IISANDERII
Member
And you know this how? Non-whites don't get harsher sentencing? Prison inmates are evenly distributed between all races?
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ASU Professor slammed to ground after jaywalking; charged with assaulting officer
- Thread starter benjipwns
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Wolfe
Member
While I don't think she handled the situation well it's not like there hasn't been other instances of these types of situations being racially motivated in Arizona.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
They don't have the same major hurdles in getting IDs. Poll taxes are also illegal in the US and many of these voter ID laws are basically poll taxes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax_(United_States)
That is beyond the scope of this topic though.
foxdvd
Member
I am staying out of the argument here(officer was a dick, but I was involved in an accident with someone "jaywalking" at night and this silly crime is anything but silly and will stick with me for life) I only want to chime in and say that I am sure that in ALL states you have to show id if you commit a crime. No one here is denying that she jaywalked, and even if you think it is a stupid crime, the officer observed her, and has a right to ask for ID. Correct me if I am wrong, but even in those red states, you have to show ID if you break the law.
What are these requirements?
In Europe you have to fill out the necessary paperwork, pay a fee (over here it is around 50 euros for a passport or an I.D issued by the police) and that's that. I can understand the difficulties related to travel distances and so on though.
Still think the lady would've gotten off with a warning had she not escalated the situation. She has an academic background and one would assume people in her position would know how to deal with different people.
lol at the "fuck the law, do what you want!" crowd. disobey!
(aka how to get your ass kicked by the police)
Sho_Nuff82
Member
It's not worth getting into arguments with cops. You can't "win" that kind of confrontation. And as a minority, prior history tells you that you might even be putting your life on the line. Better to comply then pursue legal action later, you aren't going to shame a bad cop into letting you go, and "do you know who I am?" has never worked for anyone in a good way.
Rocket Scientist
Member
Holy shit... I am relieved to realize that.
Unless his intent was to harass then he did do something wrong.
mangochutney
Member
Or they could just let natural selection play it's course.
If you cross without looking, or do look but cross at say a blind corner or have no way of seeing traffic, it is your own fault.
But we should be able to make that judgement for ourselves. To me it is utter nonsense that I might be on a straight road, can see any traffic for miles down the road, can see that nothing is coming, but would have to walk 100s of yards to the nearest crossing only to then double back on myself because I can't cross and empty street.
How far does jaywalking extend to in the US? What about more residential areas? If you want to see your neighbour on the other side of the street have you got to walk all the way to the nearest crossing or is it legal to just zip across?
You can pretty much do what you want in the UK, except for crossing a railway when the light is red.
Norway. I think Oslo is infamous for its pedestrians crossing the road when the lights are red and jaywalking when they are green. You don't have to go far though to find open areas with light traffic where it makes no sense to wait.
Duh. If he wasn't a cop, he'd have no right to ask for identification or to arrest her.
foxdvd
Member
this has to be a joke post.... Hitting a person with your car does not just kill/hurt that person. The damage and even injury to the driver and passengers can be devastating. Especially if that driver swerves to avoid the pedestrian and hits oncoming traffic.
mangochutney
Member
Correct. It was just to highlight the utter stupidity of someone who enters a road, designed for carrying cars no less, without looking or paying attention.
lol, this is a bad post in many ways, come on.
You can jaywalk just fine in the US. I jaywalk in front of cops without even thinking about it all the time. It's so pervasive that if someone is stopped for it it raises red flags (like in this situation).
oxrock
Gravity is a myth, the Earth SUCKS!
You're getting ahead of yourself, present relevant information to your position. In the most extreme possibility of oppression in this particular scenario, her race MAY of played a part in her being questioned due to her being caught jaywalking by a police officer. Her acting foolishly following that is all her doing.
There's no way to ascertain the police officer's reasoning for approaching her as opposed to any other, to just jump to race without any evidence is irresponsible though. Do you say that simply because he's white? Because that in itself is racist.
It seems a police officer can't have any altercation with someone of any other race than themselves without race being allegedly involved. If the officer was being disrespectful or spiteful I could draw lines to connect the dots leading me to racial prejudice, but I'm not seeing any indications.
outunderthestars
Banned
She was stopped for breaking a law. The police have the ability to require identification at that point.
mugurumakensei
Member
No, it's more like "Comply with the law at that point. Bring up any misgivings in front of the Judge, or bring a lawsuit to challenge the law."
I can tell you that you will be ticketed for small offenses during certain times of the month. Despite not being able to actually say since quota's are legal for Police Departments to enforce, there is a de facto quota. You'll be passed over, overly scrutinized, and blocked from advancement if you don't meet it. Basically, your career will be killed, and the police department will be looking for any reason they can fire you if you consistently fail to meet the quota
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
Just found this:
http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/qt/citycodes.htm
If this is true, I completely understand her argument and hesitance to give her name/ID even more.
http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/qt/citycodes.htm
If this is true, I completely understand her argument and hesitance to give her name/ID even more.
IISANDERII
Member
My position is that all the racism and discrimination in the justice system doesn't suddenly disappear into thin air when jaywalking laws are being enforced.
Ajemsuhgao
Member
My position is that not every cop is a racist. And just because the person on the other side of the law is black, doesn't automatically mean that they're being singled out because of it.
Does it happen? Of course. Nobody is going to deny that race can be a factor. But to always attribute racial motivation just because the officer(s) are white is unfair, unreasonable, and racist itself.
Zoe
Member
How would refusing to identify possibly get her out of that?
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
oxrock
Gravity is a myth, the Earth SUCKS!
If you insist on going down that route, then present hard proof. In the video I saw, there didn't appear to be any observable racism at least. Do you have access to previous complaints made about this one particular officer that are shaping your opinion? As far as I can tell, your only argument is that he's a white officer and she's black so therefor it must be racially motivated.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
Usually there isn't blatant racism (i.e. use of derogatory words) with targeted police stops. That doesn't mean that racism wasn't a motivating factor. In this case, the street is clearly closed off (i.e. jaywalking was not creating a dangerous situation) and there were multiple people jaywalking around them. Which begs the question, why was she stopped?
Watched the video again.
It does not paint a very good picture of the lady in question. That "I'm a professor at ASU!" stuff makes her less sympathetic. I typically can't stand to see people touting the status of their job as a reason why they deserve better treatment.
Still difficult to come to a conclusion since the only audio provided comes from after the situation has gone completely south and the police officer is about to arrest her. I'd be curious how the whole altercation went, and if she was belligerent from the start.
It does not paint a very good picture of the lady in question. That "I'm a professor at ASU!" stuff makes her less sympathetic. I typically can't stand to see people touting the status of their job as a reason why they deserve better treatment.
Still difficult to come to a conclusion since the only audio provided comes from after the situation has gone completely south and the police officer is about to arrest her. I'd be curious how the whole altercation went, and if she was belligerent from the start.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
I think it is telling that the police only released an edited version of the video (as far as I can tell), cutting off the beginning of the interaction. Her stating that she was a professor was probably an attempt to tell the cop that she was not a delinquent. It also doesn't seem to be the first thing she tells him, which is usually what people do when attempting to use status to get away with things.
freeofgreed
Member
Yeah this, I highly doubt her saying she was an ASU professor was meant to be some sort of attempt at using her status to get out of a ticket.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
It was something passed in 2005, which predates SB 1070 by about 5 years.
You have to give them your full name if you're detained but I don't believe that you're required to show ID unless you're driving.
Here is a mostly unedited video. There's much more dialogue between her and the police officer.
He repeatedly says she is "walking in the middle of the street". Which to me would imply more than jaywalking, but literally walking down the street in a lane.
Just because the news station edits a video down that doesn't mean it's all the police released.
He repeatedly says she is "walking in the middle of the street". Which to me would imply more than jaywalking, but literally walking down the street in a lane.
Just because the news station edits a video down that doesn't mean it's all the police released.
entremet
Member
Something happened along the way in American society when cops started acting like we're under martial law. It's no surprise that non-American are absolutely shocked at these policing attitudes and tactics.
Most police departments have the moniker To Protect and Serve, but now police departments have an almost antagonistic attitude to the base of tax payers that they purport to serve.
That antagonism seems to be documented everyday.
Most police departments have the moniker To Protect and Serve, but now police departments have an almost antagonistic attitude to the base of tax payers that they purport to serve.
That antagonism seems to be documented everyday.
theignoramus
Member
so the fuck what? Am I supposed to scold a Black woman for fighting back against some shithead cop who just wants to pick on a minority? Fuck that and fuck racist, shithead cops
theignoramus
Member
what a bunch of black and white, binary BS. There's only one asshole in the situation and its the cop. I dont care if the woman "broke the law"
You made a generalization based on the skin color of the officer without any concrete evidence of racism in that arrest, what does that make you if not a prejudiced person?
They are both idiots. One had the law on his side. Jaywalking tickets are easy money for cops, she should have just taken it or argue it in court like a normal person.
No but I've seen it happen fairly regularly. Cops will often sit in locations where a ton of people like to jaywalk and just yank a few every so often.
No but I've seen it happen fairly regularly. Cops will often sit in locations where a ton of people like to jaywalk and just yank a few every so often.
Am I supposed to give credence to assumptions based on nothing but personal bias?
You wanna point out there's a systemic trend of racial prejudice in law enforcement generally? Yeah, no shit. But there's nothing to show that to be a factor here. She doesn't get a free pass for being a black woman. Nobody gets a free pass for kicking a cop. Go ahead, try it and see.
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SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
Wait, she's wearing toe shoes. That could also be the fashion police.
edit: Oh, I thought you were wondering if anyone in the states was ever arrested for jaywalking.
Where at? Because I've never even seen nor heard of it even in a places like DC or NYC.
Middle of the day during business hours, I've never seen it enforced. (But I don't live in a big town .. 50k or so) But at night, on the party strip downtown, I've seen the cops use it as a roundabout means of crowd control.
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SillyEskimo
Member
I have. In a small town in Michigan during the afternoon on a weekday. Apparently someone had been hit by a car there weeks earlier and the cops were cracking down on that spot.
I had to show my ID. He let me go and told me to tell others about him stopping me and why he was doing it.
I didn't care in the slightest. Dude's just doing his job.
Is that whole street closed to construction or am I just seeing it wrong? Didn't get to see the first video since I was on my phone. Figured it was just some construction on the sidewalk and she crossed the street to avoid it. If the whole street was closed, what the fuck was the cop thinking?
entremet
Member
Cops have massive powers in the United States. Why would I as a citizen make it harder on myself by not following their orders? Any slip-up and I now have a resisting charge on my record. It's just easier to cooperate no matter how trivial I think they may be.
MWS Natural
Member
I don't know if she thought she was going to talk her way out of it or what. She should have known black people aren't given the same leeway to "talk back" to a police officer in a situation like this. Guess she had to learn the hard way.
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