerned about how good games are but how well do they run/look, there are other threads where the gameplay is discussed.