Are they trying to hide the fact that this game is anime?
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Rumor: Bravely Second's "Tomahawk" class changed to a cowboy one (+ costume edit)
- Thread starter Eolz
- Start date
Are they trying to hide the fact that this game is anime?
looking at your twitter i can only assume you're one of the gamer gate, probably pro MRA people, so no big loss
No, more like PixyJunket is the black friend (sorry Pixy, don't mean to speak for you). And the black guy's friend is getting offended on his behalf even though hes actually kinda ok with it.
What makes it pity though if we're respecting the wishes of another culture and what they want? I see it as understanding on what we're doing is wrong and offensive to their culture and important steps of self awareness that allow us all to better live in harmony with each other.
Should we continue to do nothing which causes more fighting or should we open up, listen and change because we're the ones being disrespectful?
Dude I'm a liberal, just not radical left. I made a tweet calling Donald Trump a racist prick a mere hours ago.
Silver Arrows
Banned
sensui-tomo
Member
Detective gaf snooping around again? seriously i thought mods were sick of that shit.
Silver Arrows
Banned
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
being liberal doesn't preclude you from being a delusional gamergate follower.
AtomskEater
Member
Pixy also said that his wife was fine with how revealing the costumes were, which is why I went for the "black friend" argument instead of something else.
Maybe a lot of people with Native American ancestry are okay with it, and some aren't. Do we bring in a full-blooded, culturally practicing Native American to be tiebreaker?
There's a line separating being disrespectful and admiration/respect for another culture. I think too much has moved into the territory of 'disrespectful' when it really isn't,.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
First Nations is more referring to a specific group of indigenous people and not all those of Aboriginal descent in Canada. For example, Métis and Inuit are a part of Canada's Aboriginal population but do not fall under the term "First Nations". Either way, I agree that the use of "Indian" to describe the indigenous population of North America is jarring to see it used in 2015.
sensui-tomo
Member
Assumptions... what a great way to be an ass, and dont be snooping into people's personal shit... its creepy, like the people who do it on twitter and are actually GGers who spy have spied on people.
Now on the topic on hand, I like the costume (but thats because i like lewd stuff) but yeah. I see how someone would be offended by it easily, and at least they are not getting rid of the class and abilities, just changing some stuff up... nothing gone = A-OK in my book.
the link was in his profile, no snooping required. and when someone flies off the handle like that you can only be so curious.
KuwabaraTheMan
Banned
The opinions of Native American people (in whatever form they wish to be addressed as) is obviously important. In fact, it's the most important thing when it comes to this subject.
Those opinions obviously shouldn't be discounted. But similarly, one person of Native American heritage being okay with it doesn't become a get out of jail free card. That's the logic that leads people to saying "Well, I asked my black friend and he said it was cool". There are millions of people out there, all with their own views that can't easily be reduced down to one sentence. It's even the same with things like the football team, where you'll always hear from some Native American people who say that they like it.
Square Enix has decided that this would possibly offend more people than it would people who found it honoring, and they've decided to change it. I think they are probably correct in that view, although I think this was unlikely to attract much controversy either way given the comparatively low profile of the game.
Those opinions obviously shouldn't be discounted. But similarly, one person of Native American heritage being okay with it doesn't become a get out of jail free card. That's the logic that leads people to saying "Well, I asked my black friend and he said it was cool". There are millions of people out there, all with their own views that can't easily be reduced down to one sentence. It's even the same with things like the football team, where you'll always hear from some Native American people who say that they like it.
Square Enix has decided that this would possibly offend more people than it would people who found it honoring, and they've decided to change it. I think they are probably correct in that view, although I think this was unlikely to attract much controversy either way given the comparatively low profile of the game.
Luchadores > rancheros, though.
Holy heck, that was awesome.
To many have forgotten how to have a discussion and see everything in black or white instead of admitting the world comes in many different shades of grey
If you are banned EXIE take care. I have enjoyed many of your posts prior to this even if I did not always see it from your perspective it has been interesting.
PS. I still see the problem with it. Now to be fair it isn't an elders headdress but marks of courage that may actually be justifiable so yeah anyone shouldn't feel bad for liking it but at the same time people should admit that it can pose a problem for some. It's nearly never black and white people.
yeah shades of grey again. Or everything is basically opinion. We will never be one hive with one thought but we can get educated. Or we could build a Thunderdome.
Yeah that's rather stupid. That just means it was ok with THAT friend.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Yeah, when someone randomly tears into me on Reddit, I almost always go digging to see if they're just shitty all the time.
Velcro Fly
Member
I mean you can disagree in a respectful manner and still get your point across. Being combative and insulting to make a scene isn't really a good tool for arguing your point, no matter how much merit it does or doesn't have.
I feel bad for thinking the outfit looked cool when I first saw it when it was revealed. I still think it looks cool but it's mostly the BD art style and the quickly changeable costume sort of deal.
But this whole thing makes me think of Code Name STEAM and the cast of characters in that game and how well done and diverse a group that was with basically zero focus on their backgrounds other than what you knew outside of the game.
I feel bad for thinking the outfit looked cool when I first saw it when it was revealed. I still think it looks cool but it's mostly the BD art style and the quickly changeable costume sort of deal.
But this whole thing makes me think of Code Name STEAM and the cast of characters in that game and how well done and diverse a group that was with basically zero focus on their backgrounds other than what you knew outside of the game.
ScriptedReality
Member
tbh im not sure which way is worst.
Taking them out completely (im sure some would want to be represented)
or the skimpy native class called tomahawk
Couldnt they just rework it?
Taking them out completely (im sure some would want to be represented)
or the skimpy native class called tomahawk
Couldnt they just rework it?
Just the shameful (or shameless?) parts, apparently.
ScriptedReality
Member
That's not... The same thing. The representation of demons is not against any Christian dogma or belief (those who are offended by Harry Potter should read the Bible one more time at least) - the misrepresentation of one of the most prominent members of the Christian clergy might be totally seen as offensive since it's a cultural exploitation of a figure towards whom people show respect.
This is how Tiz looks like, by the way (quoted for the new page):
This is the original artwork of the character who owns the Tomahawk asterisk:
i think they look dope. Cool as hell
Nailed it.
sensui-tomo
Member
ScriptedReality
Member
i mean a better way lol. less revealing maybe?
Not exactly the best reworking, but at least kinda fixes the racist problem.
Still much to work on the gross objectification of SD characters
I was actualy curious to see if there was any pic ... twitter was boring, but linked to youtube and it was much more interesting xD
Still much to work on the gross objectification of SD characters
I was actualy curious to see if there was any pic ... twitter was boring, but linked to youtube and it was much more interesting xD
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
Feels like this is becoming a regular thing. At least they didn't just remove the class, that's nice.
They'd have a lot of outfits to rework if they are going to get rid/change the revealing ones.
Ragnorok64
Member
I am super sad that we lose that outfit. Cowboys are boring.
sensui-tomo
Member
...I still condemn the snooping... but uh i take back that accusation about assumptions. He is a GGer
Its apparently a gun/sniper class. which makes even less sense but hey at least its cowboy now
did you do some snooping?
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
It's not a crossbow, it's a sniper rifle with an axe blade bayonet for some reason
I think the reasoning behind using a Native American for a job class is the same as using them for costumes in the states; they've been given a status similar to beings of legend because the US tried to eradicate them in the past. This game's aesthetic isn't the only mess
I actually agree with the sentiment that changing it to Cowboy (if true) is kind of fucked up. There are better names
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Upset by what? The changing of the outfit or the outfit itself?
EDIT:Holy shit at that meltdown and holy cringe at that twitter page....
How do you replace a Native American with a Cowboy? That's like, the complete opposite isn't it?
Isn't that even more offensive than just keeping the Native American? Its like those shitty old 40 and 50s cartoons that didn't have the time period sense to understand that the imperial forces were not good for killing the Natives and taking their land
Isn't that even more offensive than just keeping the Native American? Its like those shitty old 40 and 50s cartoons that didn't have the time period sense to understand that the imperial forces were not good for killing the Natives and taking their land
When will people stop crying censorship every time something is changed in a game? This changes nothing about the game except the aesthetic of one class.
I super duper hardly believe most people are upset because the change implies some sort of Western domination of native Americans. More likely, as is per usual, people are upset that something scantily clad in an anime video game is going to be somewhat less scantily clad when it makes it to US shores.
I super duper hardly believe most people are upset because the change implies some sort of Western domination of native Americans. More likely, as is per usual, people are upset that something scantily clad in an anime video game is going to be somewhat less scantily clad when it makes it to US shores.
Anyway really interesting to see more from other mods here. Always assumed besada and YB was in a class of their own. They aren't Thanks for being educational.
But to point, remember that it's ok to wear someone else's shoes for a while. Not saying you should find a "side". Those shouldn't* exist but varying perspectives do. So instead of being a dick try talking to someone
*I try my best to be a good person but it's hard. I still haven't figured out how to speak to misogynist and racists without dissolving into a machine gun of insults and building a 10m high wall have never helped a person. It only keeps them alone. People who are alone do stupid shit and often go deeper into their own pile of...questionable things.
Now to either play FFXII or watch someone stream it ^^
Thanks for being educational. But to point, remember that it's ok to wear someone else's shoes for a while. Not saying you should find a "side". Those shouldn't* exist but varying perspectives do. So instead of being a dick try talking to someone
*I try my best to be a good person but it's hard. I still haven't figured out how to speak to misogynist and racists without dissolving into a machine gun of insults and building a 10m high wall have never helped a person. It only keeps them alone. People who are alone do stupid shit and often go deeper into their own pile of...questionable things.
Now to either play FFXII or watch someone stream it ^^
I just looked up a list of classes for Bravely Second and it includes "Chariot" as a job which apparently means "centaur-interpretation of Cú Chulainn". So in the job list we're mashing up "just a regular Indian but it has a crossbow for some reason" with Irish Folklore Hero Made Even More Mystical with Pastry Chef.
Gotta give them credit for just throwing the whole pot of spaghetti at the wall to see what sticks I guess. I'm really looking forward to this game but man I can already tell I am I going to be rolling eyes a lot.
sensui-tomo
Member
I looked when some poster said his youtube was interesting.... i'm a dead cat(curiosity) and a hypocrite too :/ I wouldn't call him out on it during an argument. I only argue with what i see, bringing up posts or other stuff relating to the person is irrelevant. But I will take back the " shouldnt assume he a gg" cause damn is he a GG, but being GG had nothing to do with the argument which should never have been brought up.
Ragnorok64
Member
Still more boring than it was previously.
We see cowboy characters all the freakin time.
Its not even less scantily clad tho...
They legit just added a hat.
I don't think it is a bad change (outside of the name) considering the cultural differences. I think some of the ones often upset about these changes are mad because they want the game in as close to it's "natural" state as possible (I say close to because of the obvious language differences so the "then just import it trololool" statements don't pop up") and to see it changed upsets them. In this case, it is a cultural reason for the change so its fine...but to change something because it doesn't appeal to some's taste is what generally gets people up in arms. And considering this has become a recent thing ,i get why some are upset. Not in this case but I still understand it in general.
while it's probably best to put it to rest since they're banned anyways, he never posited an argument in the first place. showing that he was a gamergate supporter was to just put his diatribe into perspective.
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