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Automotive Discussion Thread | OT2 | Zero to pointless fighting faster than a GT86
- Thread starter AlphaSnake
- Start date
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Wow. Jaguar cut the price of the F-Type V6 by $3600, which brings MSRP to 62K. And invoice to $58K. That's incredible value for this car. And there are tunes out there for the standard V6 that increase the boost to the OEM 380HP of the S-model.
Standard close ratio 6MT
Standard Navigation
Standard Harmon/Kardon Surround Audio
Standard Exhaust Insanity
Standard Leather
Standard Bi-Xenon Headlights + LED Tailights
Standard EliteCar 5 Year/60K Mile Warranty.
This car is now officially a bargain.
http://www.autoblog.com/2015/11/12/2017-jaguar-f-type-price-cut-official/
Standard close ratio 6MT
Standard Navigation
Standard Harmon/Kardon Surround Audio
Standard Exhaust Insanity
Standard Leather
Standard Bi-Xenon Headlights + LED Tailights
Standard EliteCar 5 Year/60K Mile Warranty.
This car is now officially a bargain.
http://www.autoblog.com/2015/11/12/2017-jaguar-f-type-price-cut-official/
Dang that's a great price for a sexy car
And wait, did I read that right that it's a 2017 car?!
Good pricing for this car now.
....In the US.
Here in Canada that car starts base at $78,000. Wish we had the us pricing here on alot of vehicles, some of the luxury brands pricing is leaps and bounds higher than the US, while the exchange rate plays into this for some reason the pricing gap jumps when you enter into the "luxury" segment as the standard brands are closer in terms of pricing gaps.
YuriLowell
Member
So since its a Jag, it will be down to 25k in two years.
whatsinaname
Member
But can't you say that for any car in that price segment (other than Porsches).
Depreciation of the F-Types don't seem that bad. Though this official price drop will make it worse for current owners.
Wow, that is excellent news. I wish I could afford one. Still, would you rather have a base F-Type at 62k or a base Cayman at 52k? (2016 pricing on the Cayman) The Jag is utterly beautiful but the Cayman is hot as well and will most likely hold its value better down the road. If I had the means that would be a very tough call.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Which is completely untrue. 2014 V8 S are still going for $70-80K at the dealers, only 20-30% below their original value and ahead of their predicted depreciation curve right now.
Frustrated_me
Member
I don't think this has been posted, but Randy Pobst posted a new lap record at Laguna Seca in the 2016 Viper ACR with a lap time of 1:28.65, beating out the Porsche 918 and McLaren P1.
Viper ACR record lap at Laguna Seca
The ACR now holds records at 13 tracks
Viper ACR record lap at Laguna Seca
The ACR now holds records at 13 tracks
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
The ACR is basically a GT racer, so I'm not terribly surprised, nor do I think it's all that impressive. When you're talking 1000lbs of downforce at 90mph you're not talking "road car".
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Great news!
Jaguar's announced all Jaguar XE 2.0T/25T models will be available with a 6MT in the United States. This will be the new 2.0T Ingenium motor, and not the oldhat Ford powerplant Jag's been depleting their stock pile of.
Jaguar's announced all Jaguar XE 2.0T/25T models will be available with a 6MT in the United States. This will be the new 2.0T Ingenium motor, and not the oldhat Ford powerplant Jag's been depleting their stock pile of.
Great news!
Jaguar's announced all Jaguar XE 2.0T/25T models will be available with a 6MT in the United States. This will be the new 2.0T Ingenium motor, and not the oldhat Ford powerplant Jag's been depleting their stock pile of.
Jaguar's doing it right these days. Very, very nice.
LucidMomentum
Member
If I win the lottery, my mom wants me to buy her a Jaguar.
I have no issues with that.
Oh please. If it was a Porsche you'd be fellating them right now.
Viper ACR beating down 1+ million hypercars lol
YuriLowell
Member
Goddamn S65 is a PIA to work on. Fucking unreal how there is no room.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
No not really. It's an aero car so comparing it to even supercars is a little silly. They're hugely inefficient, difficult to drive and require a very experienced race driver to push to the limits. It's just not a sports car at all, it's a race car that you can put a plate on.
I mean that's cool and all, but it's silly. I care about it being very fast about as much as I care about the Ariel Atom V8 being fast. Of course it's fast, if it weren't it'd be embarrassing.
SliChillax
Member
You're talking as if the ACR is a Zonda R. The ACR is road legal and therefore it is a street car as much as a Porsche 918. So because a car has great aerodynamic engineering put into it and requires good skills to drive means it's not a real car? What the hell? These are the cars that driving enthusiast always ask for. That's like saying of course the Bugatti reaches 400kmh, it has 1000hp therefore it is irrelevant.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
No I'm saying it's basically a track car that doesn't make sense on the road. Radical makes a host of cars that are faster than anything out there and they're road legal but...they're not really road cars, they're just legal to drive on the road.
This is not to say that it isn't an impressive vehicle, but at a certain point you start blurring the line between street and race and it stops making sense, at least in my eyes. Heck, the spring rates in the thing are a hair's breath away from the spring rates in actual GT2/3 race cars.
Edit: In another way, if you're going to go so far with a street car for the track, at a certain point it's going to be useless on the road so you may as well strip the thing and make it an actual race car. Take an ACR, strip it out, put a roll cage and other safety equipment in, put slicks on it, go to town. Why ruin a road car by making it too track oriented. Reviewers are saying that about the 911 GT3RS, can you imagine what they'd think of the ACR?
SliChillax
Member
The ACR is a road car which is extremely capable on a track. It's not comparable to an Atom or a Radical in that sense. It's not as extreme as you make it out to be. It's just a really powerful RWD manual car with modern luxury options inside that normals cars also have. Just because it has good aero and a big wing doesn't make it comparable to a Radical since it's based on a perfectly usable car like the normal Viper. It doesn't have to be a Golf to be considered a road car. We're not comparing the Viper to F-Types etc, we're comparing it to track monsters like the 918 and P1 which by your book shouldn't be considered normal road cars. If you can't see the blurred line between those then I don't know where the hell you're seeing it in the Viper. The P1 even has a track mode that goes so low it's ridiculous.
Also come on, just look at the interiors of both. I don't see the blurred line between road car and extreme racing car here like the Radical.
lem0n
Member
I know most of you here drive higher end cars, but I've been driving a '14 Soul for the past few days, and man, what a car! It's sort of like the new Mazdas, they feel more upmarket than they actually are. If I could get the package I wanted with the manual transmission, I would probably pick one up for myself.
SliChillax
Member
Definitely not bad cars but you could get something used and exciting for the price of a Soul. As a driving enthusiast that's what I would do but I know that comparing new cars to used is apples to oranges.
lem0n
Member
I have an NA Miata for fun drives, it only comes out when I want to thrash a manual, RWD car. I may have to start commuting here soon so it fits the bill perfectly for me so far. I considered the Fiesta ST but I think it may be too small. I want something a bit more roomy.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Don't focus too much on a comparison with the Radical, I used the Radical only as an example that just because something is street legal doesn't make it a road car. Ultimately we're talking about a car that's been mostly stripped (no carpets, under the hatch are steel and brake ducts), is on very hard track springs with manually adjustable dampers, has the biggest tires of any car available ever, and has a huge wing that lets it pull 1.5g through corners at speed. The P1, the 918, for everything they are, are designed to be usable outside of the track and are set up as such. They can be quiet, they can be comfortable at the touch of the button, etc. They're not just track cars, which is absolutely what the ACR is.
Again, yes, it's very impressive, but for everything I mentioned before, it should be. You put that wing and splitter on the P1 or 918 and they'd walk away from the ACR, but that's not their point.
I'm not quite sure why the great track supercars of today and the past avoided great big aero packages, but they have. My first guess is that lots of aero downforce is a very dangerous proposition for untrained drivers at the limit.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Okay whatever. This isn't me sucking Porsche's dick, I just don't find the Viper's times all that impressive considering what it is.
Well no, they're impressive, but I don't see much sense in comparing it to other sports cars, because it's really just a track car.
Well no, they're impressive, but I don't see much sense in comparing it to other sports cars, because it's really just a track car.
SliChillax
Member
You do realize that the P1 and 918 have HUGE retractable wings? Hell, the P1 generates so much downforce the wing goes down at high speeds so it wont damage the suspension. So we're talking about a 900hp and 664lb ft/902nm of INSTANT torque, lower weight than the Viper, just as much if not better aero, stripped down cabin compared to the Viper which has more features etc etc and all you're saying is "meh"? Well obviously the ACR is track focused, so are all hypercars. Did you forget that the P1 in its Race mode is not street legal?
It's like having a Golf, an Astra and another similar car in the same category that costs just as much (or less) but consumes way less fuel due to it's hybrid system and carbon chassis. Should we say bravo to that imaginary company that made such an awesome city car by being innovative or are you going to say "meh", it was obvious that it would be more fuel efficient. Well no shit, same case here. SRT engineers pulled the Viper ahead by innovating and bringing it on top. They didn't invent a teleporting system to make finish the track in seconds so I'm kinda baffled by how you're reacting to it. It's like people were comparing the Viper to a Golf, not hypercars that have very aggressive RACE/TRACK modes and active aero.
SliChillax
Member
As much as I love and admire naturally aspirated engines especially during these times where they tend to disappear, the car desperately needs more torque. If I had to buy a GT86 I wouldn't be satisfied with the power which would force me to drop more money into it which means I could have bought a more powerful car in the first place. Yeah it's not all about power obviously, I'm not the kind of guy who judges cars by the specs on paper but the GT86 has never been on my radar because of the lack of torque mostly, not hp.
I hear with a stage 2 socket wrench you can get plenty of torque out of the BRZs 8.6L engine
I would've suggested e85 and some boltons but I apparently that only helps with 60-0 acceleration times, not torque like you mentioned. However with the navigation package you can see more cars on the radar, but personally I feel that isn't something to worry about considering it's a drivers car for auto track cross canyons.
Hope this helps, again just my 2/10ths of a cent
jongkookie
Member
Imagine if you got a stage 3 torque wrench instead? You'll be getting torques out of the wazoo!
Honestly what the Toyobaru really needs to do is to admit defeat and say that the Mazda Miata is better in every single way. Once that happens, it'll pave the way for a Mazda-powered rotary in the next FRGTBZ-68 chassis and it'll finally be the proper car it's supposed to be, not the disappointment it currently stands right now.
That said, if you absolutely cannot wait, I've heard from Civic owners that a sticker adds 5hp and 5 torques too... just grab 10 stickers and strategically place them on your car, that should get you 250 hp and 200 ft-lb of torques.
SliChillax
Member
What I mean is that 200hp is ok, but the torque is not. If the BRZ came with a smaller displacement engine and a turbo, making around 200hp but way more torque, it would be more fun to drive but then you would lose the engine precision a NA engine gives you and suffer from turbo lag. I'm just rambling because I don't think I'll ever get a BRZ, I'm not too into the aftermarket tuning scene unless I'm buying a used car. I was thinking about doing something to my M235i then the M2 came out which makes me just sell it and wait for the M2 prices to go down after 2 years so I can get it used at a good price with less than 15,000km.
But the Miata is not a superior car. A convertible can never be as good a coupe chassis wise. I also keep hearing people saying that the BRZ has better steering feel, better manual transmission, better chassis control etc. I've also seen reviewers mention it. Here's a good video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0om4AKnpOjs
jongkookie
Member
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Dude, what I'm saying is that for all these hypercars or what have you, GT3 race cars are still faster around a track. If you want to make a car that's faster than a P1 or 918 it ain't even that hard. It's just a matter of moving more towards the realm of race chassis setup and aero, which compromises what makes a road car a road car.
Hell, every time I go to a track day I see cars faster than them around a track, but that doesn't really mean anything because those cars are completely different animals.
To your analogy about fuel efficient cars, if the imaginary car gets much better fuel mileage but only seats one person and maxes out at 40mph, is that really an accomplishment?
And FYI the viper generates 50% more downforce than the P1.
Road & Track had their 2016 performance car of the year and the ACR was just faster then the Z06. Both faster then the 488 GTB.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a27194/road-track-2016-performance-car-of-the-year/
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Much credit to the Z06, then. Looks like it has the better chassis and mechanical grip.
mmazurkiewicz
Member
do you have the same opinion of the GT4, GT3, and GT3RS?
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Yes with the RS, though there are people who use them as dailies (but they need PASM and the hydraulic nose lift for sure). The GT3 and 4 are compliant enough to use as dailies without question, even if 99% of them are second cars that only see weekend duty.
A lot of it comes down to whether or not the car is setup to deal with public roads or race tracks. The GT3 and 4 are on the road side of things, the RS leans more towards the track, and as the Road and Track guys said about the Viper ACR:
Road and Track said:
They also said it made the Z06 look like a luxury car. I just don't buy it as a road car.
SliChillax
Member
Yeah I'm stupid. I thought he was serious and didn't want to be rude to correct him about what he said but apparently I totally missed the joke. I kept thinking the whole time what an idiot lol turns out that was me.
Hey guys,
Whats your opinion on Infiniti G25X AWDs?
There is one on sale for about 16K with 24K miles on it.
I currently drive a 1999 Nissan Maxima with about 220K miles on it. So its kind of on its last legs.
Will the car handle the snow and have enough HP to be ok while commuting for about 50 miles a day.
Also will I get better gas mileage?
Whats your opinion on Infiniti G25X AWDs?
There is one on sale for about 16K with 24K miles on it.
I currently drive a 1999 Nissan Maxima with about 220K miles on it. So its kind of on its last legs.
Will the car handle the snow and have enough HP to be ok while commuting for about 50 miles a day.
Also will I get better gas mileage?
djSyndrome
Member
As an FR-S owner, these statements are bullshit. The 86 is 'good enough' or even 'above average' in most areas, but all of the controls are far better in a Miata.
We got our first snow of the year this morning. I looked outside and immediately regretted not picking the WRX.
Stick with a G37x. The smaller engine is anemic.
How bad is the engine compared to my current (1999 Nissan Maxima) car's engine? Will I notice the difference?
I was interested in it due to better gas mileage...
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Yes, the G25 was largely hated by most. It didn't sell very well, and only offered a 1MPG improvement over the G35/G37. It's 215HP doesn't go a long way compared to your 190HP Maxima because it is also 600lbs heavier than your Maxima and loses more power to the ground because it is AWD (22% drivetrain loss vs 15%). So it'll actually feel slower than your Max.
There is literally NO advantage the 25 has over the G35X. So just find a clean 2010+ G35X/G37X and jump on it. You won't regret it. These cars are built like tanks and run for 150K miles without any major issues. General maintenance will keep them running for a long time.
SliChillax
Member
Well that's a first.
I agree with Dave. The ACR is a fucking beast of a car, but it's a single minded track machine. I know someone who has had 2 of the older ones, and the new one on order. He never drives them on the street. They are super harsh and loud. Heavy clutch, exhaust and engine noises give you a headache, the suspension is crazy taut, and those wide sticky tires pick up everything on the road and wear fast. It just wants to GO all the time and it feels like such wasted potential driving it in traffic. Like putting a leash on a tiger. The GT3 was similar, but not as loud or crazy. Haven't been in an RS, thought I would assume that it's a terrible street car like the Viper if it's rougher than the standard car and has rollcage and bucket seats.
But like I posted from my drive earlier, the GT4 is a perfectly compliant street car. It's not made to set lap records, but just supposed to be a fun sports car. Ride was smooth, drivetrain and road noise was minimal, valvetronic exhaust makes it quite when you want it to be, and it still has all the Cayman niceties as options if you want like Nav, heated seats, decent sound system, etc.
The guy who's GT4 I drove owns that as his daily. He's even going to put winter tires on it this season when it gets cold in Chicago.
But like I posted from my drive earlier, the GT4 is a perfectly compliant street car. It's not made to set lap records, but just supposed to be a fun sports car. Ride was smooth, drivetrain and road noise was minimal, valvetronic exhaust makes it quite when you want it to be, and it still has all the Cayman niceties as options if you want like Nav, heated seats, decent sound system, etc.
The guy who's GT4 I drove owns that as his daily. He's even going to put winter tires on it this season when it gets cold in Chicago.