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[UrbanRats]

PSA: R* games go down in price pretty drastically on PC.

GTA4 you could get for peanuts on Steam countless times, Max Payne 3 was under 5$ one year (or less) after launch.
They even gave away LA Noire by simply preordering Max Payne 3 on steam.

I would say GTAV will get cheap quickly, so if y'all want to stick it to them somewhat, waiting a bit more should not be too painful.

 

[Havel]

It's only a matter of time before scenes really start to try and crack it, though.

This isn't going to do anything other than piss off legitimate customers.

 

[Kariodude]

It's funny. Seeing the first person mode made me want the PS4 version so I could play it asap. This Denuvo bullshit makes me want to just skip the PC release until someone cracks a way past it.

 

[Boogalogist]

I really don't mind this extra hurdle if it doesn't fucking interfere with mods!!

 

[Sentenza]

DRM...DRM everywhere, is this the future of PC gaming?

This was the past, actually, and just another case of Rockstar doing things backward on PC.
A lot of clueless people love to complain about Steam "popularizing DRMs" but what Steam actually did few years back was replacing annoying, harmful and intrusive DRMs with a far more fair, non-intrusive and acceptable alternate option.

"Bye stealth drivers and Orwellian attempts to control what can and can't run on your PC, welcome encrypted executable being unlocked on the release date".

 

[SliChillax]

I wish I could just quit gaming and stop caring, this shit makes me too damn angry.

 

[perorist]

Nobody complains that WoW, or KOTOR, or LoL, or DOTA2, or Hearthstone, or TF2 have online only DRM.

That's because none of those are worth playing offline in a single player mode. GTA V has a SP campaign that is.

 

[Dario ff]

DRM...DRM everywhere, is this the future of PC gaming? all this bullshit punishing the legal user?

Well it seems like a step down from when they tried to push 4* kinds of DRM into GTA IV about 6 years ago. (Steam itself, GFWL, RGSC, SecuROM)

*: 3 for retail I think.

EDIT: Disregard Steam part as per post down below:

GTA IV has no Steam DRM(CEG). You can play your Steam copy without starting steam, afaik.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

That's because none of those are worth playing offline in a single player mode. GTA V has a SP campaign that is.

So if GTAV had a multiplayer worth playing then DRM would be completely unnecessary.

 

[MUnited83]

Rockstar already made like a billion monies with GTA5 on last gen consoles. With the PS4, X1, and PC version coming, why are they so overboard with DRM on the PC version?

Because they fucking hate PC gamers, as it can be seen by:

-Delayed PC version of GTA V
-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas)
-Shitloads of DRM (Securom+Social Club+GFWL on GTA IV. ALL OF THEM. AT THE SAME TIME)
-They added a warning on GTA IV store page basically saying that thay aren't patching GFWL out.


And now this shit. Rockstar can put the PC port back where the sun doesn't shine, because holy fuck, if you hate platform that much, you might as well stay the fuck away from it.

Well it seems like a step down from when they tried to push 4* kinds of DRM into GTA IV about 6 years ago. (Steam itself, GFWL, RGSC, SecuROM)

*: 3 for retail I think.

GTA IV has no Steam DRM(CEG). You can play your Steam copy without starting steam, afaik.

 

[Vibranium]

I wish I could just quit gaming and stop caring, this shit makes me too damn angry.

You summed my thoughts up perfectly my friend. I shouldn't be getting emotional over these things.

 

[syko de4d]

75% and lower steam user rating incoming because of this. This will just lead to less sales.

Worse User rating on steam and metacritic = less sales
People who hate DRM in any way = less sales
If it hits performance or spys on your PC = less sales
If it stops mods from working = alot of less sales
If it really will be uncrackable you will miss the pirates that pirate games but buy what they like, particularly for a Game like GTAV with its online mode = less sales

I dont think it outweighs the numbers of pirates that will buy the game now.

 

[Visualante2]

bye

 

[Krappadizzle]

Denuvo does jackshit to prevent cheaters. Denuvo has no anti-cheat system at all.

Well shit then.

 

[SRTtoZ]

Do people pirate games that require steam?

Yes.

 

[Corpsepyre]

Has anyone told them how utterly fucked this thing is? Just take a look at the performance with Fifa 15 and Lords of the Fallen.

 

[Kinthalis]

Denuvo might wind up interfering, it's supposedly been a source of bugs and performance problems in Lords of the Fallen.

Is that truly the case?

Lord of the fallen doesn't perform very well on consoles too, AND it's crashed on the PS4 for one fo the Giant Bomb guys.

So it doesn't sound like it has anything to do with DRM.

 

[Squishy3]

DRM doesn't exist for pirates, because pirate copies inherently have no DRM.

An online only mode that requires authentication has no problems for anyone being online only DRM, because it can only be played online.
Nobody complains that WoW, or KOTOR, or LoL, or DOTA2, or Hearthstone, or TF2 have online only DRM.

it seems silly to list league dota hearthstone and tf2 as examples because those games are all free in the first place

remember guys, rockstar social club is drm too, so that's THREE FUCKING PIECES OF DRM

 

[Sentenza]

Oh, and for the record maybe it's just me but I'm far more uncomfortable with DRMs which attempt to install harmful crap doing gods-know-what on my system that I am with "always online" checks.

 

[UrbanRats]

Because they fucking hate PC gamers, as it can be seen by:

-Delayed PC version of GTA V
-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas)
-Shitloads of DRM (Securom+Social Club+GFWL on GTA IV. ALL OF THEM. AT THE SAME TIME)
-They added a warning on GTA IV store page basically saying that thay aren't patching GFWL out.


And now this shit. Rockstar can put the PC port back where the sun doesn't shine, because holy fuck, if you hate platform that much, you might as well stay the fuck away from it.

Well i'm not one for conspiracy theories, but it does look pretty bad, from this position.
Max Payne 3 at this point looks like the only decent thing they did on the platform, though i don't remember what type of DRM that implemented.

 

[Phinor]

Not knowing anything how this particular DRM works, I wonder how futureproof it is. Does it work on Windows 2025 without updates from Rockstar/Denuvo (because we know those updates won't be coming at that point)? Basically I'm wondering if this will set an expiry date on GTA 5 on PC like Starforce (which was a terrible DRM, but in the form of a driver to be fair) did to so many games a decade or so ago.

 

[Moral Panic]

DRM doesn't exist for pirates, because pirate copies inherently have no DRM.

An online only mode that requires authentication has no problems for anyone being online only DRM, because it can only be played online.
Nobody complains that WoW, or KOTOR, or LoL, or DOTA2, or Hearthstone, or TF2 have online only DRM.

Of course DRM exists for pirates. When a pirate sees all his friends are playing the newest hit game and he can't because it's not been cracked yet, and could take any number of weeks to be cracked, then i'd guess he's more likely to just buy the game to join in with everyone else.

People are complaining about this DRM even though there is no evidence that it is harmful or obtrusive to their playing of the game. GTAV is not online only on any other platform but you believe that people will not complain if it was for PC?

 

[perorist]

So if GTAV had a multiplayer worth playing then DRM would be completely unnecessary.

No, plenty of people still pirate MP focused games for the SP campaign. If GTAV was a multiplayer-only game where having other players and playing online are absolutely essential to have any enjoyment like every game you suggested is, then yes your online only model works.

 

[Orayn]

Is that truly the case?

Lord of the fallen doesn't perform very well on consoles too, AND it's crashed on the PS4 for one fo the Giant Bomb guys.

So it doesn't sound like it has anything to do with DRM.

A component of the DRM may be taking up a lot of extra CPU cycles.

EDIT: NVM, still looking for a better source.

 

[RedSwirl]

I swear to fucking God if this prevents ENB from working with GTA V...

 

[Shantom]

Well, I haven't noticed it in Fifa at all, and Rockstar Social Club was awful anyway, so I don't think this is too bad, relatively. I will now delay my purchase to see if it negatively affects the game, of course.

 

[epmode]

Welp, it's off the wishlist. Not that it'll make much of a difference but I can only vote with my wallet.

It hasn't been a good day for PC games.

Oh, and for the record maybe it's just me but I'm far more uncomfortable with DRMs which attempt to install harmful crap doing gods-know-what on my system that I am with "always online" checks.

Online-only checks are better than SecuROM-style DRM but not by much. I avoid games with either.

 

[Visualante2]

I would say GTAV will get cheap quickly, so if y'all want to stick it to them somewhat, waiting a bit more should not be too painful.

This does not send any message at all. All it says is that you're price sensitive, not DRM sensitive.

 

[CambriaRising]

Has anyone told them how utterly fucked this thing is? Just take a look at the performance with Fifa 15 and Lords of the Fallen.

Apparently that's okay when they run marginally better than the console versions, or something. (We'll call that the Evil Within defense)

Oh, and for the record maybe it's just me but I'm far more uncomfortable with DRMs which attempt to install harmful crap doing gods-know-what on my system that I am with "always online" checks.

Same here.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

it seems silly to list league dota hearthstone and tf2 as examples because those games are all free in the first place

From what I hear the level of microtransactions in GTA Online is equivalent to the multiplayer games given out free nowadays.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

And I'm out.

Sorry. Not dealing with that nonsense.

 

[Sentenza]

Of course DRM exists for pirates. When a pirate sees all his friends are playing the newest hit game and he can't because it's not been cracked yet, and could take any number of weeks to be cracked, then i'd guess he's more likely to just buy the game to join in with everyone else.

People are complaining about this DRM even though there is no evidence that it is harmful or obtrusive to their playing of the game. GTAV is not online only on any other platform but you believe that people will not complain if it was for PC?

Interesting fact: the game that took longer to get a working crack was Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory.
Beside being uncrackable for more than a year, it was also the most critically acclaimed game in the series.
Guess what? It didn't even match the average sales of the other chapters in the series.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

There's going to be a Nega Durante out there somewhere who will crack this 2 hours after GTAV's release.

 

[Jawbreaker]

Guess I'll be getting the PS4 version for sure now. What a shame. I was trying to decide if the wait was worth it to play it on PC, but this settles it.

 

[Kinthalis]

A component of the DRM may be taking up a lot of extra CPU cycles.

EDIT: NVM, still looking for a better source.

Sounds like a convinient narrative posted on reddit by pirates.

They claim a 5X CPU hit. Give me a break. The game wouldn't run if that was the case.

 

[SURGEdude]

Geez. What is this 2006? Haven't publishers gotten fucking bitchslapped enough by their customers to quit doing this kinda of thing yet? I still have nightmares about securom and having to re-install Windows thanks to those motherfuckers.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Of course DRM exists for pirates. When a pirate sees all his friends are playing the newest hit game and he can't because it's not been cracked yet, and could take any number of weeks to be cracked, then i'd guess he's more likely to just buy the game to join in with everyone else.

People are complaining about this DRM even though there is no evidence that it is harmful or obtrusive to their playing of the game. GTAV is not online only on any other platform but you believe that people will not complain if it was for PC?

No, plenty of people still pirate MP focused games for the SP campaign. If GTAV was a multiplayer-only game where having other players and playing online are absolutely essential to have any enjoyment like every game you suggested is, then yes your online only model works.

I'll bow to both of your obviously well researched and not knee jerk reactionary social studies into software piracy, its causes and effects.

 

[Azure Dream]

Guess I won't be in a rush to pick this up.

People are complaining about this DRM even though there is no evidence that it is harmful or obtrusive to their playing of the game.

Oh, this is the magical double-stacked DRM that makes the game somehow run better, is it?

 

[LilJoka]

Sounds like a convinient narrative posted on reddit by pirates.

They claim a 5X CPU hit. Give me a break. The game wouldn't run if that was the case.

Ever see how GTA IV ran though? Barely hitting 80% GPU usage on my PC with a 3960x 4.7Ghz. Too much DRM has got to be some sort of factor in this.

 

[UrbanRats]

This does not send any message at all. All it says is that you're price sensitive, not DRM sensitive.

I'm not preventing anyone to flood their inbox with complaints.
That's the only real way to send a message.
If, on top of that, you don't pay full price D1, it might make the threats more credible.

 

[Kade]

How is it in Lords of The Fallen?

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Because they fucking hate PC gamers, as it can be seen by:

-Delayed PC version of GTA V
-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas)
-Shitloads of DRM (Securom+Social Club+GFWL on GTA IV. ALL OF THEM. AT THE SAME TIME)
-They added a warning on GTA IV store page basically saying that thay aren't patching GFWL out.


And now this shit. Rockstar can put the PC port back where the sun doesn't shine, because holy fuck, if you hate platform that much, you might as well stay the fuck away from it.


GTA IV has no Steam DRM(CEG). You can play your Steam copy without starting steam, afaik.

I think it's less conspiracy and more that they're really fucking arrogant.

 

[omnislayer]

cool. You shouldn't be pirating anyways.

Not cool since DRM can seriously fuck with your games.

 

[jshackles]

So it appears that the owner / manager of Denuvo is Reinhard Blaukovitsch, the same Reinhard Blaukovitsch who used to be the VP of DigitalWorks at Sony DADC, the creators of SecuROM.

This does not instill confidence.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

Makes me pine for the days of "Turn to page 57 of the manual and type in the first word in paragraph two, sentence 3."

But you know what, if it really does curb piracy then so be it. I'm down.

 

[Squishy3]

From what I hear the level of microtransactions in GTA Online is equivalent to the multiplayer games given out free nowadays.

yes but what i mean is that you're saying nobody complains about league, hearthstone, dota and tf2 all being online only and nobody complains because they're free in the first place, whereas everyone complained about sim city being online only because it was a $60 title that was a step back in every way from previous games and had severe server issues for the first few weeks of its launch preventing people from playing the game that they paid $60 for

So it appears that the owner / manager of Denuvo is Reinhard Blaukovitsch, the same Reinhard Blaukovitsch who used to be the VP of DigitalWorks at Sony DADC, the creators of SecuROM.

This does not instill confidence.

this has been covered in the thread multiple times

 

[Moral Panic]

How is it in Lords of The Fallen?

100% unobtrusive, other than that it's hard to tell.

 

[Total Cereal]

As long as the DRM is transparent and works as it should, I'm okay with it.

 

[HORRORSHØW]

yo dawg...

 

[Dick Justice]

Of course it will, Rockstar hates mods. The Steam version of SA was patched to kill the mp mod.

Kinda funny when you consider they used Icenhancer for the Meltdown film in GTA V.