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[BananasWithGuns]

What's funny is that the game the GIF is extracted from was terrible.

 

[Darkwaknight]

Secret unreleased video of Xbox One at MS HQ....

 

[Goku]

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that one is a first person game while the other is a third person game. Play Ryse in first person and suddenly those more up close textures and models don't look as good.

Play KZ in third person and you'll have to render a full soldier, not only a gun :/ Oh and LoD's.

 

[Steroyd]

I agree somewhat, however I think you're forgetting cognitive dissonance, I mean look at apple.

Sony thought they were Apple with the PS3, and got burned.

 

[MysticGoujon]

You're hanging too much on the 900p vs 1080p. Obviously 1080p is a higher resolution than 900p and it's IQ is objectively better. What I'm saying is that Ryse doesn't look worse than KZ:SF. Resolution isn't the only factor in visual presentation. They way you make it sound now is that KZSF looks objectively better than Ryse because of a higher res.

Exactly what I'm saying. The end product looks just as good, and probably better in some people opinions, and back to my original point, if both systems leading games are looking just as good as each other, you can hardly say ones being left behind.

 

[Ashes]

People praise GTA IV, Beyond, The last of us for how they look, and they will do the same for Ryse. It's definitely a looker. So hardware isn't everything. But, two of those games have garned much critical acclaim, it remains to be seen whether Ryse will do the same.

I say this because I reckon Titanfall will be a genuine AAA critically acclaimed game, and that certainly isn't a looker. Titanfall could be huge.

 

[killatopak]

My argument is that they both look just as good, regardless of the resolution, I believe 90% of users couldn't tell.

So you disregard the 10%?

This is an enthusiast forum you're in. They will notice. They are the 10%.

Those 10% are the ones who spread which console is better by word of mouth. Once casuals notice this, it will snowball and they're likely pick the better game/console their enthusiast friends tell them regardless if they could notice the differences or not.

 

[IHaveCandy]

Play KZ in third person and you'll have to render a full soldier, not only a gun :/ Oh and LoD's.

First person games put your detail quality under a better microscope. This is irrefutably true. Having a single persistent character on screen isn't too taxing.

 

[Artorias]

Dude, the whole point is that Ryse doesn't render extra 633600 pixels yet looks at least as good as KZSF.

Does anyone actually think this?

 

[PrintedCrayon]

So has this rumour been pretty much confirmed or is everyone at MS putting their fingers in their ears and yelling "la la la can't hear you" ?

Whatever sacrifices IW had to make to get this game running is just baffling me.

 

[Metfanant]

My argument is that they both look just as good, regardless of the resolution, I believe 90% of users couldn't tell.

And as everyone is trying to explain to you...Ryse looks as good as it does BECAUSE of its lower resolution...they can jack up some of the eye candy because the resolution is lower...

If they pushed it to 1080p there would have had to be significant sacrifices in other areas...

 

[CCS]

If this is true, are IW likely to publicly state it at any point? Or are they just going to not talk about it?

 

[Entrecôte]

What???

When you run at 900p instead of the native 1080p display of your HDTV, that in and of itself is making the game look visually worse. You lose clarity and detail, because fewer pixels are being rendered (shocking!).

This part is not debatable. Ryse already loses to Shadow Fall in the visual definition/clarity department, as well as in the framerate department. And it probably loses in a number of other departments as well.

So games like Blue Dragon are past the winning line in visual clarity and detail just by virtue of being 1080p?

Might make for a sharper picture with more detail, doesn't mean the detail is superior.

 

[Hurley]

Ryse and Killzone both look fantastic for launch titles, however when looking at Killzone there's no denying that you can see the technical edge it has over Ryse.

 

[MysticGoujon]

So you disregard the 10%?

This is an enthusiast forum you're in. They will notice. They are the 10%.

Those 10% are the ones who spread which console is better by word of mouth. Once casuals notice this, it will snowball and they're likely pick the better game/console their enthusiast friends tell them regardless if they could notice the differences or not.

No doubt, but they'll still look at both games and think they both look as good as each other, only there personal opinion separating them.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

So you disregard the 10%?

This is an enthusiast forum you're in. They will notice. They are the 10%.

Those 10% are the ones who spread which console is better by word of mouth. Once casuals notice this, it will snowball and they're likely pick the better game/console their enthusiast friends tell them regardless if they could notice the differences or not.

Yep, and $100 cheaper.

 

[sTaTIx]

My argument is that they both look just as good, regardless of the resolution, I believe 90% of users couldn't tell.

It's not just the resolution making things blurrier and worse on Ryse. It's also the fact that Killzone: Shadow Fall has more advanced lighting and shading effects, larger scale maps, more complex AI/physics higher-resolution textures... everything. Ryse may very well have a few technical merits going in its favor. But the vast majority of the graphical and technical metrics seem to be better on Shadow Fall.

 

[MysticGoujon]

And as everyone is trying to explain to you...Ryse looks as good as it does BECAUSE of its lower resolution...they can jack up some of the eye candy because the resolution is lower...

If they pushed it to 1080p there would have had to be significant sacrifices in other areas...

How many times do I have to say I'm talking about end product, not technical specs, people don't care how a game gets there, just that it gets there.

 

[RaikuHebi]

So games like Blue Dragon are past the winning line in visual clarity and detail just by virtue of being 1080p?

Might make for a sharper picture with more detail, doesn't mean the detail is superior.

If XBone can't do 1080p then that means it doesn't have the juice, which means that lack of juice will in the future affect more than pixels.

That's what all the hubb-ubb is about. Power, not just pixels.

 

[killatopak]

You're hanging too much on the 900p vs 1080p. Obviously 1080p is a higher resolution than 900p and it's IQ is objectively better. What I'm saying is that Ryse doesn't look worse than KZ:SF. Resolution isn't the only factor in visual presentation. They way you make it sound now is that KZSF looks objectively better than Ryse because of a higher res.

That's the point. KZ:SF is objectively better than Ryse. Now if you tell me that Ryse if subjectively better than KZ:SF I couldn't disagree with you.

 

[Maximilian E.]

900p versus 1080 isn't just technical it's also visual. It can be seen.

I have to ask, because I'm curious myself.

will 900p (and then that this is upscaled) be such a huge difference to native 1080p?

native 720p and 900p vs 1080p could be noticeable but 720 and 900 and then upscale this to 1080p, how is that?

the scaler in 360 was pretty good iirc, perhaps Xbox Ones is much better?

like I said, I'm curious about how much difference an upscaled image will look vs a native one.

 

[goonergaz]

I don't understand why people think 720p is ok?

TVs are getting bigger and better, this isn't when PS360 launched when folk still had tubes - I had (at the time) a very good TV - 32" widescreen. This launch I have a 1080p 50" plazma. Whilst 720p will look ok today I'm sure I'll get a bigger and better TV at some point this gen and these consoles need to look good.

If not for that then longevity, if it's struggling with the latest games today what's it going to be like in a couple of years!?

 

[Jack cw]

You're hanging too much on the 900p vs 1080p. Obviously 1080p is a higher resolution than 900p and it's IQ is objectively better. What I'm saying is that Ryse doesn't look worse than KZ:SF. Resolution isn't the only factor in visual presentation. They way you make it sound now is that KZSF looks objectively better than Ryse because of a higher res.

Fair enough but going by this standard I'd say that Okami looks better than that deep down demo... Image quality is part of the look of a game and if its blurrier and not as crisp as another title then its objectively better looking. 99% of people have displays with fixed native resolution and there is no 900p TV, so in the end you better target at 1080 pixels vertical.

 

[uncharted86]

Woah, just woke up to a 96 page thread. I said god damn!

 

[OriginalThinking]

My argument is that they both look just as good, regardless of the resolution, I believe 90% of users couldn't tell.

But your argument is based on incomplete evidence. None of us have seen 1080p uncompressed direct feed footage of the games respective final builds. Relying on compressed YT or other internet player videos isn't a good measure of what the final products will looks like. There is absolutely no doubt Ryse is a gorgeous game, and it has two advantages in terms of post processing and texture quality/resolution - it's running at a lower resolution and as it's 3rd person you are always further removed from textures. There's no hiding from that in a first person title. Come November 22nd we'll all know for sure.

 

[Fistwell]

So Xbox Two won't be out til 2020 or later, right?

Na, 720 days from now more like.

 

[IHaveCandy]

I have to ask, because I'm curious myself.

will 900p (and then that this is upscaled) be such a huge difference to native 1080p?

native 720p and 900p vs 1080p could be noticeable but 720 and 900 and then upscale this to 1080p, how is that?

the scaler in 360 was pretty good iirc, perhaps Xbox Ones is much better?

like I said, I'm curious about how much difference an upscaled image will look vs a native one.

I upgraded from a 1600x900 computer monitor to a 1080p monitor a few years ago on my PC. The difference was night and day.

 

[AzaK]

I'm late to the thread but I doubt it will matter. People buy for exclusives and services, not resolutions.

 

[Xater]

Man the Digital Foundry threads will be hilarious seeing this thread.

 

[goonergaz]

So you disregard the 10%?

This is an enthusiast forum you're in. They will notice. They are the 10%.

Those 10% are the ones who spread which console is better by word of mouth. Once casuals notice this, it will snowball and they're likely pick the better game/console their enthusiast friends tell them regardless if they could notice the differences or not.

This. That 10% are the early adopters - the ones that's mates eventually buy the same console so they can play online with.

Snowball is the word.

 

[MysticGoujon]

But your argument is based on incomplete evidence. None of us have seen 1080p uncompressed direct feed footage of the games respective final builds. Relying on compressed YT or other internet player videos isn't a good measure of what the final products will looks like. There is absolutely no doubt Ryse is a gorgeous game, and it has two advantages in terms of post processing and texture quality/resolution - it's running at a lower resolution and as it's 3rd person you are always further removed from textures. There's no hiding from that in a first person title. Come November 22nd we'll all know for sure.

Wasn't the video on xbox.com uncompressed 1080p?

 

[Breakfast at Noon]

excuses, excuses everywhere.

 

[Moonstone]

What I'm saying is that Ryse doesn't look worse than KZ:SF.

That's totally subjective so you can't argue about that. Maybe there are people that feel like it looks better. Totally possible.

Even if we would discuss it from a technical standpoint, comparing Third Person with First Person is hard, the engines work different and have to do different things.

 

[mocoworm]

I think that most ppl will be ok with 720p games on XONE if the framerate is high. Most people being casual gamers and not GAF gamers.

 

[Hurley]

I think that most ppl will be ok with 720p games on XONE if the framerate is high. Most people being casual and GAF gamers.

And has decent AA.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

Man the Digital Foundry threads will be hilarious seeing this thread.

The spin is going to be gymnastic.

 

[Entrecôte]

I don't understand why people think 720p is ok?

720p is most definitely not ok. This was the previous gen resolution. I'd imagine that most that think it is ok are just at the denial stage of grieving at the moment.

Most persuasive news yet to get that pre-order cancelled. Would be a pity though as want nothing from other systems.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

I'm late to the thread but I doubt it will matter. People buy for exclusives and services, not resolutions.

You mean like the WiiU?

 

[flipswitch]

I think that most ppl will be ok with 720p games on XONE if the framerate is high. Most people being casual gamers and not GAF gamers.

Let's not promote drug use.

 

[PrintedCrayon]

You mean like the WiiU?

Except the Wii U has none of those things mentioned.

 

[Jabba]

Didn't it happen when the ps3 version of gta iv had downgraded resolution? I remember it was the deciding choice for many as to which version to get.

I remember a thread about it. Many posters DID buy GTA4 based on that. Many posters destroyed the ps3 versions aliasing also. I had 360 at the time and PS3, all multis were on 360 for me.

Until I got my laptop in april 2008.

 

[iMax]

Because it supports only sub-1k games.

Wrong.

 

[ResidentDante]

I think I might do one of these for every meltdown thread.

Based on my Path of Exile OT "cover"

Hahaha, great work, but the line:

60 FPS: THE LIST
BECAUSE ANYTHING LESS
IS A F***ING SLIDESHOW

should be swapped out with:

30 FPS: CONSOLE GAMERS
BECAUSE ANYTHING MORE
ISN'T AS CINEMATIC

 

[Jack cw]

I have to ask, because I'm curious myself.

will 900p (and then that this is upscaled) be such a huge difference to native 1080p?

native 720p and 900p vs 1080p could be noticeable but 720 and 900 and then upscale this to 1080p, how is that?

the scaler in 360 was pretty good iirc, perhaps Xbox Ones is much better?

like I said, I'm curious about how much difference an upscaled image will look vs a native one.

Simple: upscaling means missing picture information needs to be interpolated (streched) to fill the screen. No scaler can produce picture information when there is non, so any upscaled picture will look worse when comparing it to native 1080p content.

The scaler inside the 360 was better than many low and midrange TVs had at that time but wasnt really good either. Scaler tech and their algorhythms might have improved but they cant "invent" missing information. In the end: Any non native content (lower res than your display) will look worse. Image quality will suffer from jaggies, artifacts, blur, etc.

It also depends on screen size and viewing distance but is noticable on normal distances for anyone with normal eye sight.

 

[Goku]

That's the point. KZ:SF is objectively better than Ryse. Now if you tell me that Ryse if subjectively better than KZ:SF I couldn't disagree with you.

Oke then, Alan Wake is the best looking game of current gen, because no other game comes near its technical achievements,

 

[RulkezX]

The spin is going to be gymnastic.

It's already started , I mean we have guys telling us that 900p was a design choice rather than a hardware limitation.....

 

[keit4]

The spin is going to be gymnastic.

Yeah, from "fuck you Leadbetter" to "we love you Leadbetter".

 

[sTaTIx]

Resolution isn't the only factor in visual presentation. They way you make it sound now is that KZSF looks objectively better than Ryse because of a higher res.

No. I'm saying true 1080p is only PART of the reason Killzone: Shadow Fall looks better. Overall, I would say that Killzone: Shadow Fall looks much more impressive than Ryse. Even if Killzone: Shadow Fall ran at just 900p, I would still place it higher than Ryse in terms of technical accomplishment overall.

 

[supersaw]

Hahaha, great work, but the line:

60 FPS: THE LIST
BECAUSE ANYTHING LESS
IS A F***ING SLIDESHOW

should be swapped out with:

30 FPS: CONSOLE GAMERS
BECAUSE ANYTHING MORE
ISN'T AS CINEMATIC

And 1080p is too angular

 

[Aztechnology]

It's already started , I mean we have guys telling us that 900p was a design choice rather than a hardware limitation.....