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[Superfrog]

And yet the majority of PS4 fans always argued that it was subjective.

I find it funny that almost everyone says how much of an improvement the new controller is (and I'll note that I think it looks damned awesome) but these were the same people saying that the PS3 controller was as good as the 360 controller, just different.

The point is that the PS3 controller has been in desperate need of improvement whereas the 360 controller has already been close to perfect (d-pad aside).

 

[Raist]

And yet the majority of PS4 fans always argued that it was subjective.

I find it funny that almost everyone says how much of an improvement the new controller is (and I'll note that I think it looks damned awesome) but these were the same people saying that the PS3 controller was as good as the 360 controller, just different.

Talks revolving around this kind of comparison were mostly about the (a)symetrical analogue sticks, and most people are generally fine about the DS3's, and that didn't change for PS4.. A lot of people however weren't happy about the DS3's triggers and that's been improved.

 

[borghe]

And yet the majority of PS4 fans always argued that it was subjective.

I find it funny that almost everyone says how much of an improvement the new controller is (and I'll note that I think it looks damned awesome) but these were the same people saying that the PS3 controller was as good as the 360 controller, just different.

Not entirely true. There have been quite a few "not a big DS3 fan but DS4 feels really comfortable" statements both in the press and from posters.

 

[FranXico]

And yet the majority of PS4 fans always argued that it was subjective.

I find it funny that almost everyone says how much of an improvement the new controller is (and I'll note that I think it looks damned awesome) but these were the same people saying that the PS3 controller was as good as the 360 controller, just different.

Most arguments arise due to misguided XBox fans who claim that sticks should be asymmetric.

In case you didn't notice, the DS4 still has symmetric analogue sticks. The elongated grips just give the impression that both sticks "have moved up".

 

[mujun]

Talks revolving around this kind of comparison were mostly about the (a)symetrical analogue sticks, and most people are generally fine about the DS3's, and that didn't change for PS4.. A lot of people however weren't happy about the DS3's triggers and that's been improved.

There is a lot of talk about the improved shape and how it is heavier, also. Two things I always thought sucked about the PS3 controller despite many fans of it saying those two points were fine. Yet, now, people are praising the new shape and weightier feel.

Sure it is subjective. Just makes it clear that there was a segment of people (fairly large too, if you ask me) who were hiding brand loyalty behind "it's subjective" arguments.

 

[Biker19]

I just can't believe that MS squandered its good will with gamers so completely. Rarely is a match-up so unbalanced. Even the X360/PS3 match up wasn't this unbalanced.

And worse, they worked so hard for that good will with the Xbox 360 after coming from a crushing defeat from the original Xbox, & now they're squandering it with their upcoming platform.

 

[ZackieChan]

There is a lot of talk about the improved shape and how it is heavier, also. Two things I always thought sucked about the PS3 controller despite many fans of it saying those two points were fine. Yet, now, people are praising the new shape and weightier feel.

Sure it is subjective. Just makes it clear that there was a segment of people (fairly large too, if you ask me) who were hiding brand loyalty behind "it's subjective" arguments.

Something that was fine before can be made better? How is that hard to grasp?

 

[Parch]

Excellent points, all of them.

They are spot on. Microsoft shot themselves in the foot, and even though they got it patched up, they'll have a limp for the rest of this gen. That's the price they have to pay.

I still think it's very much a viable 2nd console down the road, but I'm not jumping on board right away when the PS4 is doing all the right things right now. XB1 is not useless, it's just not the favorable choice right now.

 

[Possum]

The articles pretty clearly elaborate on the front cover's sentiment. They do stick to their guns.

To go through their reasoning and some of the more cutting comments:

- PS4 focusses on players, that it is cheaper is 'merely one of its various advantages'
- Success isn't merely about price, but unfortunately for Microsoft PS4 is more powerful, and more developer friendly and has far better brand perception
- Microsoft's brand perception after the DRM reversal may no longer be 'down the toilet' but is still 'dangling somewhere around the rim'.
- Sony is willing to let indies self publish and release on PC and that, along with Sony's 17-strong WWS, leads Edge to believe that 'leaves little doubt as to which of the platform holders will offer the broadest range of games, at least early on'.
- Edge believes Microsoft has 'alienated the most vibrant development community in the modern era' and that their approach to indies is akin to them not courting EA or Epic last generation.
- Edge thinks their policies may see hundreds of game losses to PS4 over time
- After weeks of mixed messages Microsoft is 'a difficult company to trust'.
- Xbox One is the latest in a line of Microsoft experiments that consumers have rejected for similar reasons - a line that arrived too late with features that were too early for the market. Microsoft 'has constantly misjudged consumers' expectations', their new box 'equally confused'.
- Microsoft has 16 exclusive titles but are "trapped in the shadows of a mythical magic box that 'solves a hundred problems you never cared about solving in the first place".
- "In turning things around, Microsoft faces the kind of challenge that once drove the mighty Sega out of the hardware business"

Excellent points. I'll admit, some of Xbox One's exclusives have me wanting to take the plunge, but I just go back and watch some Second Son gameplay, then I don't feel so bad.

 

[amr]

I think the 360 controller is the best controller ever made, and I think the DualShock 3 is one of the worst. I have no problem with the DS3's size or shape or its symmetrical sticks. What bothers me is the looseness of those sticks and their mushroomish tops. And of course the triggers, but they've been condemned to death.

The DualShock 4 looks like a great improvement.

 

[Steroyd]

There is a lot of talk about the improved shape and how it is heavier, also. Two things I always thought sucked about the PS3 controller despite many fans of it saying those two points were fine. Yet, now, people are praising the new shape and weightier feel.

Sure it is subjective. Just makes it clear that there was a segment of people (fairly large too, if you ask me) who were hiding brand loyalty behind "it's subjective" arguments.

What you thought sucked I thought was fine, and it sounds like Sony improved on that.

Only time I've felt like I've had an issue with the controller was when i played Fifa 13, and only that game funnily enough.

 

[thefit]

Controller fetishism is one of the weakest arguments that has ever come out of console fan boys. Your going to argue over and over in a circle about were a stick is positioned and tell me that's why you would take one console over the other? Historically it makes no sense consoles have been releasing with what people believe were unconventional controller schemes from the previous generation (look and Nintendo) and consumers have always managed to adapt and enjoy their games and systems. Never in modern gaming has it been shown that a system was better or a failure because a stick was on top rather than on the bottom.

One of the dumbest current trending GAF opinions in my opinion.

 

[perineumlick]

They are spot on. Microsoft shot themselves in the foot, and even though they got it patched up, they'll have a limp for the rest of this gen. That's the price they have to pay.

I still think it's very much a viable 2nd console down the road, but I'm not jumping on board right away when the PS4 is doing all the right things right now. XB1 is not useless, it's just not the favorable choice right now.

That's the way I feel right now. I owned both this gen, but as of now I'm in wait and see mode with the X1. They'll have to prove to me that the X1 is worth the investment, just like Sony had to prove itself with the high price of the PS3.

 

[freefornow]

The articles pretty clearly elaborate on the front cover's sentiment. They do stick to their guns.

To go through their reasoning and some of the more cutting comments:

- PS4 focusses on players, that it is cheaper is 'merely one of its various advantages'
- Success isn't merely about price, but unfortunately for Microsoft PS4 is more powerful, and more developer friendly and has far better brand perception

Are developers complaining about the complexities of developing for XB1? Hmmm, can't seem to find any articles mentioning this.

- Microsoft's brand perception after the DRM reversal may no longer be 'down the toilet' but is still 'dangling somewhere around the rim'.
- Sony is willing to let indies self publish and release on PC and that, along with Sony's 17-strong WWS, leads Edge to believe that 'leaves little doubt as to which of the platform holders will offer the broadest range of games, at least early on'.

Ahh, the ol'"leads us to believe" and then an escape clause at the end "at least early on"

- Edge believes Microsoft has 'alienated the most vibrant development community in the modern era' and that their approach to indies is akin to them not courting EA or Epic last generation.

Well, if Edge believes it, must be true then. Yes indies are vibrant. How's Motorbike doing?

- Edge thinks their policies may see hundreds of game losses to PS4 over time

Ahh, Edge thinks. Well thats definitive proof if ever I saw it.

- After weeks of mixed messages Microsoft is 'a difficult company to trust'.

Who trusts companies??? Yeah, I trusted Sony when they said PS3 would be backward compatible. And to their word, they stuck with that position for the whole life of the console.

- Xbox One is the latest in a line of Microsoft experiments that consumers have rejected for similar reasons - a line that arrived too late with features that were too early for the market. Microsoft 'has constantly misjudged consumers' expectations', their new box 'equally confused'.

Lol!! Guess we will know about "rejection" when the actual console is launched. Unless of course Edge has a time machine, then I will cheerfully withdraw this statement.

- Microsoft has 16 exclusive titles but are "trapped in the shadows of a mythical magic box that 'solves a hundred problems you never cared about solving in the first place".

Uhhhmmm, what??? Is Edge just putting words together now? Can someone please tell me what this actually means? I get the 16 exclusive titles bit, but the rest?

- "In turning things around, Microsoft faces the kind of challenge that once drove the mighty Sega out of the hardware business"

Wow. And i thought Edge couldn't draw any longer bows.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Unless Sony is moving the left analog, then it doesn't matter.

I always scoff when people use this weak excuse.

Not only have we lived in eras that didn't have analog sticks and sticks with different placements - We also lived in eras with analogs and sticks with different placements or just plain bad controllers.

Did we come out or talk openly 15 years ago about how we wish controllers could be like the PS3 or 360 pad? No. Nor did it stop anyone here from enjoying Chrono Trigger, Excitebike on the NES, or 2xtreme on the then analog-less PS1 at launch.

No one came out crippled and needed therapy after every era of gaming so I would appreciate it if this excuse was not brought up because it's weak. Games can and will be enjoyed with whatever controller fits. The DS4 is no less competent than any other controller I've ever seen. Let's move along because it's not worth shielding yourself with the pre-damage control "in my opinion".

No one I've ever know refused to play or buy a console because of a controller. If the console was good and he/she wanted it then it was bought.

Time to grow out of that reasoning.

It seems like you have interest enough in both platforms coming up but my opinion stands. It's not really some attack on you but I lost count of how many times this analog stick placement discussion has happened.

 

[neojubei]

I just can't believe that MS squandered its good will with gamers so completely. Rarely is a match-up so unbalanced. Even the X360/PS3 match up wasn't this unbalanced.

It's called arrogance. Sony had it when it introduce the ps3 at 599. Microsoft and Sony both thought because their last system was a success everyone would automatically buy whatever they are selling at whatever the price.

 

[perineumlick]

Are developers complaining about the complexities of developing for XB1? Hmmm, can't seem to find any articles mentioning this.

Ahh, the ol'"leads us to believe" and then an escape clause at the end "at least early on"

Well, if Edge believes it, must be true then. Yes indies are vibrant. How's Motorbike doing?

Ahh, Edge thinks. Well thats definitive proof if ever I saw it.

Who trusts companies??? Yeah, I trusted Sony when they said PS3 would be backward compatible. And to their word, they stuck with that position for the whole life of the console.

Lol!! Guess we will know about "rejection" when the actual console is launched. Unless of course Edge has a time machine, then I will cheerfully withdraw this statement.

Uhhhmmm, what??? Is Edge just putting words together now? Can someone please tell me what this actually means? I get the 16 exclusive titles bit, but the rest?

Wow. And i thought Edge couldn't draw any longer bows.

Wow, you sure are salty about an opinion piece.

 

[seventynine]

Edge says that in order for an indie to get on Xbox One you need an approved pub and guaranteed (timed or otherwise) exclusivity to the platform, while Sony will let you release simultaneously or even earlier on PC (and self-publish, obviously).

I just can't believe this. Idiots!

I do hope Microsoft get schooled this coming gen. I do like owning multiple platforms but I can't support this.

 

[Zeth]

*tag quote*

Xbone controller isn't much of an upgrade over the 360,just a few adjustments here and there with the addition of hepatic feedback in the triggers. DS4 is a huge upgrade over the DS3, and yes both the right and left analogs have moved, laterally that is.

Hey now you can't buy in to the marketing for one and not the other! Xbox claims over 100 adjustments and upgrades IIRC; that it's a whole new beast.

 

[BigDug13]

Are developers complaining about the complexities of developing for XB1? Hmmm, can't seem to find any articles mentioning this.

Ahh, the ol'"leads us to believe" and then an escape clause at the end "at least early on"

Well, if Edge believes it, must be true then. Yes indies are vibrant. How's Motorbike doing?

Ahh, Edge thinks. Well thats definitive proof if ever I saw it.

Who trusts companies??? Yeah, I trusted Sony when they said PS3 would be backward compatible. And to their word, they stuck with that position for the whole life of the console.

Lol!! Guess we will know about "rejection" when the actual console is launched. Unless of course Edge has a time machine, then I will cheerfully withdraw this statement.

Uhhhmmm, what??? Is Edge just putting words together now? Can someone please tell me what this actually means? I get the 16 exclusive titles bit, but the rest?

Wow. And i thought Edge couldn't draw any longer bows.

This is some salty shit pointed at someone's summary of an article that you didn't even read.

 

[Takuya]

Hey now you can't buy in to the marketing for one and not the other! Xbox claims over 100 adjustments and upgrades IIRC; that it's a whole new beast.

I had hands-on time with both controllers at E3.

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

Doctor said too much salt was bad for me, but I can't turn away from this thread.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

The articles pretty clearly elaborate on the front cover's sentiment. They do stick to their guns.

To go through their reasoning and some of the more cutting comments:

- PS4 focusses on players, that it is cheaper is 'merely one of its various advantages'
- Success isn't merely about price, but unfortunately for Microsoft PS4 is more powerful, and more developer friendly and has far better brand perception
- Microsoft's brand perception after the DRM reversal may no longer be 'down the toilet' but is still 'dangling somewhere around the rim'.
- Sony is willing to let indies self publish and release on PC and that, along with Sony's 17-strong WWS, leads Edge to believe that 'leaves little doubt as to which of the platform holders will offer the broadest range of games, at least early on'.
- Edge believes Microsoft has 'alienated the most vibrant development community in the modern era' and that their approach to indies is akin to them not courting EA or Epic last generation.
- Edge thinks their policies may see hundreds of game losses to PS4 over time
- After weeks of mixed messages Microsoft is 'a difficult company to trust'.
- Xbox One is the latest in a line of Microsoft experiments that consumers have rejected for similar reasons - a line that arrived too late with features that were too early for the market. Microsoft 'has constantly misjudged consumers' expectations', their new box 'equally confused'.
- Microsoft has 16 exclusive titles but are "trapped in the shadows of a mythical magic box that 'solves a hundred problems you never cared about solving in the first place".
- "In turning things around, Microsoft faces the kind of challenge that once drove the mighty Sega out of the hardware business"

Huh, that's a lot more reasonable and in depth than the ridiculously sensationalist headline suggested it would be. Also seems that this might be a return to their prime of writing great and well thought out features.

Might have to buy this months issue.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I had hands-on time with both controllers at E3.

They both look fantastic to me. What did you think Takuya?

 

[CLEEK]

This is some salty shit pointed at someone's summary of an article that you didn't even read.

It's incredible. He took personal offence to a well written summary of an Edge editorial.

In format wars, the first causality is common sense.

 

[Takuya]

They both look fantastic to me. What did you think Takuya?

They both look fine, lol. The Xbone's is sleek and has that unified trigger area now, whilst the DS4 is pretty much a big departure from the traditional Dualshock aside from the vaguely similar formfactor.

 

[bishoptl]

This is some salty shit pointed at someone's summary of an article that you didn't even read.

Doctor said too much salt was bad for me, but I can't turn away from this thread.

 

[thefit]

Huh, that's a lot more reasonable and in depth than the ridiculously sensationalist headline suggested it would be. Also seems that this might be a return to their prime of writing great and well thought out features.

Might have to buy this months issue.

Congrats that's sensationalist headline did its job all according to keikaku!

 

[benny_a]

So based on the summary that gofreak posted, EDGE hasn't really departed from what many people on GAF arrived at. Which makes the cover seem fine.

If anything they are playing it safe after claiming after E3 that Sony would also screw the customer with anti-consumer policies, which was an actual controversial opinion/rumor they ran.

 

[Magic Mushroom]

It's a good issue. Edge doesn't just tear MS apart, they are highly critical of many other games shown at E3 as well. Just read the Thief piece for example.

There's praise as well of course, for titles like Bayonetta 2, SCEJ's Puppeteer and Rain double whammy, for The Division and others.

And they have a little piece on Majora's Mask's Termina, so that's another good reason to grab it.

The making of Bood Dragon is a good laugh as well. Hopefully we'll see some of the cut stuff in a sequel.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Congrats that's sensationalist headline did its job all according to keikaku!

What are you saying here exactly? Is this some meme I'm unaware of?

 

[Kaako]

Thanks gofreak for the summary. All valid points imo.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Edge says that in order for an indie to get on Xbox One you need an approved pub and guaranteed (timed or otherwise) exclusivity to the platform, while Sony will let you release simultaneously or even earlier on PC (and self-publish, obviously).

It's truly mind-boggling that they haven't updated those outdated policies yet. However, it's very likely that they are going to support self-publishing eventually, maybe even before the launch. From the Eurogamer interview with Phil Spencer:

Eurogamer: I want to ask about indie games and why you decided not to enable self-publishing when so many of your competitors and other places do?

Phil Spencer: Today what we've said is we don't have a self-publishing system in place. But what we do look at: we support the indie development community, we've had over 200 developers ship over 400 games on our platform; over a billion dollars in revenue for independent developers selling content through our ecosystem. From the beginning of Xbox Live we have been committed to indie games, and we will continue to do that. Things like self-publishing, things like discovery of content, things like promotion - these are things that we are committed to, and our platform will evolve.

If you could boot your Xbox 360 seven years ago when it launched, when you first bought it and you looked at the experience we had, and over the years how we added functionality... We understand the desires of certain developers out there. We want all the developers to work on our platform. We want to make a commitment to the plans we have in place and what we're launching and that's what we're doing today.

Making sure content shows up on our platform, you understand what content people are playing. So you see trending; you have search to search for any piece of content to make sure that any pieces of content that hit Xbox One are actually discoverable and easily purchasable; and then part of your library that roams with you wherever you go - that's an important step. And that's what we're committed to at launch. We want to make sure we're making the right commitments at the right time. Our ears are open on self-publishing and other changes and advancements in our publishing ecosystem, but I don't want to stand up and commit to things that aren't plan of record now. That would be wrong.

Eurogamer: So, to be clear, you're open to the possibility of self-publishing in the future? Things may change?

Phil Spencer: Absolutely.

Also, concerning the Windows Store apps rumors:

Eurogamer: I'm hearing a lot from indie developers that they'd hoped Microsoft would implement self-publishing for Xbox One because at the moment they need a publisher and that can be difficult for some studios.

Phil Spencer: The diversity of content that was available on Xbox 360... I mentioned Limbo and you can go back to Braid and you can look at a tonne of content: Trials HD, Castle Crashers. I'm really liking Charlie Murder; that's a two-person studio, a husband and wife, I don't know if you get much smaller and indie than that - and now they're part of Summer of Arcade. Making sure that we have content from all kinds of creators showing up on our platform is the long-term commitment from us.

I'll also say that we look at what goes on in the Windows space. There's a collection of our ecosystem that can be helpful to people over time when you think about all the devices where Xbox Live is available. Over time, as we continue to evolve our platform and our support of developers, it's a real possibility for us to open up a very wide surface area for these developers to think about.

 

[Takuya]

What are you saying here exactly? Is this some meme I'm unaware of?

.

 

[Suikoguy]

They are also open to the possibility of adding back DRM too.

That entire part of the interview you quoted says nothing.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

.

Oh, so it's a meme. Thanks.

Anyway, it's great to see EDGE return to writing good features. I hope this isn't a one time deal...

 

[Whiteshirt]

You can say a lot but if you don't actually fucking do it, then what's the point? I know you're on double time defending Microsoft here but come on even you must understand this.

 

[benny_a]

Oh, so it's a meme. Thanks.

Anyway, it's great to see EDGE return to writing good features. I hope this isn't a one time deal...

What's so great about it? Have you read the features?

The summary at least is what thousands of readers on GAF have arrived at independently.
The only thing I haven't seen before are the parallels to Sega.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

What's so great about it? Have you read the features?

The summary at least is what thousands of readers on GAF have arrived at independently.
The only thing I haven't seen before are the parallels to Sega.

Not yet, the bits and pieces posted suggest it's a good and well written feature, unlike the majority since the redesign.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

The only problem is it doesn't, not anymore. I'm sure you'll notice that in various threads a significant number of people are now talking about actually picking up Xbox One, many at launch. It has plenty of interesting games coming, the policies that drove many away aren't in place anymore, and the inclusion of Kinect and the comparatively higher price evidently aren't terrible problems for a lot of folks.

I have noticed that a small number of very vocal posters, in numerous threads, state their intentions to go XB1 for the next generation over and over again, but I haven't noticed a large shift of numerous posters in favour of the XB1.

Funnily enough, most of the people that vehemently state their opinions to buy an Xbox One held the same position, and stated it loudly, even before the reversal. You included.

 

[thefit]

What's so great about it? Have you read the features?

The summary at least is what thousands of readers on GAF have arrived at independently.
The only thing I haven't seen before are the parallels to Sega.

The Sega comparison has been made at least here on GAF however tech/game media has stayed away from the comparison because it is very hyperbolic, what went into Sega's hardware demice was much more complex and over several gaming gens that what is happening with MS. Its not comparable at all.

 

[Amir0x]

Anyway, at the end of this, people can say what they want about EDGE, but the central truth behind all this is that Microsoft made their bed and now they're lying on it. If anyone else was to blame but them for this situation, I'd maybe feel a little bad, but everything was on their shoulders, they pushed this DRM situation, they subverted many of the best qualities of 360 at the feet of an anti-consumer blood bath paradise, and now they think everyone is supposed to neatly forget about it when they took a few step backs after they realized people weren't going to take that shit. And after that chip away at their confidence for a little longer, maybe $$ their way to a few really important exclusives to blind people from what is behind the curtain, and then when the time is right, use some of the money people spent on their products to re-invest in a anti-consumer nightmare machine once more.

Or maybe they won't. But they can't blame anyone but themselves for being in a position to be the least desirable platform.

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

Anyway, at the end of this, people can say what they want about EDGE, but the central truth behind all this is that Microsoft made their bed and now they're lying on it. If anyone else was to blame but them for this situation, I'd maybe feel a little bad, but everything was on their shoulders, they pushed this DRM situation, they subverted many of the best qualities of 360 at the feet of an anti-consumer blood bath paradise, and now they think everyone is supposed to neatly forget about it when they took a few step backs after they realized people weren't going to take that shit. And after that chip away at their confidence for a little longer, maybe $$ their way to a few really important exclusives to blind people from what is behind the curtain, and then when the time is right, use some of the money people spent on their products to re-invest in a anti-consumer nightmare machine once more.

Or maybe they won't. But they can't blame anyone but themselves for being in a position to be the least desirable platform.

Yup. They have to earn back my trust. I never fully trusted MS but I still supported their two pervious consoles, hell I bought more games for 360 than any other console. But now I'm not buying their new console anytime soon. AND I buy everything to have access to all games (PC, consoles, handhelds).

The one thing I've hated the most out of MS is they never seem to have a true vision of gaming that they believe in. For better or worse I know what Nintendo and Sony believe gaming should be and the future. Sony pushes tech, funds quirky games, etc. Nintendo is well Nintendo. MS? It's whatever the latest current is at the time. First it's high tech and winning the hardcore. Oh now it's family's, Kinnect, and avatars and lets scrap all 1st party studios. Oh wait now its TV and digital but not digital console! And uh. Here's some exclusives we threw money at. I don't know what they'll do or focus on in the next two years.

Their gaming division has no identity.

 

[mujun]

Anyway, at the end of this, people can say what they want about EDGE, but the central truth behind all this is that Microsoft made their bed and now they're lying on it. If anyone else was to blame but them for this situation, I'd maybe feel a little bad, but everything was on their shoulders, they pushed this DRM situation, they subverted many of the best qualities of 360 at the feet of an anti-consumer blood bath paradise, and now they think everyone is supposed to neatly forget about it when they took a few step backs after they realized people weren't going to take that shit. And after that chip away at their confidence for a little longer, maybe $$ their way to a few really important exclusives to blind people from what is behind the curtain, and then when the time is right, use some of the money people spent on their products to re-invest in a anti-consumer nightmare machine once more.

Or maybe they won't. But they can't blame anyone but themselves for being in a position to be the least desirable platform.

Yep, they've royally fucked up.

Hopefully they don't do what you mention in your post.

If they do however it won't affect me too much as it doesn't cause any major conflicts with the way I do things now.

People will certainly crucify them if they do renege on their latest turnabout, however.

Something that was fine before can be made better? How is that hard to grasp?

How hard is it to grasp my point.

 

[PROOP]

Wow, you sure are salty about an opinion piece.

Early stages of the console wars. I think it is so contentious because most people can only afford one at the moment and are forced to take sides.

Sony has definitely won the first battle, but maybe the XBO's OS features will end up being a large factor in the end.

 

[borghe]

Also, concerning the Windows Store apps rumors:

Windows Store isn't a rumor. They already announced it this past week.

There is a small advantage to having it, but honestly developers took it as more of a middle finger than "oh that's cool." MS basically implied "and here we have self publishing" when, like a lot of things with XBONE, this was an answer to a question no one was asking.

So yes you (in theory) will be able to buy VLC for XBONE but you might not be able to buy Hotline Miami 2.

 

[Oublieux]

Early stages of the console wars. I think it is so contentious because most people can only afford one at the moment and are forced to take sides.

Sony has definitely won the first battle, but maybe the XBO's OS features will end up being a large factor in the end.

I think the XBO's OS is pretty exciting in some ways, but as someone who lives overseas, the media features, DVR-like functions, and so on are definitely oriented towards a US market. The fact that MS plans on releasing the system in Japan a year later says it all for me, so I'll probably steer clear.

 

[Roland1979]

Early stages of the console wars. I think it is so contentious because most people can only afford one at the moment and are forced to take sides.

Sony has definitely won the first battle, but maybe the XBO's OS features will end up being a large factor in the end.

Not to most non-US gamers. Almost non of it is functional here in the EU. Xbox used to have good support in the Western part of the EU but not sure how much that has changed. But things like Netflix are completely useless to us and not replaced with decent alternatives.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I wonder how this generation is going to play out, sales wise.

Microsoft will end up selling over 80 million Xbox 360s (yet be in third place for the generation behind the PS3), amassing most of those thanks to some colossal blunders from Sony.

Now that Microsoft is making some massive blunders of their own, and Sony appears to be making all the right moves, Microsoft could be in for a hugely rude awakening.

Don Mattrick is credited for a lot of the 360's success, but I'd argue that most of it was established thanks to J Allard's team that designed a good system, for a reasonable price, that offered features you couldn't get anywhere else for a while. Sony came in substantially higher and lacked significant online infrastructure not to mention games. Yet their brand still was able to survive throughout all of this to come out on top.

Kinect really wasn't a big success, yet Microsoft has convinced themselves of its importance enough to where it's a requirement for the system. That ship has sailed, in my view. Whatever gimmickry sold back in 2010 is not going to have repeatable success today. People have seen what limited capabilities the device has for gaming.

It wouldn't surprise me to see the next Xbox sell less than 50 million consoles in the coming generation. Playstation has far too many advantages going into next-generation, and their global brand power looks to only strengthen in markets outside of the US. As for America itself, coming in at a lower price and with a more powerful package will have a huge impact and draw back the PS2 crowd that switched over to the 360.

Xbox One probably won't do as badly as Wii U out of the gate, but I can see it really struggling like the PS3 was, and not managing to have the recovery that accompanied that system.

 

[mujun]

I wonder how this generation is going to play out, sales wise.

Microsoft will end up selling over 80 million Xbox 360s (yet be in third place for the generation behind the PS3), amassing most of those thanks to some colossal blunders from Sony.

Now that Microsoft is making some massive blunders of their own, and Sony appears to be making all the right moves, Microsoft could be in for a hugely rude awakening.

Don Mattrick is credited for a lot of the 360's success, but I'd argue that most of it was established thanks to J Allard's team that designed a good system, for a reasonable price, that offered features you couldn't get anywhere else for a while. Sony came in substantially higher and lacked significant online infrastructure not to mention games. Yet their brand still was able to survive throughout all of this to come out on top.

Kinect really wasn't a big success, yet Microsoft has convinced themselves of its importance enough to where it's a requirement for the system. That ship has sailed, in my view. Whatever gimmickry sold back in 2010 is not going to have repeatable success today. People have seen what limited capabilities the device has for gaming.

It wouldn't surprise me to see the next Xbox sell less than 50 million consoles in the coming generation. Playstation has far too many advantage going into next-generation, and their global brand power looks to only strengthen in markets outside of the US. As for America itself, coming in at a lower price and with a more powerful package will have a huge impact and draw back the PS2 crowd that switched over to the 360.

Xbox One probably won't do as badly as Wii U out of the gate, but I can see it really struggling like the PS3 was, and not managing to have the recovery that accompanied that system.

I agree that Sony is poised to outsell MS by a considerable margin.

Don't agree with your Kinect point, though. Sold something like 25 million and while the device itself sucked in terms of performance I think that many of the people who bought it (read parents for kids) probably feel that it fulfilled its promise due to the fact that they only played Dance Central, Kinectimals and the like.