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[CLW]

 

[FeralEcho]

Remember guys:

A black samurai protagonist killing japanese in a fucking Sengoku era japanese based game made by westerners is not racist, it's inclusive and diverse,stunning and brave but a game made by the japanese based in Africa where you kill black zombies...cuz you know... it's fucking Africa,definitely is racist!

 

[DelireMan7]

This one maybe. He maybe a samurai as no one truly know but certainly not a legend.

I mean it's the description of their advertisement video. They have to sell it. Also I am not native speaker but isn't legend antinomic of "history" ? Could we read it as "We use this mysterious historical man as a character" ? A bit like the tales of the Round table where history and fantasy are mixed ? I probably not clear but this sentence doesn't really shock me.
But I concede that they say he's a samurai here. (But not in the video).

Honestly I don't get all the fuzz about the importance of him being a samurai for real or not.

 

[Madserb2023]

I don't blame them. We have yet to have a Japanese main character in a Assassins Creed game and even with it set in Japan, we still don't.

 

[Punished Miku]

Asians really got fucked by this western culture war.

This is payback for Resident Evil 5.

Remember guys:

A black samurai protagonist killing japanese in a fucking Sengoku era japanese based game made by westerners is not racist, it's inclusive and diverse,stunning and brave but a game made by the japanese based in Africa where you kill black zombies...cuz you know... it's fucking Africa,definitely is racist!

Didn't see any of this energy in the Resident Evil 5 Remake thread. Search the thread for "racist."

Resident evil 5 was awesome, and I hope it gets a remake.

I didn’t realize how many people disliked RE5. I absolutely love it. I thought it was totally awesome. I loved playing with my friend. I even found that the AI did pretty good. Whenever people say they dislike it they bring up inventory management and relate it to RE4. I could see the...

www.neogaf.com

It is objectively impossible to claim RE5 is fine but be mad about this. It cannot happen. You have to acknowledge RE5 is a lot worse before you can even slightly care about this game. I'm fine with both games.

 

[DelireMan7]

I don't blame them. We have yet to have a Japanese main character in a Assassins Creed game and even with it set in Japan, we still don't.

The other main protagonist (which is a assassin) in the Assassin's Creed Shadows is japanese.

 

[Black_Stride]

i don't think you understand what i'm talking about. HE IS CONSPIRING AGAINST A MAJOR LORD (or so the trailer seems to imply), WHILE WORKING CLOSELY TO SAID LORD. Do you seriously think a guy who stands out like a sore thumb and is probably socially scrutinized would be able to do that so freely?

Ohh I get your beef.........Im assuming he isnt doing so freely, thus the need to work in the shadows yada yada.
Its AC mane......its not gonna win a Pulitzer prize any time soon.
The Animus is fine though.

Terrible argument. By this logic, every white saviour trope is representative of their culture due to the fact the majority of cast is (insert race).

I agree somewhat on this argument due to the fact that everyone is forgetting to add "male" asian representative.

We dont know Yasukes role in this beyond being we can assume a member of the Assassins Order.
I dont think its anywhere near the white savior trope.
But I can see where you are coming from.

And he wasn't a Samurai.
Not everyone that worked for a Shogun was a Samurai. Even the people in the Shogun's army were not Samurai.

Fine , you seem to be more knowledgeable about this topic than I and the admittedly limited research I have done.
I aint even gonna get into that one as Im nowhere near learned enough.

That is the same argument that white people did a few decades ago when they had a token black guy. Pretending that is actual representation.
Yosuke is an insignificant person in Japanese history. His only relevant thing is that he was a black man in Japan.
Nothing he ever did would make him a preferential character in a Japanese theme game, when there are thousands of more historical characters with much greater impact.
What you are doing is removing the importance of Japanese people in Japan's history.

I dont think Naoe is a token character in this
Isnt that exactly why he would be a preferential character.
His insignificance....

 

[FoxMcChief]

Yeah, well I’m not happy with Japan either. Where’s my Dreamcast Mini?!

 

[lughnasadh123]

There is very much a "cultural appropriate" double standard that happens only when certain groups are involved. There's also a irrationality when it comes to see a black person in a video game as nothing other than a woke choice. Both shitty sides of the same stupid coin. Lot's ass showin' going on.

Of course there's also those who just love hate wanking to Ubi too.

 

[mdkirby]

horse shoe theory in action. They've gone so far they've looped around and done something that kinda seems to be mega racist

 

[DelireMan7]

I dont think Naoe is a token character in this
Isnt that exactly why he would be a preferential character.
His insignificance....

Basically this.

Yasuke is cool for them because little is known about him and they can do whatever they want with him for the story.
This wouldn't be the case with a major actor of history.

 

[MiguelItUp]

I don't think it's about the person being black more so than a crazy outsider view of the culture. I mean this is a thing in Japan..

Made in Japan by Japanese people who just thought a black samurai would be sick.

Shadows is made in the west by westerners who haven’t done their due diligence.

Yeah, if anything it probably has a lot to do with stuff like this. You'd think that Ubi would be very good about having some insiders to provide perspective when making AC games based in other countries and with other cultures. But I guess that's not always the case. I can't really imagine it's solely because of a black lead. I do remember a lot of Japanese devs praising Ghost of Tsushima for its accuracy.

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

 

[Ulysses 31]

Yeah, well I’m not happy with Japan either. Where’s my Dreamcast Mini?!

A mister fpga is as close as a dreamcast(and PSX) mini as you'll get.

Oops! I confused Dreamcast with Saturn!

 

[winjer]

I dont think Naoe is a token character in this
Isnt that exactly why he would be a preferential character.
His insignificance....

Watch that video I posted. It will show you how much Asian men are always badly represented in western media.
An Asian men being removed from being the main character, is just another example of the perpetuation of these issues.
And how Asian women are not as much of a victim of stereotypes. Though they are mostly represented as an exotic sexual target.

 

[Punished Miku]

Watch that video I posted. It will show you how much Asian men are always badly represented in western media.
An Asian men being removed from being the main character, is just another example of the perpetuation of these issues.
And how Asian women are not as much of a victim of stereotypes. Though they are mostly represented as an exotic sexual target.

I think that's a fair criticism. But not every game has a duty to be made for the public good to level out stereotypes / quotas of good roles. If this is what they wanted to make, I'm fine with it.

Japan has a huge game industry presence and can definitely make this if they want. They literally just did, and the west did too (Ghost of Tsushima, Rise of the Ronin).

 

[Senhua]

I mean it's the description of their advertisement video. They have to sell it. Also I am not native speaker but isn't legend antinomic of "history" ? Could we read it as "We use this mysterious historical man as a character" ? A bit like the tales of the Round table where history and fantasy are mixed ? I probably not clear but this sentence doesn't really shock me.
But I concede that they say he's a samurai here. (But not in the video).

Honestly I don't get all the fuzz about the importance of him being a samurai for real or not.

Well I don't have a problem here with him became a Samurai and legendary one of all that as I can just ignore the game.
Just there are much other more famous legendary samurai than him if that Ubisoft want focused for that elements .

Like this one maybe

 

[winjer]

I think that's a fair criticism. But not every game has a duty to be made for the public good to level out stereotypes / quotas of good roles. If this is what they wanted to make, I'm fine with it.

Japan has a huge game industry presence and can definitely make this if they want. They literally just did, and the west did too (Ghost of Tsushima, Rise of the Ronin).

That is just an argument to justify racism against Asian men. I hope you realize that.

 

[Draugoth]

The lead writer of this game works for Sweet Baby Inc

That's all you need to know

 

[FeralEcho]

This is payback for Resident Evil 5.



Didn't see any of this energy in the Resident Evil 5 Remake thread. Search the thread for "racist."

Resident evil 5 was awesome, and I hope it gets a remake.

I didn’t realize how many people disliked RE5. I absolutely love it. I thought it was totally awesome. I loved playing with my friend. I even found that the AI did pretty good. Whenever people say they dislike it they bring up inventory management and relate it to RE4. I could see the...

www.neogaf.com

I'm directly reffering to IGN's article on how RE5 is too racist cuz you shoot black zombies in Africa and cant be remade in today's age...because clearly today black people are minorities even in Africa so let's shoot white people too,throw in some asians too while you're at it I guess...For inclusion and diversity afterall,fuck logic...

I wonder if IGN will keep the same energy with this game as well. My guess is they won't even mention it.

The Resident Evil Game That Can't Be Remade - IGN

Resident Evil 5 simply can’t be remade, at least not to the standards of Capcom’s best work. And so the answer is not to remake, but to rewrite.

www.ign.com

I couldn't care less if Yasuke is black or asian or whatever,as long as he's a well written character he could be blue for all i care,it's the double standards in this decrepit gaming industry that I fucking loathe.

It's how only the portrayal of the west matters even though it's all bullshit.

 

[DavidGzz]

I really don't see the problem with the black Yasuke myself since it is historically accurate. I'm just hoping for a great game.

Amén.

 

[Punished Miku]

That is just an argument to justify racism against Asian men. I hope you realize that.

No, I don't agree at all. You basically are saying that every game has to be made to fit in with leveling out perceived racial slights and making representation fair and equal. That is literally the one and only force behind all SJW activity.

My opinion is that people can make what they want. Creator intent / creator freedom should be allowed at all times. When it strays into forced token characters and political propaganda, it sucks ass. If the teams want to make something with an Asian male lead, by all means that sounds great. Go for it. Doesn't in any way mean they have to or they're racist.

And as for your comments about Asian women being more sexualized, I agree. It's a trope for sure. But Asian games usually do this 100x more, and most people here cheer it on every time. Just look at Stellar Blade and the rise of Chinese and Korean gaming.

As I have been saying this whole thread, for some reason just on this one game - people here are suddenly literally SJWs. It's a complete 180 turn only for this one game.

 

[Z O N E]

Askhistorians on reddit seem to agree that he was, but I haven't seen much in terms of counter-arguments so I'm still waiting for more experts to hopefully chime in.

Yeah... I wouldn't place all my cookies in their facts.

For example, in that post, the mod says:

Yes. Yes he was. The conclusion of all reasonable historians on the matter is that Yasuke was a samurai, and anyone who disagrees can suck on the historical record.

Then you follow the links he provided in his comment to see what evidence there is and well...

In this link:



The guy who makes the lengthy post, provides ZERO evidence that Yasuke was a Samurai. The only mention of the word Samurai, is his own comment on his post saying:

Nobunaga liked him so much he was given a stipend, so he was definitely made a samurai.

Once again, ZERO evidence he was actually a Samurai, yet the guy claims he was DEFINITELY made a Samurai.

 

[shamoomoo]

Asian people are white adjacent, don't they know that? They need to check their privilege and make room for the real minorities.

Spoiler

I'm clearly being sarcastic, but I remember reading some asshole made a comment about asians being white adjacent.

That highlighted part isn't entirely wrong.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Most well-known samurai’s aren’t even referred to as such from what I gathered. The thing with Yasuke is that based on what we know, do experts think he was a samurai? I’ve seen people saying they don’t know or yes, haven’t seen a no so far.

And do note that the definition of samurai changed according to the time period. During Yasuke’s time for instance, it wasn’t an hereditary noble title. There also wasn’t a law prohibiting citizens from carrying weapons and according to primary sources, he was given a house, a stipend, and a katana (not a wakizashi). He also seemingly enjoyed considerable autonomy. By our modern definition of samurai, he wouldn’t qualify but at the time, he might have. Once again, however, there isn’t that much information and conclusions are drawn from what little we know. If anyone expects any documentation to call him a samurai, they won’t find it, nor will they find it for most samurais (allegedly).

That is because the term samurai... wasn't really ever a "title" but more like a designation. It initially was only used amongst Japanese nobility that were warriors. But eventually became used for everyone who was a warrior and adhered to a certain code. Think that code was called Bushido?

So basically, after the first growing years of samurai"ism (made-up word) all the years that followed, and its majority, which also encompasses the time of yasuke, if you were a warrior and adhered to the bushido code of conduct, you were a samurai.

 

[Ulysses 31]

The lead writer of this game works for Sweet Baby Inc

That's all you need to know

Pronouns in bio off course.

Mossinmind on X

 

[winjer]

No, I don't agree at all. You basically are saying that every game has to be made to fit in with leveling out perceived racial slights and making representation fair and equal. That is literally the one and only force behind all SJW activity.

No I'm not. What I' saying is that, once again, Asians are being victims of racism. And in this case, it is particularly egregious, as this game is set in historical Japan.

 

[Draugoth]

Pronouns in bio off course.

Mossinmind on X

Yup, that's her

 

[Punished Miku]

No I'm not. What I' saying is that, once again, Asians are being victims of racism. And in this case, it is particularly egregious, as this game is set in historical Japan.

Same thing was said about Resident Evil 5. And the history and imagery there was infinitely worse.

 

[Topher]

The lead writer of this game works for Sweet Baby Inc

That's all you need to know

No, she doesn't. She works for Ubisoft Quebec

https://www.linkedin.com/in/alissamralph/?original_referer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egoogle%2Ecom%2F&originalSubdomain=ca

 

[Senhua]

But Asian games usually do this 100x more, and most people here cheer it on every time. Just look at Stellar Blade and the rise of Chinese and Korean gaming.

So what race do you think when us east asian developer want to make a game featuring sexy women?

 

[CGNoire]

Asian people are white adjacent, don't they know that? They need to check their privilege and make room for the real minorities.

Spoiler

I'm clearly being sarcastic, but I remember reading some asshole made a comment about asians being white adjacent.

Thats not a joke...This is Exacly there way of Thinking.

 

[Punished Miku]

Asian developer who making horny game for Asian male != with Western one for western male.

Maybe, possibly? It certainly doesn't help the exotic sexualization trope at all if people are actually concerned with that.

 

[winjer]

That is because the term samurai... wasn't really ever a "title" but more like a designation. It initially was only used amongst Japanese nobility that were warriors. But eventually became used for everyone who was a warrior and adhered to a certain code. Think that code was called Bushido?

So basically, after the first growing years of samurai"ism (made-up word) all the years that followed, and its majority, which also encompasses the time of yasuke, if you were a warrior and adhered to the bushido code of conduct, you were a samurai.

That is not correct. In a structured society like Japan was in the 16th century, ranks and titles were well defined.
There is a reason why there are terms like Samurai, Ashigaru, Ronin, etc.
And even among Samurai, there were different ranks.
We have to take into consideration that Samurai means "to serve". It's not so much a military term., but rather a term of relation to the Shogun or Daimio.
And Samurai had many responsibilities outside of war. Several of them were administrators, in peace time.

Bushido is just a code of rules, that most Japanese follow to this day. And it emphasis's the greater good of the group, rather than the individual.
But following Bushido does not make a person a Samurai. That is was and still is a protected title.

 

[CGNoire]

Can we Please Stop Adopting the term "Cultual Appropriation".
Its a Fucking Retarded term pushed by Gatekeeping Racists.

Were better than ERA....Lets not drop to there level.

 

[ShadowkillXNA]

Definite pass for me.

 

[shamoomoo]

There is a big difference.
Nioh is made by Japanese, so they get to choose who they place as the main character in a game set in Japan.
AC: Shadows is made by Europeans, choosing a black man to be the main character in a game set in Japan.
It's what the woke crowd would call cultural appropriation.
But because Asians are now considered white-adjacent, it's ok to be racist against them.

I fail to see the difference. Why is a Japanese company catering to European-Americans anyway? There are Asian-Americans of various types and very few games created by Asian developers in the same vain as white looking or white characters. I think Jill Valentine is part Asian/white and the Dino Crisis chick.

Also,the game is using Japan asa backdrop for a fancy setting. Something similar to happened in Halo which takes in parts of Africa.

 

[Solarstrike]

People who aren't racist don't care what color a person's skin is.

 

[GHound]

It is objectively impossible to claim RE5 is fine but be mad about this. It cannot happen. You have to acknowledge RE5 is a lot worse before you can even slightly care about this game. I'm fine with both games.

Hey now don't tempt me. I hate RE5 and I might just stoop to some ratchet shit to make sure they don't remake it.
/s

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

That is not correct. In a structured society like Japan was in the 16th century, ranks and titles were well defined.
There is a reason why there are terms like Samurai, Ashigaru, Ronin, etc.
And even among Samurai, there were different ranks.
We have to take into consideration that Samurai means "to serve". It's not so much a military term., but rather a term of relation to the Shogun or Daimio.
And Samurai had many responsibilities outside of war. Several of them were administrators, in peace time.

Bushido is just a code of rules, that most Japanese follow to this day. And it emphasis's the greater good of the group, rather than the individual.
But following Bushido does not make a person a Samurai. That is was and still is a protected title.

I can't speak too much on the matter, as I am not Japanese. But give this a read.

The closest I could find in short notice to elaborate on what I was saying.

 

[Senhua]

Maybe, possibly? It certainly doesn't help the exotic sexualization trope at all if people are actually concerned with that.

You really cannot dump all of this to asian developer as not just asian develop horny game in the world.

Exotic sexualization for Asian women not because of the asian porn but because western male taste.
Same in the RL, there are reason why there are WMAF meme. For some western, they even prefer their mate asian than white.
And that is okay.
Just don't the accuse the Asian game developer, this is purely matter of taste.

 

[STARSBarry]

I don't get why they made the samurai black and the ninja an Asian woman.

They should have doubled down and had both of them black.

 

[Punished Miku]

You really cannot dump all of this to asian developer as not just asian develop horny game in the world.

Exotic sexualization for Asian women not because of the asian porn but because Western man usually prefer playing as asian female rather than Asian male.
Same in the RL, there are reason why there are WMAF meme. For some western, they even prefer their mate asian than white.
And that is okay.
Just don't the accuse the Asian game developer, this is purely matter of taste.

I don't care what any developer wants to make really. Creator intent / creator freedom. I'm more criticizing enthusiastic consumers of erotic content like Stellar Blade and how they've really vocally proclaimed that this has to exist to save all of gaming turning around and acting like they are SJWs now because there's a black lead in a game and that's the most convenient course of argument they could think of.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

I don't understand the reasoning for changing the formula of main characters in AC games. They have always been completely fictional characters. Why use a real historical figure this time, using the only known black figure in japan at the time? Hell, even in this game they keep the original formula with the other lead. Why is the female fictional and not a real historical Japanese woman? I am sure they could have easily found one to base their character on? It just reeks of DEI.

Serious question: Is there any historical evidence for this dude being black, or are we stuck with one single written piece from that time describing him as someone "from Africa". Because the guy could be an Arab/other North African or even European in that case.

 

[Strategize]

Why are people pretending like there literally isn't a Japanese protagonist of the front cover? WTF? So good at stealth she's literally invisible I guess

 

[ReyBrujo]

"Policorre-creed" (Politically Correct Creed).

So if Ubisoft made a Moon-landing simulator would they put a black woman and an Asian male there?

 

[winjer]

I can't speak too much on the matter, as I am not Japanese. But give this a read.

You are extrapolating too much. The warrior class was a restricted class.
Not everyone in an army was par of the warrior class. Most were conscripted peasants and artisans.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

You are extrapolating too much. The warrior class was a restricted class.
Not everyone in an army was par of the warrior class. Most were conscripted peasants and artisans.

Ok then, my bad. Thanks for the correction.

 

[Draugoth]

Yeah... I wouldn't place all my cookies in their facts.

For example, in that post, the mod says:



Then you follow the links he provided in his comment to see what evidence there is and well...

In this link:



The guy who makes the lengthy post, provides ZERO evidence that Yasuke was a Samurai. The only mention of the word Samurai, is his own comment on his post saying:



Once again, ZERO evidence he was actually a Samurai, yet the guy claims he was DEFINITELY made a Samurai.

Yasuke was more or less a trophy to Nobunaga, he was a complete failure as a Samurai and failed to protect the two lords he served, he was even sold back to the Portuguese which was when he disappeared from history.

The only reason why he became a 'Samurai' in the firts place was because Nobunaga had a fetish for non japanese culture and because he was super tall for the japanese back in the day, which made him a very effective bodyguard.

He would also be the worst choice for an assassin you could think of

 

[Sleepwalker]

Pissing off the majority of Japanese players in a game about their own culture? Only Ubi can pull this off.

Then again, considering who the lead writer is, I'm not surprised:

https://twitter.com/mossinmind

And even with all this bullshit, the purple forum is still complaining:

A daily reminder that these people will never be happy, no matter what. Stop catering to the mentally ill.

That resetera guy is still haunted because a character is straight and had a baby