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[grap3fruitman]

dayum. I'm a lightweight compared to you. I've only been through 5 360s this gen.

"only"

What possessed you to keep getting these things fixed or replaced? Were they in warranty every time or what?

In that screen grab, there are only four Xbox 360s that I purchased. Each time I was sent back a different one. The two at the bottom, the Jasper and S both function, though the S started giving disc read errors at certain parts.

The first one was a launch system and that kept going out a lot but it still only had the one year warranty. I tried repairing it myself based on guides online after the warranty ended. That didn't work...

Then the Elites came out in 2007! "Oh, these ones are new and don't have the same fault. They've been extra stress-tested by Microsoft!" At this point I've got a fair amount of games and DLC so I'm kind of committed. Plus three people in my house actively use the thing so I bite. It did break less often... but it still broke often.

Shortly after the Elite is released, Microsoft announces the three-year extended warranty so I kept using that until we got the Jasper at a Walmart deal ($200 for system and $100 gift card). That still runs great. Eventually got a Kinect bundle because of a pricing error at Dell so it was still a good deal and it was an excuse to get Dance Central.

No offense, but whose fault is this? I mean, fool me once, shame on you. And you know the rest. There's brand loyalty and then there's puzzling behavior such as yours. I would have said fuck it after the second time. You know what? That's exactly what I did.

You have to consider the timing (PS3 was a joke until like 2009), the fact that I was committed with several games and DLC, other people in my home actively used the thing, and that Microsoft was replacing it for free for a long time.

You just provided them 7 years of evidence that you're going to keep coming back to them even when they send you legitimately broken equipment on a monthly basis. Why would they do you a "solid" when you're obviously going to pay for it when they don't?

"Coming back" because I'm stuck with it or I lose hundreds of dollars in XBLA, DLC (thanks Rockband) and retail games. All of which is likely not going to carry over and I have no intention of being fucked over again next gen.

This entire ordeal has made me almost stop playing games entirely. You also have to consider the fact that the same people accusing me of being stupid on this forum now were then accusing me of "doing it wrong" and blaming me for all the system failures. It wasn't known for a long time just how faulty their hardware was.

2. Server Outages

As recent example of the Sim City and Diablo 3 launches, it's not always just about YOUR internet, it's about THEIR servers. Shit breaks.

Consider that every time a new game launches, the multiplayer is always borked and never works day one. How's that going to work when every game requires you to be connected all the time? Nothing's going to work ever.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Successful troll I must admit.

 

[oVerde]

Rumors don't affect inner projects of announcements like this. They're just rumors. When it's announced all rumors will be squashed or replaced with new ones based on the announcement.

It would hurt them so much more with investors to look so reactionary to some mid-level guy making an ass of himself on twitter. A console announcement is on a completely different level.

Yeah people are already declaring the console war won and other stupid shit like that, the internet has such short memory considering what the rumours surrounding the PS4 were before it was shown.

 

[Boss Man]

And even then "always online" doesn't necessarily mean "requires online." Hell, even Nintendo figured that out years ago with WiiConnect24.

It doesn't, but in context obviously it does. Otherwise it wouldn't be talked about.

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

Which has nothing to do with always online and could be accomplished perfectly without an internet connection.

Jesus, do you even know what the word "online" means? Serious question.

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

 

[BurnOutBrighter]

I don't mean to slippery slope it like the MS guy did, but is he wrong? My power goes off more often than my internet does.

Ah yes, the old "this is my experience so it must be like this for everyone" fallacy.

 

[mightynine]

Rumors don't affect inner projects of announcements like this. They're just rumors. When it's announced all rumors will be squashed or replaced with new ones based on the announcement.

It would hurt them so much more with investors to look so reactionary to some mid-level guy making an ass of himself on twitter. A console announcement is on a completely different level.

Uh.....what?

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

Ok, you're making it way too obvious now.

 

[GoofsterStud]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

You do realize the PS4 is always online, it just doesn't require online to function.

The next xbox requires you to always be online, if not your must troubleshoot your connection. Your game collection is held hostage until your troubleshooting has been resolved.

This is the difference.

 

[alr1ght]

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

So you really have no idea why people say always on DRM is bad.

 

[ido]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

What does that even mean?

You can have that, without it being a -requirement- to play.

 

[ascii42]

It doesn't, but in context obviously it does. Otherwise it wouldn't be talked about.

In Microsoft's case, yes. I worded it poorly, but I was trying to say that MS could be requiring online even though they don't need to for "always online" functionality, as Nintendo has demonstrated.

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

Ah yes, the old "this is my experience so it must be like this for everyone" fallacy.

How is it not equally fallacious to exaggerate about how fickle internet connections are. I know they're shit in certain areas, no one is trying to say that they're not.

 

[Snuggles]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

So you want your Xbox to have 4G? I'm so confused.

 

[Acorn]

Is this real life or is it just fantasy?

 

[DaBoss]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

This whole topic is about always online DRM.

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

You do realize the PS4 is always online, it just doesn't require online to function.

The next xbox requires you to always be online, if not your must troubleshoot your connection. Your game collection is held hostage until your troubleshooting has been resolved.

This is the difference.

Yes, the difference there is Sony has come out and explicitly stated as much.

I'm not going to come down on MS for something they haven't announced. I feel like gamers have the tendency to jump the gun and you guys are doing that right now.

 

[GoofsterStud]

At least he has a nice tie.

 

[ascii42]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

The iPhone doesn't require an internet connection at all times to perform that function. If it doesn't have one, it just waits until it does to perform downloads, backups, etc. Meanwhile, games and other apps that don't require an internet connection continue to work fine. See: Airplane mode.

 

[gazele]

How is it not equally fallacious to exaggerate about how fickle internet connections are. I know they're shit in certain areas, no one is trying to say that they're not.

Its not just the internet of the individual, its also the servers on Microsoft's side, ala simcity and diablo 3

 

[GoofsterStud]

Yes, the difference there is Sony has come out and explicitly stated as much.

I'm not going to come down on MS for something they haven't announced. I feel like gamers have the tendency to jump the gun and you guys are doing that right now.

We all hope Microsoft changes it's "rumored, supported from multiple sources, tweated, and developer confirmed by hints" decision.

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

The iPhone doesn't require an internet connection at all times to perform that function. If it doesn't have one, it just waits until it does to perform downloads, backups, etc.

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

So let that be an option you can turn on or off. You can leave a console online 24/7 even now. A phone is a bad analogy as it requires a constant connection so you can communicate over long distances and receive those calls any time of the day.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I'm not going to come down on MS for something they haven't announced. I feel like gamers have the tendency to jump the gun and you guys are doing that right now.

You know what, you're right. I don't even know why we're talking about this in the first place.

I feel that we're all jumping the gun on this Durango thing. Maybe Microsoft doesn't actually have a new console planned.

 

[GoofsterStud]

So let that be an option you can turn on or off. You can leave a console online 24/7 even now. A phone is a bad analogy as it requires a constant connection so you can communicate over long distances and receive those calls any time of the day.

I can still play Chu-Chu Rocket, Angry Birds, Sudoku, Use the calendar, check previously download mail, check previously downloaded text, etc...when I have no connection.

But not on the next Xbox. :-(

 

[Valkyria]

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

 

[inky]

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

You can't download things from the internet without being connected to the internet, that is correct.

Man, we are being trolled so masterfully. I'm out, you chumps can try explaining it to him, lol.

 

[Replicant]

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

The bolded is NOT what this thread is about. We're talking about not having access to games that we've purchased UNLESS you're always online.

 

[Crimson_Gold]

You know what, you're right. I don't even know why we're talking about this in the first place.

I feel that we're all jumping the gun on this Durango thing. Maybe Microsoft doesn't actually have a new console planned.

But Gies promised there would be one dripping in secret sauce

 

[watership]

We all hope Microsoft changes it's "rumored, supported from multiple sources, tweated, and developer confirmed by hints" decision.

I still wonder why we haven't heard one single good leak. No one else finds that odd? Even something like remotely positive. Not a one.

 

[ascii42]

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

Yes, a feature that requires internet connection. Not the whole phone. Offline features of the phone work fine when it's in airplane mode. Durango requiring internet connectivity would be like if the iPhone didn't have an airplane mode, and instead became completely useless on a plane because you had to turn it completely off.

Is this making any sense to you? Without an internet connection, you wouldn't just be losing those cool features that require internet connectivity. You'd be losing literally every feature of the device.

 

[DaBoss]

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

Do some reading up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Always-on_DRM

It has a really simple explanation.

 

[Mengy]

My bad I'm looking at a few different discussions I started up a page back.

Back on topic, if handled similarly to how mobile devices do it then I welcome always online. I've come to love instant downloads on my iPhone, it's another perk that would not be possible without a constant internet connection.

It waits, meaning it can't be done without being connected to the network. It's a feature that requires internet usage.

I...don't think you fully comprehend just what this thread is about. Meaning you don't understand what "always online" for the Xbox720 truly would mean. It's okay, you aren't alone in your ignorance, but ... yeah, you just aren't "getting it".

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

Yes, a feature that requires internet connection. Not the whole phone. Offline features of the phone work fine when it's in airplane mode. Durango requiring internet connectivity would be like if the iPhone didn't have an airplane mode, and instead became completely useless.

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

 

[blackflag]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Are you old enough to have an account here?

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

forget it, we're done yet in this thread. people still don't understand what always online is apparently.

 

[GoofsterStud]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Multiple sources different times, multiple legit sources, tweet response, and third party developers basically confirming.

I'm glad we got this clarified.

Trust me, English is hard. It's taken me time to get this bad.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Did you just support always online?

I support it. Can you give a concise reason against it other than "my internet might go out"?

So, uh, still want to pretend you understand you know what you're talking about or what.

 

[DaBoss]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Where there's smoke, there's a fire. It's been rumored countless times, his stance on always-online DRM, and it has been hinted on GAF too.

If it isn't true, then that is great, but it is looking like it is true. The more people who are aware, then there will be more people who be knowledgeable about this. If enough of a ruckus is made, then they could change the system potentially.

And what you said in your first sentence, that is what always-online DRM prevents you from doing.

 

[Revven]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

I'm out for the night.

 

[MikeXXIeaf]

I...don't think you fully comprehend just what this thread is about. Meaning you don't understand what "always online" for the Xbox720 truly would mean. It's okay, you aren't alone in your ignorance, but ... yeah, you just aren't "getting it".

It's not a matter of ignorance. I'm stepping away from the always-on DRM debate because the Xbox has not been confirmed for it yet.

No amount of discussion can take away from the fact it's all rumor based. I came into the thread to discuss the comments MS man made on Twitter.

 

[JWong]

Just curious,how come now one complained about WoW being online only?

Gies is that you?

 

[Vire]

Are you old enough to have an account here?

I was thinking the same thing...

Unless we are all being masterfully trolled.

 

[railGUN]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Go home Stan... You're drunk.

 

[Darryl]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

These rumors have been coming for ages and really rumors from good sources aren't frequently wrong. They predicted the PS4. They predicted the Wii U. What happened in the OP is close to confirmation that their current plan is always-online.

 

[ascii42]

I never said I was in favor of this thing not letting you play while offline. That's crazy, and I don't want to sit here and say we shouldn't discuss the possibility but at the same time I'm wondering why people are so sure the rumors are true.

Well, do you at least understand the confusion caused by saying this?

I support it. Can you give a concise reason against it other than "my internet might go out"?

It seems like you understood then that internet going out would cause a problem. Otherwise... what did you think that reason meant?


And it doesn't matter if the rumors are true. We are discussing why it would be such a bad idea for any company to implement them, whether it's MS or Sony.

 

[DaBoss]

Gies is that you?

Read further, Syphon was mocking Gies.

 

[SirMossyBloke]

So if we're to assume that the rumour of the 3 minute allowance is correct, every game must have a save anywhere feature right? If my Internet goes down and 3 minutes later I'm kicked to the dashboard without it saving, I'd be pissed.

Unless every game has a cloud save instance like free to play games. Either way, urgh.

 

[Cidd]

forget it, we're done yet in this thread. people still don't understand what always online is apparently.

I'm very surprised by some of the responses I'm seeing about "Always online DRM is a good thing" like wtf?

What part of taking away your freedom is a good thing?

Stop this planet I want off..

 

[Vire]

So if we're to assume that the rumour of the 3 minute allowance is correct, every game must have a save anywhere feature right? If my Internet goes down and 3 minutes later I'm kicked to the dashboard without it saving, I'd be pissed.

Unless every game has a cloud save instance like free to play games. Either way, urgh.

Here's a fix for you:

Don't buy the system.

Simple right?

 

[GoofsterStud]

So if we're to assume that the rumour of the 3 minute allowance is correct, every game must have a save anywhere feature right? If my Internet goes down and 3 minutes later I'm kicked to the dashboard without it saving, I'd be pissed.

Unless every game has a cloud save instance like free to play games. Either way, urgh.

OMG can you imagine coming back in the middle of that Street Fighter 3 gif? Their is no way that comeback would of happened. lol