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[mrklaw]

Great deal! Seems like PS4 going to take Europe this holidays and XB US. I think Sony does not want to push more in US and instead they want to take hold on Europe market to offset Holidays sales. Even though XB1 may outsell PS4 in US but Europe sales going to offset this. But after holidays XB1 going to suffer with increased price and no exclusives next year half where PS4 still have momentum with exclusives and December event with new game announcements.

Sony are countering MS well seemingly everywhere except the US. Even in the UK where MS is strong, Sony have some great offers out there with most retailers.

This suggests two possibilities to me

1) Sony cannot afford to compete similarly with MS in the US. This can also be read that Sony don't *want* to compete on price because they want to make more money during the holidays.

2) Sony don't have the stock to meet demand if they price aggressively to defend against MS, so there is no point cutting the price. MS clearly have a lot of production available (looking at their need to stop shipments earlier in the year), and Sony have maintained momentum since launch with great numbers. So they simply may not be able to compete on a supply level. If this is the case, I'm sure we'll see pre-emptive November NPD PR about 'sold out everywhere' etc from Sony

 

[Ursiform]

Like that guy in that large post said, the attitude is still there, waiting in the back room.

This is going to be a looooooooong generation.

 

[bill0527]

Its not holding a grudge against MS its having some type of sense and drawing the line. When is enough enough? They pissed me off good and im not dropping my attitude cause they put on a BP "We're Sorry" campaign, which in comparison is hardly the case, they flipped their policies and backhanded the consumer saying it was "their fault" and they had big plans in place..yeah big plans to empty out our wallets.

Even before the 180 MS pulled, we're talking mandatory/DRM phase, people were still like defending them to no end without even understanding any of it. It was cool to mock and point the finger at people that had the concern to ask WTF microsoft was thinking and what EXACTLY their policies entailed.

It sort of shows the mentality overall of people now a days, and you can even draw it to a wider angle involving the economy/politics etc etc. Its not cool to stand your ground or to have common sense, its better to submit/be submissive and to pull punches at those using their head.

I don't take it as a personal slight.

Its a business and its to be treated as a business. Companies every single day backpedal on policies and change direction.

Microsoft is no different. Consumers spoke out about the initial reveal of Xbox One and Microsoft changed the box.

That doesn't mean they won't try this again at some point in the future, but common sense, without the outrage, tells me they won't. They're going to lose this generation because of their initial plans for Xbox One. If they try this again, Xbox will be over. Done. Stick a fork in it. I have faith that there are much smarter people working at Microsoft than me, who fully well know this.

 

[mrklaw]

I guess we must have a very different view on what "very large margin" would be.

Myself I think XB1 should take November but I'd hate to put money on it given past upsets (such as TitanFall launch). I can't possibly imagine it being by a very large margin as if define it though.

I'm not sure that any lead MS might have from Nov/Dec will be enough to counter the lead Sony had from Sep/Oct. So effectively having a level Q4 with Sony. Which from their internal perspective I'm sure will be a win.

 

[MMaRsu]

Oh please. You are being screwed everyday and don't even see it. You ever bought a house, bought a car, pay utilities, pay for food, work and not be paid fairly? I have and its called the real world where every company doesn't give a damn about you without first caring about their business and profits. And yes Sony, Nintendo, and Microsoft are like every other company in the world.....they don't give a damn about you as well.

Once you understand that then you will understand then you will understand "it's never personal, it's just business".

Right and Sony seems to be doing business in a way that doesnt make me feel like im contributing to an assholish company with greed in their eyes.

And no Ive never bought a house or a car, and I pay very little for housing.And when I work I always get paid fairly.

And as a consumer you can be selective in which company you support. You want to support a company who tried to take away your rights only for them to get more cash I say go right ahead but Im sticking with mt principles in that MS will never see a fucking dime of my money this generation.

 

[driver116]

Sony are countering MS well seemingly everywhere except the US. Even in the UK where MS is strong, Sony have some great offers out there with most retailers.

This suggests two possibilities to me

1) Sony cannot afford to compete similarly with MS in the US. This can also be read that Sony don't *want* to compete on price because they want to make more money during the holidays.

2) Sony don't have the stock to meet demand if they price aggressively to defend against MS, so there is no point cutting the price. MS clearly have a lot of production available (looking at their need to stop shipments earlier in the year), and Sony have maintained momentum since launch with great numbers. So they simply may not be able to compete on a supply level. If this is the case, I'm sure we'll see pre-emptive November NPD PR about 'sold out everywhere' etc from Sony

Scernario number C - They're waiting nearer black friday to blow their load.

 

[shinra-bansho]

People were estimating they had 2 million boxes in retailer storage as of 3 weeks ago when there were 7 - 7.5 million boxes sold to retail.

If you're referring to when earnings releases came out, you need to backdate to September 30th 2013, not whenever people were discussing the earnings release. There could have plausibly been a lot in the channel as at that date, as the system had just launched in several territories.

But overall extrapolating sell-through from these shipments is difficult, particularly this early overall, particularly this seasonal quarter and particularly this early in this seasonal quarter.

 

[Isurus]

Price matters. Shocking. (not)

 

[ClosingADoor]

In some cases I doubt it. Its just a case of beung used to something.

A friend of mine swears by Fifa, even if the new game is crap and we have way more fun in PES2015 he still says that Fifa is his game and he doednt think PES is good.

LOL

Who are you to make the decision for him which game he should like? If he likes to play FIFA and think it is better, what is wrong with that?

Right and Sony seems to be doing business in a way that doesnt make me feel like im contributing to an assholish company with greed in their eyes.

And no Ive never bought a house or a car, and I pay very little for housing.And when I work I always get paid fairly.

And as a consumer you can be selective in which company you support. You want to support a company who tried to take away your rights only for them to get more cash I say go right ahead but Im sticking with mt principles in that MS will never see a fucking dime of my money this generation.

Keyword being 'feel'. I don't feel like I help a greedy company when buying an Xbox. Hell, I don't even consider the company and see it as 'contributing'. You are buying a console for you, because you want to have fun with it, not to help a company.

 

[Zophar]

We will never know what the exact thoughts behind the moves are. But you can also spin it the other way. Microsoft wants as many gamers as possible to play those games, so they drop the price.

Of course that is not what's happening, but the maximization of sales and profit is the goal in every company, small or large. Microsoft is trying to do that by making these moves and ship more consoles, so they can sell more games later.

Nintendo games are kind of like Apple products in a way. You don't see that many price cuts on them and they seem to hold value longer. That is one position to take, but it is not better or worse than another.

Comparing the release schedule between the two, both are releasing their main games in fall. That is normal, since there are more buyers in that period compared to other months. Nintendo released Bayonetta 2, Hyrule Warriors and is readying Super Smash. Those are also three exclusives for the holidays, same as Microsoft.

Nintendo released Mario Kart 8 back in May, demonstrably one of their biggest IPs, if not the largest. So far the Wii U has only had one price cut (Sept 2013) which did not coincide with any major release - only bookended by Pikmin 3 and The Wind Waker HD. I drew the comparison to show that MS' strategy for responding to consumers is very heavily focused on price adjustment and less focused on its software.

 

[JaggedSac]

If you're referring to when earnings releases came out, you need to backdate to September 30th 2013, not whenever people were discussing the earnings release. There could have plausibly been a lot in the channel as at that date, as the system had just launched in several territories.

But overall extrapolating sell-through from these shipments is difficult, particularly this early overall, particularly this seasonal quarter and particularly this early in this seasonal quarter.

Ok, 7 weeks ago. Well, it is Thanksgiving so a ton of stuffing is appropriate.

 

[Tycho_b]

Sony are countering MS well seemingly everywhere except the US. Even in the UK where MS is strong, Sony have some great offers out there with most retailers.

This suggests two possibilities to me

1) Sony cannot afford to compete similarly with MS in the US. This can also be read that Sony don't *want* to compete on price because they want to make more money during the holidays.

2) Sony don't have the stock to meet demand if they price aggressively to defend against MS, so there is no point cutting the price. MS clearly have a lot of production available (looking at their need to stop shipments earlier in the year), and Sony have maintained momentum since launch with great numbers. So they simply may not be able to compete on a supply level. If this is the case, I'm sure we'll see pre-emptive November NPD PR about 'sold out everywhere' etc from Sony

Both suggestions are correct my friend.

 

[ClosingADoor]

Nintendo released Mario Kart 8 back in May, demonstrably one of their biggest IPs, if not the largest. So far the Wii U has only had one price cut (Sept 2013) which did not coincide with any major release - only bookended by Pikmin 3 and The Wind Waker HD. I drew the comparison to show that MS' strategy for responding to consumers is very heavily focused on price adjustment and less focused on its software.

I don't see how one is having more faith in your games then the other. We were talking here about Xbox One having a good line-up in holidays before the price cuts.

And Microsoft has gained praise earlier for their fate in their games by letting review embargos drop before release, compared to some other games at the moment.

Dropping the price is standard (and of course the easiest) way to gain a bigger marketshare. There is no problem with that, and I would applaud Nintendo if they would do the same considering the position the Wii U is in.

 

[RandyBobandy]

This is great. Both companies going against each other, offering great deals. Everyone wins. Waiting on a euro ps4 deal myself

 

[Steroyd]

This is the worst thing you could possible say. Not only is it incorrect, but blatantly silly. Do you actually use products to consider their worth, or simply go on promises made early on?

I don't believe sony will "support" a console longer, Both companies will support something successful. Both companies won't support something unsuccessful. MS has great exclusives as well, IMO more that are worth while then sony has.

There is more merit to believing Sony's future promises on past merits, Sony could have easily ditched the PS3 to launch the PS4 earlier, but the PS3 had one hell of a swansong year compared to the Xbox 360, PS1/2/P also give credence to this notion, hell even psvita isn't getting that bad of a treatment considering all the cross buy, cross play games available.

 

[MaineUPTDC]

Right and Sony seems to be doing business in a way that doesnt make me feel like im contributing to an assholish company with greed in their eyes.

And no Ive never bought a house or a car, and I pay very little for housing.And when I work I always get paid fairly.

And as a consumer you can be selective in which company you support. You want to support a company who tried to take away your rights only for them to get more cash I say go right ahead but Im sticking with mt principles in that MS will never see a fucking dime of my money this generation.

And there you have it. Well step out of fantasy land and into the real world a little bit more and you will understand that every company you "support" ultimately doesn't give a damn about you.

 

[Zophar]

I don't see how one is having more faith in your games then the other. We were talking here about Xbox One having a good line-up in holidays before the price cuts.

And Microsoft has gained praise earlier for their fate in their games by letting review embargos drop before release, compared to some other games at the moment.

Dropping the price is standard (and of course the easiest) way to gain a bigger marketshare. There is no problem with that, and I would applaud Nintendo if they would do the same considering the position the Wii U is in.

I don't think price drops are a bad thing either - it's helping out MS a ton right now. I just take umbrage with the idea that it signifies that MS is listening to what consumers want (in particular, I don't think it is truly putting games first), and I don't really think it's a good long term strategy; after a while, you start running out of price to cut...

 

[TomShoe]

This can also be read that Sony don't *want* to compete on price because they want to make more money during the holidays.

Probably the most likely answer. Full price or not, there's no doubt that the PS4 is going to sell very well during the holidays, and Sony knows that. There's no point engaging in a price war with Microsoft, because "winning" two months of the year isn't worth losing profits and cannibalizing future sales. It's much better for the bottom line because value -adds like bundled games are much cheaper than straight price cuts.

Unless the price cut stays for good, I have a feeling Microsoft is going to struggle post holidays. With all these constant price drops and bundles, who in their right mind would buy a $399 Xbox with no games? It trains consumers to wait until the next sale, and makes slow months even slower as a result.

 

[bill0527]

There is more merit to believing Sony's future promises on past merits, Sony could have easily ditched the PS3 to launch the PS4 earlier, but the PS3 had one hell of a swansong year compared to the Xbox 360, PS1/2/P also give credence to this notion, hell even psvita isn't getting that bad of a treatment considering all the cross buy, cross play games available.

Sony has more short-term goodwill built up. That's obvious.

My only concern with Sony is that overall as a company, they are in serious financial trouble and Kaz isn't turning the ship around. Eventually at some point, sweeping changes are going to have to be made, and that could affect the pro-consumer goodwill that Sony has built up.

 

[ClosingADoor]

I don't think price drops are a bad thing either - it's helping out MS a ton right now. I just take umbrage with the idea that it signifies that MS is listening to what consumers want (in particular, I don't think it is truly putting games first), and I don' really think it's a good long term strategy; after a while, you start running out of price to cut...

That's true, but I see Microsoft doing a combination of things, including their software updates and game releases this holiday. But the price cuts do help the most with sales at the moment.

 

[MMaRsu]

Who are you to make the decision for him which game he should like? If he likes to play FIFA and think it is better, what is wrong with that?

Well, because FIFA plays like a shitty game and I should know since FIFA13 and Fifa14 were in my consoles all year round. If one can not objectively see that one product is better because they are just used to getting that one product than you are blinded by that shit.

 

[danowat]

Talking about sales, I don't very often vist high street gaming stores, but I was in a local GAME at the weekend, the store is basically split in half, Xbox on one side, PS4 on the other.

The Xbox side (particularly the xbox one area) was bogging, full of people talking to sales staff and buying stuff, there was a definate buzz, the PS4 half was empty.

Intrigued (as the microcosm of gaming forums and sites, and the figures had me assuming the PS4 was killing it), I asked a sales guy if this was normal, and he said that, since SSOD had launched, the xbox one is pulling in all the sales, and the PS4 is a mere dribble to what it used to be.

 

[MMaRsu]

And there you have it. Well step out of fantasy land and into the real world a little bit more and you will understand that every company you "support" ultimately doesn't give a damn about you.

?

Who said Sony does care about me? Im just saying id rather give me money to a company that doesnt come across like total out of touch greedy assholes. Step into the real world.. well im 28 and I live on my own and support myself with a good job so not sure why I wouldnt be in the real world.

?

Some of yall are too quick to forgive.

 

[TomShoe]

Talking about sales, I don't very often vist high street gaming stores, but I was in a local GAME at the weekend, the store is basically split in half, Xbox on one side, PS4 on the other.

The Xbox side (particularly the xbox one area) was bogging, full of people talking to sales staff and buying stuff, there was a definate buzz, the PS4 half was empty.

Intrigued (as the microcosm of gaming forums and sites, and the figures had me assuming the PS4 was killing it), I asked a sales guy if this was normal, and he said that, since SSOD had launched, the xbox one is pulling in all the sales, and the PS4 is a mere dribble to what it used to be.

Sales of a console increase when a new exclusive releases. You don't say.

 

[dr. apocalipsis]

Sometimes I think some gaffers wish MS sales work like this:

But then I read how they attack some other gaffer for buying an Xbox bundle and think that some things are gone just too far.

 

[pixlexic]

?

Who said Sony does care about me? Im just saying id rather give me money to a company that doesnt come across like total out of touch greedy assholes. Step into the real world.. well im 28 and I live on my own and support myself with a good job so not sure why I wouldnt be in the real world.

?

Some of yall are too quick to forgive.

Sony is the godfather if greedy douche assholes.
they practically started drm.

Almost all there business has been about getting monopolies and charging out the ass for it or to be apart of it.

 

[danowat]

Sales of a console increase when a new exclusive releases. You don't say.

It's a point, but the PS4 isn't devoid of recent exclusives and superior multi-plat titles, certainly to see a shift like that.

 

[BigDug13]

Talking about sales, I don't very often vist high street gaming stores, but I was in a local GAME at the weekend, the store is basically split in half, Xbox on one side, PS4 on the other.

The Xbox side (particularly the xbox one area) was bogging, full of people talking to sales staff and buying stuff, there was a definate buzz, the PS4 half was empty.

Intrigued (as the microcosm of gaming forums and sites, and the figures had me assuming the PS4 was killing it), I asked a sales guy if this was normal, and he said that, since SSOD had launched, the xbox one is pulling in all the sales, and the PS4 is a mere dribble to what it used to be.

Cheaper price and good games with good third party support usually does that. Sony is not being very convincing of late as to why they need to be the top dog. Slow updates that actually cause developer problems with recent games. Lackluster first party offerings, broken launch on your one holiday exclusive. Third parties seemingly not really taking any advantage of your hardware spec advantage.

XBO is simply a very compelling package right now. Constant updates and their exclusives so far have been received better. Very tempting bundles at cheap price. And I say this as a non-XBO owner but PS4 owner.

 

[Trust me. I'm a PhD]

Both suggestions are correct my friend.

I think you are right, coupled with the opportunity cost for trying to sell hard in North America. Even with VAT Sony is making a little extra money per console sold in Europe. So why drop the price and loose more in the US when you can keep breaking even with bundles in US and making profit in EU? It sucks for the sake of NDP bragging rights, but Sony will still be winning and will be in a better place financially, so all is kosher from where I am standing.

 

[MMaRsu]

Sony is the godfather if greedy douche assholes.
they practically started drm.

Almost all there business has been about getting monopolies and charging out the ass for it or to be apart of it.

Pls show me examples of Sony being greedy assholes in the last few years.

 

[JavaMind]

So we can expect Xbox one 500k to 1 mi ahead of ps4 in november and same in december?

 

[bill0527]

Pls show me examples of Sony being greedy assholes in the last few years.

Charging for PSN.

Get a second job, $599 US Dollars.

 

[Prine]

Talking about sales, I don't very often vist high street gaming stores, but I was in a local GAME at the weekend, the store is basically split in half, Xbox on one side, PS4 on the other.

The Xbox side (particularly the xbox one area) was bogging, full of people talking to sales staff and buying stuff, there was a definate buzz, the PS4 half was empty.

Intrigued (as the microcosm of gaming forums and sites, and the figures had me assuming the PS4 was killing it), I asked a sales guy if this was normal, and he said that, since SSOD had launched, the xbox one is pulling in all the sales, and the PS4 is a mere dribble to what it used to be.

Damn, thats good to hear - that its selling well, SSOD really deserves it.

 

[pixlexic]

Pls show me examples of Sony being greedy assholes in the last few years.

Moving goal posts? You want to discount a lifetime of Sonys bad practices for 2 years of not so bad yet condemn ms for a announcement that never came into being.

Got it.

 

[Trust me. I'm a PhD]

So we can expect Xbox one 500k to 1 mi ahead of ps4 in november and same in december?

Sony did 1 million in November last year. You think Microsoft will do two million this month? You are out of you F##king mind.

 

[TomShoe]

Sony is the godfather if greedy douche assholes.
they practically started drm.

Almost all there business has been about getting monopolies and charging out the ass for it or to be apart of it.

Isn't that what most companies strive for? Sony isn't the only example of a company trying to make a monopoly. There's Microsoft with Office's brand saturation. Apple, selling high margin pieces of hardware to sheeple. They have more money than they know what to do with. Don't even get me started on cable companies like Comcast.

 

[ClosingADoor]

Pls show me examples of Sony being greedy assholes in the last few years.

"Pls show me examples of Microsoft being greedy assholes in the last few months."

Works both ways

 

[SmokyDave]

Talking about sales, I don't very often vist high street gaming stores, but I was in a local GAME at the weekend, the store is basically split in half, Xbox on one side, PS4 on the other.

The Xbox side (particularly the xbox one area) was bogging, full of people talking to sales staff and buying stuff, there was a definate buzz, the PS4 half was empty.

Intrigued (as the microcosm of gaming forums and sites, and the figures had me assuming the PS4 was killing it), I asked a sales guy if this was normal, and he said that, since SSOD had launched, the xbox one is pulling in all the sales, and the PS4 is a mere dribble to what it used to be.

I'm not sure that the PAL charts support extrapolating that to a wider trend.

 

[L4DANathan]

To be fair, in the 1960s Nintendo's objective with their love hotel business was exactly that.

Contrary to that, the only product by Microsoft that didn't suck was their vacuum cleaner.

Oh my god, that vacuum cleaner line. #dead

 

[panty]

Excellent!

Really?

 

[danowat]

Sony did 1 million in November last year. You think Microsoft will do two million this month? You are out of you F##king mind.

I seriously doubt it, they really shot the pooch at the start of the generation, and I don't think they'll ever make up the gulf in sales figures, but no matter what you think of MS and the way it handles their businesses, they are gaining traction, they have a solid product (ok, not the most powerful) and are (seemingly) giving people what they want.

This gen is far from over.

 

[pixlexic]

Isn't that what most companies strive for? Sony isn't the only example of a company trying to make a monopoly. There's Microsoft with Office's brand saturation. Apple, selling high margin pieces of hardware to sheeple. They have more money than they know what to do with. Don't even get me started on cable companies like Comcast.

Yes I agree but read the post in was responding to.

 

[Trust me. I'm a PhD]

"Pls show me examples of Microsoft being greedy assholes in the last few months."

Works both ways

Tomb Raider? Depends on your definition of greedy and/or asshole though...

 

[Cmerrill]

Charging for PSN.

Get a second job, $599 US Dollars.

Dude, that was almost 10 years ago, completely different management.

 

[vpance]

Sony are countering MS well seemingly everywhere except the US. Even in the UK where MS is strong, Sony have some great offers out there with most retailers.

This suggests two possibilities to me

1) Sony cannot afford to compete similarly with MS in the US. This can also be read that Sony don't *want* to compete on price because they want to make more money during the holidays.

2) Sony don't have the stock to meet demand if they price aggressively to defend against MS, so there is no point cutting the price. MS clearly have a lot of production available (looking at their need to stop shipments earlier in the year), and Sony have maintained momentum since launch with great numbers. So they simply may not be able to compete on a supply level. If this is the case, I'm sure we'll see pre-emptive November NPD PR about 'sold out everywhere' etc from Sony

It helps that their profit margins are bigger in other countries, so they'll choose to cut in those places first. Its the same for MS too, but they have no choice since US is their last stand.

 

[benny_a]

It's a point, but the PS4 isn't devoid of recent exclusives and superior multi-plat titles, certainly to see a shift like that.

That shift must have been localized to that store, as the last two weeks results were superior software sales by PS4 compared to Xbone in the UK.

 

[Zophar]

Isn't that what most companies strive for? Sony isn't the only example of a company trying to make a monopoly. There's Microsoft with Office's brand saturation. Apple, selling high margin pieces of hardware to sheeple. They have more money than they know what to do with. Don't even get me started on cable companies like Comcast.

Nintendo has been successfully sued for violating antitrust laws *and* price fixing. Nobody should be under the delusion that companies care more about your dog than your money, of course. But it does matter how a company is perceived and if they are going to act in the marketplace in good faith.

 

[The Cool One]

Doesn't MS still see money from this though?

 

[MMaRsu]

Charging for PSN.

Get a second job, $599 US Dollars.

Oh right. A second job is more than 6 years behind us. And I didnt pick up a ps3 until a few years in.

Microsoft started with paying for online. Sony followed suit because they dont want to leave money on the table. I dont blame them lol.

 

[Raist]

So we can expect Xbox one 500k to 1 mi ahead of ps4 in november and same in december?

If Sony decides to stop shipping and recalls all current stocks, maybe yeah.