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Tomb Raider PS4 Pro version vs PC Maxed out 4k screenshot comparison
- Thread starter Wishmaster92
- Start date
CyberPunked
Member
This. 4K on a console is futile due to the graphical sacrifices.
That's why they're putting effort into supporting and attempting to standardize reconstruction techniques instead of native or a simple upscale.
Soltype
Member
Are there any resolutions above 1080 that scale well with 4k?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
They said they're leaving it to the developers how to improve, at least thats what i got from the presentation.
i could see most devs settling on this anyway just due to the sheer amount of 1080p TVs out there
like if Mass Effect has a 1080p mode with sharper graphics and a smoother framerate similar to TR i'd gladly pick that over the 4K mode
Louis Cyphre
Banned
Looks to me you have plenty of choices,
http://www.thesixthaxis.com//2016/0...raider-on-ps4-pro-has-three-graphics-options/
These are:
4K
High Frame Rate 1080p
Enhanced Visuals 1080p
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Rise of the Tomb Raider will have a 1080p ultra graphics mode. I have been extremely bitter about this game, but I might pick it up on Black Friday. SE and CD are doing a good job of mending fences....just don't ever do it again though.
4K is 1080p (2K) doubled in both the horizontal and the vertical. There's no intermediary that scales well.
I think there may be some misconceptions about how scaling works (I am NOT a expect!), but having IE 1440p which is twice+ the information of 1080p, I would seem it probably to see it resulting in a better IQ then 1080p.
I don't seem to remember people advocating 720p Tv's over 1080p Tv's last gen.
From personal experience/experimenting, higher res is almost always better (there are exceptions), even though it does not scale perfectly 1:2, 1: 4, etc.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
You don't need an even multiplier for things to scale well anymore. 1440, 1600 or 1800p resolution will look far better scaled up to 4K than 1080p even though 1080 is an even multiplier.
The only exception I can think of is some low res pixel art, and only if you want to scale it up preserving sharp, big pixels.
Agreed. Unfortunately, I think most people lack perspective on just how demanding 4K is and what sort of cuts are required to play nice with PS4 Pro. Comparing PS4 Pro's screens against the PC version at 1440P/4K running on most likely ultra settings is never going to go in the favor of PS4 Pro.
The other side of the coin are people who are expecting Scorpio to come out and just absolutely destroy PS4 Pro and hang with the PC 4K release. They'll be equally disappointed I predict. A lot of the features like advanced tesselation, higher resolution shadow maps, VXAO, etc. are nice if you have the hardware, but most developers would cut them in favor of something that offers a more obvious visual benefit.
In any case- the PS4 Pro render comes into the ballpark of mid-level PC performance and is a huge step up in nearly every regard over the PS4/Xbox One counterpart. The criticisms levied against the machine are one thing, but any one expecting a $399 box to perform 4K hat tricks is fooling themselves. What you have here is a facsimile that captures the spirit and essence of higher end PC hardware.
Also those of you who are excited about 1080p, the extra anti-aliasing and amped up settings will benefit you tremendously
.
LordOfChaos
Member
Ok
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=213888198&highlight=#post213888198
?
You made it sound like checkerboard rendering was just rendering the full resolution in different blocks, rather than recompositing previous frame information + guesstimating 2x2 blocks to fill 4x4.
Indeed.
How did any of them comments = uprendering is the same as native?
the more we discuss 4k.......the more I realize the TV I have coming next monday is probably just going to be returned for a really nice low latency TV in 1080p. I'm starting to think they pushed the gun way to early on 4k. There are almost no options out there and any of the good sets to even hit the UHD Premium standard pretty much all start at like.....$2.5k
but then it even gets better!!!!
http://www.cnet.com/news/vizio-says-new-tv-certification-program-has-serious-problems/
but then it even gets better!!!!
http://www.cnet.com/news/vizio-says-new-tv-certification-program-has-serious-problems/
Chill Penguin
Member
Why, would that make you feel better? PS4 and Xbox One S are not advertising itself as a 4K gaming console. Of course it's going to look better than old consoles, but is it going to deliver a good 4K experience is the question.
Chill Penguin
Member
Agree, i think this 4K gaming push is one or two years too early. I'm starting to have doubts that even Scorpio will be able to deliver an uncompromised 4K experience within 12 months. Sony and Microsoft should've both just pushed out new consoles in 2018.
Astral Dog
Member
would the game son the Pro be less louder if played on normal mode?
SolidChamp
Banned
Posted this three pages back and no one has an opinion?
Omnii-chan
Member
You know, for an overclocked 2013 console, it's pretty damn impressive it can manage this level of graphical fidelity.
I know its slightly blurrier than native 4k, but think about the specs here vs what a pc needs to pump out the native 4k, not to mention the cost.
If this is anything to go by, PS4 Pro checkerboard 4k will look great. If I get a Pro I'll probably be playing it on a monitor, not a huge tv, so it'll look nearly identical to 4k.
I know its slightly blurrier than native 4k, but think about the specs here vs what a pc needs to pump out the native 4k, not to mention the cost.
If this is anything to go by, PS4 Pro checkerboard 4k will look great. If I get a Pro I'll probably be playing it on a monitor, not a huge tv, so it'll look nearly identical to 4k.
You are correct.
I'd like to jump on the 4k train, but then I think of the price of a good monitor / TV. Going from a monitor with 10.5 ms input lag, I feel like it'd be hard to transition to anything that's not worth more than my PC.
SmartWaffles
Member
We don't know which game has what kind of improvement yet, it is likely going to be a per-game basis.
chromatic9
Member
If the render cost is 2x 1080p checkerboard, ie ~4 million pixels or 15-1600p or rendering at 1800p then 2x the GPU power is going to be spent on twice the pixels/res.
ROTTR has 3 modes, an attempt to improve res for 4kTV owners by upscaling from 15-1600p-1800p, 1080p 30 with highest settings possible and an unlocked frame rate flirting with 40-60. Seems a lot want 1080p 30 and use that 2tflops for settings, rather than a half way house resolution or failing to achieve a locked 60 if the CPU is holding back in other games.
HDR is a separate thing, its supposed to be coming to Nvidia Pascal with ROTTR on the list as well. I'm sure this adds greatly to PS4 Pro games, no one is saying otherwise, as it will on Xbox One with Forza etc. It's a new industry standard finally coming in, res, textures, and so on will still be there.
They put a GPU that has twice the power, its not overclocked, the CPU is.
So far it looks like nothing out of the ordinary is happening, it's got a consumer $200 GPU that cost Sony a lot less in a $400 box rendering 15-1800p. It's not up there with a GTX 1080 or competing with $1500-2000 rigs, its doing what a cheap rig could today at current prices. That's the perspective here, people say its close to 4k or close to 1080 rigs are writing off every GPU before and the cost.
Also I would hope things improve because we're looking at worse than 1440 which shouldn't be happening so how people are pumping this up is quite odd, it should look better than 1440p for starters. Lets hope it does.
2blackcats
Member
Funny to think we probably wouldn't have gotten that mode if it wasn't for the Microsoft money hat.
Broman1978
Junior Member
I just had to boot up Rise of The Tomb Raider on my Xbox One S and 4KTV. Damn, I said DAMN that game looks still good! Especially upscaled to 4K.
GhostTrick
Banned
And that's just normal 1080p stretched to a 4K display. A 1080p mode with much better AA, or better yet, a 4K reprojected checkerboard mode would bring far greater results.
A scorpio native 4K mode would be the absolute pinnacle of console IQ
It all depends on preference. I hate jaggies so I tend to opt for higher resolution. If you want to play the game with effects maxed out and don't mind a slightly softer image than 1080p max is the way to go.
Reallink
Member
There were no direct view (non projection) native 720p TVs, they were all 1366x768 or 1024x768. 720p was also relegated to the low end (second rate panels, lack of features) very early on in PS360's life, so they weren't models someone looking for PQ bought or recommended. 1080p was obviously the clear future proof buy.
GhostTrick
Banned
Mark Cerny ? You mean the guy trying to sell PS4 Pro ? Damn, he couldn't possibly use nice words to make his upcoming product sounds nice, right ? Like "supercharged PC architecture" rendering "4k in an efficient manner".
This is no native 4k. This isn't an efficient way to render 4k.
A lot better. PS4 Pro is more comparable to RX 470. Basically, it's like when PS4 was closer, physically to HD7870, because it had the same number of CU (although two were disabled) but because of the low clockspeed, it was more comparable to an HD7850.
PS4 Pro has the same number of CU as RX 480, so 36CU, but because of it's low clockspeed, it's actually slower than RX 470.
f@luS
More than a member.
Check out the YouTube video of rotr ps4 on a 4K video , it's amazing even more
Yes, 1800p for example and others. Although what res and what upscale/reconstruction technique a dev uses will depend on what suits their game's visual profile, as well as their performance, best. For example, to cite Jonathan Blow, I think he was saying that for a 1080p TV target spending less on resolution (e.g. 1440p ) and more on MSAA and LOD may be a better fit for improving The Witness's visuals overall than a higher resolution (e.g 1800p or 2x1080p).
Slower in clock-rate, but more powerful, lest anyone get confused. edit - but not with the boost clock! sorry to add to confusion! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units
LOL what is it doing then?
BONKERS
Member
The Pro version looks is super fuzzy and blurrier without actually solving any aliasing issues.
Which is not surprising. They have to try and do something to make the sub native rendering look less like turd.
No amount of upscaling or algorithmic trickery will ever look close to native res rendering with good AA>
Which you can now finally get with 1080p output instead of shoving the same shit we've been dealing with for the last decade down everyone's throats. Except now the resolution differential will be even bigger compared to 1080p with more artifacts due to more heavy handed temporal processing and checkerboard rendering. But partially less noticeable in other ways.
PS4Pro should be the console championing better IQ, graphics and performance at 1080p. Finally what the PS4 should've been from day 1.
The TV industry should have stuck with 2k and introduced 10-bit and HDR with 1080p sets instead. (Though extra input lag would still be an issue. Thanks TV industry!)
4k useless for the vast majority of content, and consoles are no exception.
Which is not surprising. They have to try and do something to make the sub native rendering look less like turd.
No amount of upscaling or algorithmic trickery will ever look close to native res rendering with good AA>
Which you can now finally get with 1080p output instead of shoving the same shit we've been dealing with for the last decade down everyone's throats. Except now the resolution differential will be even bigger compared to 1080p with more artifacts due to more heavy handed temporal processing and checkerboard rendering. But partially less noticeable in other ways.
PS4Pro should be the console championing better IQ, graphics and performance at 1080p. Finally what the PS4 should've been from day 1.
The TV industry should have stuck with 2k and introduced 10-bit and HDR with 1080p sets instead. (Though extra input lag would still be an issue. Thanks TV industry!)
4k useless for the vast majority of content, and consoles are no exception.
GhostTrick
Banned
RX 470 has 32CU at 1200mhz. That's 4.9Tflops. The clockspeed far more than make up the 4 less CUs.
Let's say it's an efficient way to render at fauxK or 4Kinda
This isn't 4k. Plain and simple. IQ is far better than 1080p for sure. But also lesser than 4k.
RX 470 has 32CU at 1200mhz. That's 4.9Tflops. The clockspeed far more than make up the 4 less CUs.
Let's say it's an efficient way to render at fauxK or 4Kinda
This isn't 4k. Plain and simple. IQ is far better than 1080p for sure. But also lesser than 4k.
How many unique pixels are being rendered to the final frame? is it not ~8294400 in the games that are checkerboard 4K ? & what about the games that are native 4K on PS4 Pro?
martino
Member
saying it brings the best console experience for 4K tv is not saying it's rendering near 4k native resolution quality.
don't let fanboy put words in his mouth.
GhostTrick
Banned
You said it yourself: What about native 4K on PS4 Pro ?
Why is there indeed a distinction ? Temporal reprojection or whatever technique isn't native or "more efficient way to render at said resolution". It's a loss in IQ that you can notice. Why ? Because it's not native.
The fact that in the end, you get as much pixels doesn't matter if in the end, you got this result through approximations and tricks.
martino
Member
This is silly lol everything that has every been rendered in a video game has been through approximations and tricks.
What story does it tell?
No.
With the checkerboard technique being discussed here, 4147200 samples are shaded per frame.
Oh sorry, I was looking at the table here, and the floating point figures which seem to be from the base clock. Didn't even see the boost clock!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units
But it's also being resolve with the pixels from the previous frame. the final frame has ~8294400.
Triggerhappytel
Member
I would be happy if devs took the opportunity with the increased power to try and hit 1080p60fps. We haven't even hit that this gen (I was going to say 'hit that consistently', but barely any
Non-Nintendo