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[The Technomancer]

HillaryGAF is vile, Jesus Christ, and you guys expect Bernie supporters to vote for her in the National, Trump as president is looking more real and it will be Clinton and her supporters fault that Trump wins, of course Bernie will be blamed but alas dirty propaganda working as usual.

Some useful links for the non-blinded with irrational hate:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKqs88zIAGM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLZy2SZr5QA

Any Bernie supporter who claims to care about Citizens United but doesn't vote blue in november is a liar. I'm sorry, there's no way to sugarcoat it. That issue alone should justify standing in line for half an hour. A liberal supreme court overturns CU. A conservative one solidifies it and other regressive decisions through 2030 at the minimum

I expect Bernie supporters to put their money where their damn mouth is if they care about money in politics so much

 

[B-Dubs]

Dispute their arguments, not the source.

Not advocating for The Young Turks but its not wise to just disregard any argument because of where it is coming from. You disregard arguments by hearing them and disputing it.

Maybe if he actually bothered to make the arguments himself instead of just dropping links people would respond. If you're just going to drop a link and nothing else expect to be ignored. Links should be what backs up an argument.

Any Bernie supporter who claims to care about Citizens United but doesn't vote blue in november is a liar. I'm sorry, there's no way to sugarcoat it. That issue alone should justify standing in line for half an hour. A liberal supreme court overturns CU. A conservative one solidifies it and other regressive decisions through 2030 at the minimum

I expect Bernie supporters to put their money where their damn mouth is if they care about money in politics so much

Pretty much.

 

[B4s5C]

You just quoted a wiki blurb to prove you knowledge of Dunning-Kruger. You are kind of making my point for me here....

I would be more than happy to link the research articles which I have read and where required to read.

Here is a free one if you don't have access to PSYCInfo or some other database resource.

But, your basically saying one-liners so...

 

[B4s5C]

Maybe if he actually bothered to make the arguments himself instead of just dropping links people would respond. If you're just going to drop a link and nothing else expect to be ignored. Links should be what backs up an argument.



Pretty much.

Then say that to them.

Rather than saying "Really???"

Edit: My apologies, I thought you were the original poster. But yes, I agree with you

 

[HylianTom]

Any Bernie supporter who claims to care about Citizens United but doesn't vote blue in november is a liar. I'm sorry, there's no way to sugarcoat it. A liberal supreme court overturns CU. A conservative one solidifies it and other regressive decisions through 2030 at the minimum

I expect Bernie supporters to put their money where their damn mouth is if they care about money in politics so much

Not only that..

Corporate personhood?
Workers' and union rights?

Name an issue. The court probably touches it, in some way. It could be at state level, local, or federal - the court gets the final word on everything.

Hell, we've had a conservative Supreme Court for over 30 years now; there's a damn good chance that there are anti-progressive rulings that need to be overturned before legislative progress can be made on that issue. A progressive court opens us up to an entirely different legal framework - one that decisively favors Bernie's vision of the future.

 

[B-Dubs]

Then say that to them.

Rather than saying "Really???"

It's been said over and over and over again. Users have said it, mods have said it, everyone's said it and yet people keep doing it. So no one bothers responding seriously. If you can't be bothered to make an argument yourself then don't bother.

 

[Cerium]

Dispute their arguments, not the source.

Not advocating for The Young Turks but its not wise to just disregard any argument because of where it is coming from. You disregard arguments by hearing them and disputing it.

TYT are H.A. Goodman tier. There are some sources that you can, in fact, safely disregard.

 

[Blader]

So, none of my reasons are good reasons because?

If "past feelings toward video games" isn't an obviously absurd reason to vote for someone (or not) for president, then I don't know what to tell you. For me, Bernie's weak stance on gun control -- an issue that actually results in loss of innocent life all the time -- is much more alarming than anything Hillary has ever said about video games a decade ago.

(Out of curiosity, though, what's Bernie's position on video game censorship from 10+ years ago?)


Also, the Young Turks is frankly a shit source. Just like if I were to drop videos from The Blaze in here to make an argument, I wouldn't expect you to bother mounting an epic counter argument, I would expect you to ignore me and wait for a less obviously biased source to emerge.

 

[JP_]

CNN has evidence that Sanders campaign planned, encouraged the disruption at the Nevada convention

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/17/politics/democrat-bernie-sanders-revolt/index.html

Is the full audio somewhere?

I ask because CNN says

"new audio obtained by CNN shows a senior Sanders aide -- on the eve of the Nevada convention -- encouraging the senator's supporters try to "take over" the convention, change party rules and continue the "revolution" that Sanders has long campaigned on."

But their youtube source doesn't actually confirm when the audio was recorded and she doesn't say "take over" or anything about changing the rules or the "revolution."

 

[PhoncipleBone]

Any Bernie supporter who claims to care about Citizens United but doesn't vote blue in november is a liar. I'm sorry, there's no way to sugarcoat it. That issue alone should justify standing in line for half an hour. A liberal supreme court overturns CU. A conservative one solidifies it and other regressive decisions through 2030 at the minimum

I expect Bernie supporters to put their money where their damn mouth is if they care about money in politics so much

Thank you for this.

I had a former coworker comment on FB about how if Bernie doesn't win he is voting Trump. He says he would rather watch it all burn down than get an established politician like Clinton in the White House.

He didn't like it when I pointed out to him that if that is the way he feels, he didn't truly believe in what Bernie was wanting to achieve.

 

[s10satsu]

Sad to see Sanders racing towards 08 Hillary levels of being a sore loser. Been losing a decent amount of respect for his actions.

 

[B4s5C]

If "past feelings toward video games" isn't an obviously absurd reason to vote for someone (or not) for president, then I don't know what to tell you. For me, Bernie's weak stance on gun control -- an issue that actually results in loss of innocent life all the time -- is much more alarming than anything Hillary has ever said about video games a decade ago.

(Out of curiosity, though, what's Bernie's position on video game censorship from 10+ years ago?)


Also, the Young Turks is frankly a shit source. Just like if I were to drop videos from The Blaze in here to make an argument, I wouldn't expect you to bother mounting an epic counter argument, I would expect you to ignore me and wait for a less obviously biased source to emerge.

And I will say once again, many, many reasons. Video games to me represent poor judgment but my reasons are my reasons. Laugh at them, smirk at them, do whatever dude, I am not attacking anyone here for supporting Hillary Clinton, merely the candidate. If there is anything that this election has taught me is that the conservative trope of smug liberals has some truth to it. Notice, I am

But I am not getting into this with you. Sorry man. If a news source has a story that I haven't read elesewhere, I am opening to reading it and evaluating it on its merit.

 

[EatinOlives]

So, explain to me the $1 million investment Correct The Record recently made in regards to online forums such as Reddit and Facebook.

Because if this was being done by Republicans (probably is) then it is just as abhorrent.

Would you like me to find you comments from multiple users that use the same phrasing, exact same sentences, and comments. Or how about the hundreds of Twitter accounts that tweet the same exact thing to Bernie accounts?

You think that's okay?

And let me point out as well that you didn't point out anything or provide any evidence for your claim. I stay out of these off-topic threads because of the unsubstantiatied claims but I would be more than happy to give you all of my evidence when I return home from travelling on the actions of Correct the Record.

My point is you claim "everyone" is biased and as such gravitate only toward the news and sources that agree with them...and then proceed to do that exact same thing yourself.

You would be wise to at least have some self awareness if you come in claiming that everyone is biased.

 

[Emarv]

And I will say once again, many, many reasons. Video games to me represent poor judgment but my reasons are my reasons. Laugh at them, smirk at them, do whatever dude, I am not attacking anyone here for supporting Hillary Clinton, merely the candidate. If there is anything that this election has taught me is that the conservative trope of smug liberals has some truth to it. Notice, I am

But I am not getting into this with you. Sorry man. If a news source has a story that I haven't read elesewhere, I am opening to reading it and evaluating it on its merit.

We all make quick value judgment and dismissals on sources based on past history with those sources. I didn't need to read the National Enquirer article about Cruz's dad being linked to the JFK assassination to "give it the weight and time it deserved". I just went, "Oh, it's Trump referencing the National Enquirer again".

 

[StrangerInTheAlps]

Why is it a terrible reason?

I mean, Its not the only reason (trade policies, flip flopping, gun laws, past feelings towards video games, etc).

I'd say refusing to vote for these reasons shows how much you sincerely care about the big issues that Bernie tends to espouse - since you did mention that you're all about supporting candidates who promote progressive policies - but correct me if I'm wrong.

It's been mentioned more elegantly before, but when I read posts like this I can only picture armchair activists who are only a part of this as someway to feel like they're making difference, ultimately as a way of self-gratification. But then when it comes down to the wire - if the choice is really between Hillary Clinton and Trump - fuck the person who is going to pass most of what I support, because she gave speeches to big companies, received money from rich people, and evolved her position on some issues to agree with what I do now.

Fuck the issues that I claim to care about, because at the end of the day, I can afford to let equal rights for LGBT individuals go down the toilet. At the end of the day, I can afford to let laughing at climate science be an official government position. At the end of the day, I can afford to let in-your-face gung-ho my-way-or-the-highway attitudes take the place of actual diplomacy. At the end of the day, I can afford to let protections for the poor be stripped away and wages to remain stagnant, despite the people suffering from them now. At the end of the day, I can affort to continue to let victim blaming go on in cases of rape or excesive police brutality. At the end of the day, I can afford to allow the actual systematic dismantlement of voting rights for large amounts of the voting populace. At the end of the day, I can afford to watch as racist behavior becomes sanctioned by the head of government. It won't really affect me anyway, so at least I can sleep soundly at night knowing I didn't abandon my principles and vote for the lady who doesn't think about video games the same way I do.

The cognitive dissonance is astounding.

 

[Branduil]

Shameful and disappointing that Bernie still refuses to condemn unreservedly the threats of violence and abusive language. The dreaded "establishment" needs to make it clear that he won't have a voice in the party going forward if this is the behavior he's going to encourage.

 

[B-Dubs]

Shameful and disappointing that Bernie still refuses to condemn unreservedly the threats of violence and abusive language. The dreaded "establishment" needs to make it clear that he won't have a voice in the party going forward if this is the behavior he's going to encourage.

I imagine he's going to be getting a very angry call from Harry Reid soon, and he is not a guy you want pissed at you.

 

[Emarv]

I imagine he's going to be getting a very angry call from Harry Reid soon, and he is not a guy you want pissed at you.

Bernie strikes me as the kind of Senator who doesn't give a damn what other Senators think of him, for better or worse.

I mean, Reid spoke with him before he made all of his recent statements and Reid seemed convinced that Bernie would adequately address it. Not sure why that would change after a 2nd meeting.

 

[The Technomancer]

Sanders supporters who I otherwise respect need to take some long hard looks at their silence over the last couple months when this all dies down and tempers aren't running as high. The principle of "benefiting from the wolves in your midst" applies here just as much as in any other harassment campaign.

 

[B-Dubs]

Bernie strikes me as the kind of Senator who doesn't give a damn what other Senators think of him, for better or worse.

I mean, Reid spoke with him before he made all of his recent statements and Reid seemed convinced that Bernie would adequately address it. Not sure why that would change after a 2nd meeting.

Maybe, but Reid can take away all of his power in the Senate. There'd be freshman Congressmen with more clout if Reid got real.

 

[BotoxAgent]

I imagine he's going to be getting a very angry call from Harry Reid soon, and he is not a guy you want pissed at you.

I want Reid to go into Alan Grayson style beast mode on Bernie lol

 

[LudicrousSpeed]

Maybe, but Reid can take away all of his power in the Senate. There'd be freshman Congressmen with more clout if Reid got real.

Harry Reid isn't running for re-election this year. He's gone in January. Reid would only have any real power until January, and you want to keep Bernie friendly because he's an extra vote in a chamber where those are valuable.

I wish it would happen, and maybe the next Democratic caucus' leader could have similar feelings, but counting on Harry Reid to do that work just isn't going to happen.

 

[pigeon]

Maybe, but Reid can take away all of his power in the Senate. There'd be freshman Congressmen with more clout if Reid got real.

I don't think Reid would do this before the election, and I kind of think it's already too late for Bernie to save his committee seats after the election unless he makes a sharp turn about now.

 

[Frozenprince]

God that's going to be a nightmare. It's bad enough having one party that's more concerned with ideological purity than actual governance

Yep. I'm dreading it if it's the case.

That said, it's not the case. These same pissed off 18-24 year olds? They won't vote next cycle or the one after that. Because they don't care enough to vote enough for Bernie now.

What this cycle has done, for me, is just affirm that the far left and the far right are two sides of the same coin, and attract the same general personality types of people.

 

[NotMSRP]

Gotta get your million dollars worth out of the trolling superpac Correct the Record via nasty telephone messages as giftwrapped bad PR on cable news.

 

[Frozenprince]

The SC is the only body of our three branches that actually accomplishes anything anymore. If the system is as broken as many self professed liberals and progressives continue to claim, then they should line up around fucking city blocks to vote as blue as possible so we get 20+ years of a progressive SC.

But they won't, I will bet ANY amount of money you want that voter turnout won't be noticeably higher in youth demos than any other year. Know why?

Because they don't really care. They care enough to bitch on twitter and facebook, bitch to relatives and friends and acquaintances, bitch while donating $10. But no noticably larger or proportional block will get off their asses and vote.

Because that involves actually doing something. Which is why the house, and the senate, and the SC have been conservative strongholds for the most part for the better part of 30 fucking years.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Gotta get your million dollars worth out of the trolling superpac Correct the Record via nasty telephone messages as giftwrapped bad PR on cable news.

I'm sorry is your implication that Correct the Record paid people to harass Roberta Lange in order to frame the Sanders camp?

 

[NotMSRP]

I'm sorry is your implication that Correct the Record paid people to harass Roberta Lange in order to frame the Sanders camp?

That is the job of that superpac. They stated their purpose in the press release: internet trolling.

 

[excelsiorlef]

That is the job of that superpac. They stated their purpose in the press release: internet trolling.

oooooooooooook.....

What it is it like living in an alternate universe where jet fuel actually can't melt steel beams?

 

[semisonic]

That is the job of that superpac. They stated their purpose in the press release: internet trolling.

But... Why would anyone even bother framing the Sanders camp? A victory for them has been all but impossible for a number of weeks now. Especially given the previous record of Superdelegate harassment from hardcore Bernie supporters in the past, I'm going to have to argue Occam's razor here.

 

[pigeon]

Gotta get your million dollars worth out of the trolling superpac Correct the Record via nasty telephone messages as giftwrapped bad PR on cable news.

I am super excited to see the evidence you are no doubt going to provide that these death threats and doxxing posts were made by Clinton supporters in disguise.

 

[Palette Swap]

That is the job of that superpac. They stated their purpose in the press release: internet trolling.

Even if your conspiracy theory was somehow true, and this was a move by the establishment and its crazy money, this doesn't account for Bernie walking out on a question about it, only to later release the most limp dick condemnation of all limp dick condemnations.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I am super excited to see the evidence you are no doubt going to provide that these death threats and doxxing posts were made by Clinton supporters in disguise.

Not even just in disguise but hired and paid for by a SuperPac lol.

 

[Frozenprince]

Not even just in disguise but hired and paid for by a SuperPac lol.

And why this wouldn't have already come to light and be a front page news story around the globe.

 

[Maledict]

Let me get this straight.

The people who *will* vote for the alternative to Trump will be to blame for him winning, and not the people who either voted for him or didn't vote for the alternative?

That's certainly interesting logic.m

 

[Frozenprince]

Correct. Basically just completely demotivated me from voting at all for any candidate. I will do it for Van Jones though, someone I actually respect. #Trumpzilla must be stopped.

Oh for fucks...

 

[SolicitorPirate]

Gotta get your million dollars worth out of the trolling superpac Correct the Record via nasty telephone messages as giftwrapped bad PR on cable news.

Ssshh. Not so loud; I need to collect my pay check first. Two more death threats and I get a bonus!

 

[Frozenprince]

Thanks for your input gorgeous.

I'v given enough of my input on this shit. Your principles are bullshit. Bernie is no different than any other politician looking to get elected, sorry you don't like it. That's reality. This is the system.

 

[Palette Swap]

Correct. Basically just completely demotivated me from voting at all for any candidate. I will do it for Van Jones though, someone I actually respect. #Trumpzilla must be stopped.

So, a woman :
- is doxxed
- receives texts and voice mails saying things like "I just wanted to let you know that I think people like you should be hung in a public execution to show this world that we won’t stand for this sort of corruption."
- has her workplace Yelp and phone bombed,

and your takeaway is "HilaryGAF is vile"?

Yeah, don't choke on your sympathy for actual victims.

 

[Palette Swap]

Woosh.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Equating the fans of an individual to the individual themselves? What? Fans of Lady Gaga are equal to Lady Gaga? No.

The harassment has come straight as a result of the more extreme side of Sanders' followers being inspired/incited by Sanders' repeated assertions that the DNC, and basically any Democrat who doesn't support him is part of an organized group who are stealing the election from Sanders. He has yelled fraud and suppression after almost every primary he's lost

Sanders rhetoric is the reason the extreme side is taking the actions they are.

He refuses to even accept an iota of responsibility. His statement today went harassment is bad but we had it worse and then he proceeded to triple down and outright accuse the person who is being harassed of suppressing his voters and stealing Nevada from him.

He literally claims that the Roberta Lange's action are why he lost Nevada. His response to a woman's harassment was to attack her further.

That was his answer to the reality that a woman's life/career/place of business and family are being threatened.

 

[MEsoJD]

Wow, Hilgaf... While death threats are never cool, there was no violence at the convention. Only disappointment and outrage from the people not being heard.


If you'd like a good source for what occurred go here: https://www.reddit.com/r/SandersFor...ic_stepbystep_of_what_went_down_yesterday_at/

 

[SolicitorPirate]

The harassment has come straight as a result of the more extreme side of Sanders' followers being inspired/incited by Sanders' repeated assertions that the DNC, and basically any Democrat who doesn't support him is part of an organized group who are stealing the election from Sanders. He has yelled fraud and suppression after almost every primary he's lost

Sanders rhetoric is the reason the extreme side is taking the actions they are.

He refuses to even accept an iota of responsibility. His statement today went harassment is bad but we had it worse and then he proceeded to triple down and outright accuse the person who is being harassed of suppressing his voters and stealing Nevada from him.

He literally claims that the Roberta Lange's action are why he lost Nevada. His response to a woman's harassment was to attack her further.

That was his answer to the reality that a woman's life/career/place of business and family are being threatened.

Yeah, but don't you see? She's a woman rather than a college age white man! So who gives a fuck about her!?

 

[pigeon]

Wow, Hilgaf... While death threats are never cool, there was no violence at the convention. Only disappointment and outrage from the people not being heard.


If you'd like a good source for what occurred go here: https://www.reddit.com/r/SandersFor...ic_stepbystep_of_what_went_down_yesterday_at/

We've gone over this multiple times.

Your rando from Reddit is not automatically a more reliable source than the Associated Press.

 

[excelsiorlef]

One can both condemn these disgusting actions and remark on the unhelpful attitudes of another group. This is why earlier in the thread I mentioned how I appreciated Van Jones' take on this situation, as he did the same on CNN. A shame I can't seem to find the clip anywhere online.



I am aware. Sanders' rhetoric is ridiculous and fake, as I have noticed has been a commonality in the last few months, with repeated spam emails and text messages (mistake to ever sign up for that) blaming "the establishment" at every turn. It's transparent, and that's why I moved back to the Green Party, but then I was bashed for that too, so I just said fuck it, I'm done with this shit.

Because if the goal is not Trump voting Green is useless well that and Jill Stein is her own brand of bad.. I mean unless you live in a safe safe blue state than do whatever I guess.

 

[pigeon]

Okay, well at least you understand that. Because I live in California, stated that explicitly, and was still bashed for reasons that boggle the mind.

People are rabid. If you live in Cali and want to vote Green you should do it. Vote downticket as well though. CA is the Green's best chance to get a House seat.

 

[SolicitorPirate]

Yeah, I'm all about college aged white men.

Lol touché

 

[excelsiorlef]

Okay, well at least you understand that. Because I live in California, stated that explicitly, and was still bashed for reasons that boggle the mind.

Probably because Jill Stein is horrible. But that's neither here nor there.

Do whatever the hell you want in California lol.

 

[Frozenprince]

I mean, Green is a pointless party. Them getting a seat, by some miracle, would accomplish nothing.

There is a binary choice. That's just reality.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Wow, Hilgaf... While death threats are never cool, there was no violence at the convention. Only disappointment and outrage from the people not being heard.


If you'd like a good source for what occurred go here: https://www.reddit.com/r/SandersFor...ic_stepbystep_of_what_went_down_yesterday_at/

I don't mean to dismiss you outright...

Spoiler

yes I do

but on what planet is reddit ever a good source for anything?