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[DidntKnowJack]

I work in the video game industry. Guess what? Similar stuff happens all the time. Vertical slices, demos, even near completed games get cancelled ALL THE TIME. Difference is that you just don't know about 90% of them.

Like I said, get over it with your holier than thou "preservation of human culture" attitude. At the end of the day, it's just a demo no one will talk about in a year.

Ooh. We got an expert here.

 

[ShyMel]

So I haven't finished PT yet, so I just want to clarify something. The expiration date pictures I've seen floating around are just from German PSN account holders as PT required PS+ to download it on the German PSN correct?

 

[Durante]

It is fucked up since rise of digital distribution, online DRM and shit. That's why i always, if possible, buy games in physical form on consoles. Always. It's also reason why i'm not buying anything on Steam (GOG is a bit different story). Fuck Digital Distribution. And of course #Fuck_Konami

I'm curious how useful will be my account on XBLA or PSN in twenty years? I doubt that companies like Microsoft or Sony will be keeping our paid content on theirs servers. I'm certain that in that relatively not so far future i will not be able to download my stuff.
I still can play my Atari 2600 games today...

There are two things of note in that regard:

• Valve has never (to my knowledge) allowed a company to remove a download for existing licencees.
• Steam runs on PC, so if anyone pulls something blatantly anti-consumer there are always ways to reverse it.

 

[Glitchesarecool]

So I haven't finished PT yet, so I just want to clarify something. The expiration date pictures I've seen floating around are just from German PSN account holders as PT required PS+ to download it on the German PSN correct?

Correct, that is in relation to that person's expiration of their account.

 

[GuardianE]

Discuss? I'm all for discussion - I've never once say don't discuss it.
But the nonsensical mass hysteria "fuck u konami i hope u go bankrupt" and people pretending that their consumer rights have somehow been transgressed is not discussion.
Nor is comparing Konami removing a teaser / advertisement from PSN to the Taliban raping and savaging countries in the Middle East a decent contribution.

Well, taken in isolation, it's extreme. Most of the negative sentiment towards Konami in this thread is the culmination of a lot of transgressions in the past few months (if not years).

I never think that "just videogames" is a healthy approach because its intent is to obviate the need to discuss it seriously or with any gravity, and ignore any societal contributions or impact of gaming.

 

[Garlador]

Bear in mind that while Konami may not be the direct creators, they are the owners of this work, and it is in their right to remove its access. It's unfortunate, but don't construed this as some kind of law breaking action that threatens videogames as a whole.

The problem is less the removal of it from "sale" (i disagree, but I understand), but to actively go in and bar those that DID acquire it from accessing it in their library.

That, to me, is the equivalent of someone handing you a free CD, then coming back a month later, taking your CD without permission, and tossing it away and claiming "well, it was a sample CD for a full album that's not happening, so the songs you DID like you won't ever be allowed to listen to again".

Regardless of intent, Konami are not the ones that determine the worth and value and artist merits of a piece of interactive art. CULTURE does... and we tended to like what they put out, more so than many of their actual full releases.

 

[Glitchesarecool]

The problem is less the removal of it from "sale" (i disagree, but I understand), but to actively go in and bar those that DID acquire it from accessing it in their library.

Ah, I see. I still think the main parties arguing here are getting a bit out of hand with their analogies, but that makes the angle a little clearer.

Has Konami removed other titles, or is it only this one that has been removed in such a way as to be inaccessible.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Actually the people that built these statues are irrelevant,
the people who owned it want it destroyed and made sure they had their way.
I doubt that the ones who built PT wanted it gone.
Regardless of our opinion on the value of games, it's still a part of culture (and a highly lucrative one).
You can be sure that if we could preserve any and all trailers of any movie we pretty much would.

Not at all. You are using an example with hundreds of years between it's creation and now. Over that time it has become an example of culture. In the context of art, culture is a degree of sophistication, an example of a learning or method. Those statues very much meet that criteria now. P.T does not, how can it?

And the people that built those statues very much matter, because they have every right to determine what is and is not done with them. That they are not around anymore is a convenience to your point, rather than an irrelevance, because you get to use owner instead. The creator of P.T is around, and calling the shots with what happens to something you personally consider culturally relevant. Fortunately neither of us get to make that call, but common sense tells me P.T offers nothing of cultural relevance to our generation or species or hobby that other examples do not, and that in 5 years 99.9% of the planet will never of even heard about it, let alone have any idea what it is, if that even is not already the case, which it likely is.

You can't play keeps with every single little thing and say 'but culture' because it's pointless when far more relevant examples exist. It is shit how this has played out, but your position is weird.

 

[ShyMel]

Correct, that is in relation to that person's expiration of their account.

Okay, thank you!

 

[Justified]

The problem is less the removal of it from "sale" (i disagree, but I understand), but to actively go in and bar those that DID acquire it from accessing it in their library.

That, to me, is the equivalent of someone handing you a free CD, then coming back a month later, taking your CD without permission, and tossing it away and claiming "well, it was a sample CD for a full album that's not happening, so the songs you DID like you won't ever be allowed to listen to again".

Regardless of intent, Konami are not the ones that determine the worth and value and artist merits of a piece of interactive art. CULTURE does... and we tended to like what they put out, more so than many of their actual full releases.

Technically they could send you a cease and desist, but enforcement would be too much work, because how could they.

I disagree also with how this is going, but currently they have they "legal" right, until its challenged.

What the "its just a Demo" group are failing to realized is this goes beyond P.T and Konami, but how Digital Distro is handle as a whole.

Sure Its only a small number of case where this happened (Nintendo with Yoshi's Cookie, Amazon with eBooks, Sony with PSM), but the fact is right now ANY Digital Distro company can do it, though most wouldn't risk the bad P.R unless they feel it would go unnoticed as in the few instances I mentioned.

 

[The Lamp]

I can't defend this because it's not my fault or the fault of the consumers that Konami even gave the greenlight to the game in the first place to the point where they released a playable demo to the masses. As a company it's their responsibility to make these decisions, and getting it to the point where everyone's excited and they got people to pour work into something and then yanking it is incredibly irresponsible.

Maybe they should have thought this through before they got the ball rolling. If anything it just further proves their incompetence. You don't create something, get people excited, and then bury it in the dirt. If the budget was too much for them, oh well, they should have bit the bullet and learned from their mistake instead of taking it out on us.

If the budget were too high, did they seriously not have the intelligence to say no before anything even got going? If the project were truly unreasonable, they could have at least gimped it in some ways by either taking del Toro off, limiting the budget for Kojima Productions, etc. Sure, people would have still been pissed off, but not this bad and the game still probably would have turned out to be good.

Wow. You have don't have the slightest clue how product development works.

"they should have bit the bullet" lol no. A company has no social, legal or moral responsibility to charitably offer a product it cannot afford to develop.

"maybe they should have thought this through" you can estimate a product development budget, but changes happen that change the cost and sometimes projects are canned because they're found to be no longer feasible.

Seriously. Just don't even bother complaining if you don't understand how business works.

Having said all this, as I've said before, I fucking hate Konami for this and I think it sets an awful precedent for digital games.

But at least I'm not so jaded to think Konami has some sort of obligation to make me a video game.

 

[Memorabilia]

I work in the video game industry. Guess what? Similar stuff happens all the time. Vertical slices, demos, even near completed games get cancelled ALL THE TIME. Difference is that you just don't know about 90% of them.

Like I said, get over it with your holier than thou "preservation of human culture" attitude. At the end of the day, it's just a demo no one will talk about in a year.

I bet you're fun at parties.

 

[Imbarkus]

I work in the video game industry. Guess what? Similar stuff happens all the time. Vertical slices, demos, even near completed games get cancelled ALL THE TIME. Difference is that you just don't know about 90% of them.

Like I said, get over it with your holier than thou "preservation of human culture" attitude. At the end of the day, it's just a demo no one will talk about in a year.

Ooh. We got an expert here.

Guess what? People care about, dig up, complete, hack, share and/or pirate vertical slices, demos, even complete unreleased games. Thrill Kill, RE 1.5, Skyfox 2... ALL THE TIME. Difference is it has to be a game about which people cared.

So you can get over your holier than thou "I am the expert to determine if you care about this" attitude. At the end of the day this will spur more PS4 hacking than any other event.

 

[brandonh83]

"they should have bit the bullet" lol no. A company has no social, legal or moral responsibility to charitably offer a product it cannot afford to develop.

"maybe they should have thought this through" you can estimate a product development budget, but changes happen that change the cost and sometimes projects are canned because they're found to be no longer feasible.

Seriously. Just don't even bother complaining if you don't understand how business works.

I think once you get to a point where you announce a game and make a demo for it you're at the mercy of your targeted consumer base, and you should probably follow through with it since you had the confidence to announce it in the first place. We don't really know why the game was canned apart from probable reasons, but if it had something to do with budget they could have scaled it back a bit. Like I said, even if the game turned out to be a disappointment it wouldn't have been the first time, and at least they would have actually followed through on their promise.

If you think I'm an idiot, that's fine, but I do think that despite everything that happened that the game should have still been made regardless of how they actually approached the development and budget. You don't announce stuff and let people play it and be excited about the product and then completely pull it. You can, of course, but it does nothing but hurt your connection to your fans.

 

[billy beane]

Can I consider PT one of the best games on PS4? Because I do. It's great, such a unique and exciting experience. It's a shame people won't have access to it anymore.

 

[gus_888]

At the end of the day this will spur more PS4 hacking than any other event.

I kind of agree with this.

 

[Senoculum]

Guess what? People care about, dig up, complete, hack, share and/or pirate vertical slices, demos, even complete unreleased games. Thrill Kill, RE 1.5, Skyfox 2... ALL THE TIME. Difference is it has to be a game about which people cared.

So you can get over your holier than thou "I am the expert to determine if you care about this" attitude. At the end of the day this will spur more PS4 hacking than any other event.

Absolutely agreed. No doubt someone is going to hack their working copy to work on PC.

This is one of the few demos where I eagerly showed to non-gamers; it's such a unique experience.

 

[The Lamp]

I think once you get to a point where you announce a game and make a demo for it you're at the mercy of your targeted consumer base, and you should probably follow through with it since you had the confidence to announce it in the first place. We don't really know why the game was canned apart from probable reasons, but if it had something to do with budget they could have scaled it back a bit. Like I said, even if the game turned out to be a disappointment it wouldn't have been the first time, and at least they would have actually followed through on their promise.

If you think I'm an idiot, that's fine, but I do think that despite everything that happened that the game should have still been made regardless of how they actually approached the development and budget. You don't announce stuff and let people play it and be excited about the product and then completely pull it. You can, of course, but it does nothing but hurt your connection to your fans.

For whatever reason, if the game did not make financial sense to continue, it's not going to continue. This is true of any product at any company. They do not follow through with something just out of good will for fans. It intrinsically goes against the nature of a business, so I don't fault Konami for canning a game that, for undisclosed reasons, may not have been a good business venture for them any longer.

I hate this situation for several other reasons that affect me as a fan. I hate it for the precedent it sets in digital games. I hate it because it's related to Kojimas departure. But if I step back and take an unbiased perspective, I can't fault a company for discontinuing a product idea.

In product development, it's not unusual for 80% of ideas to never make it to market, even if they make it to test markets, or limited time trials, or demos, or what have you. That's just reality. This one just happened to have a public demo release.

 

[Wickerbasket]

I don't really feel comfortable with the precedent this sets; games that I purchase may be revoked at a later date, through no fault of my own, and I will no longer be able to access them for download.

The product was free, but once I purchased the license for £0.00, I became the owner of the product. Functionally, it's no different than any license I've purchased for any other digital download game, so I fail to see why the same rules wouldn't apply.

I don't like the idea of games disappearing from history on the whims of a few people.

 

[Mael]

Did you just compare Konami to the Taliban? Or worse, P.T. to world heritage statues?

There's other examples, it's the most recent that came to mind though.
A piece of advertisement is as much part of our culture as are books, films and anything artsy you would cry over when it would be defaced.
The Taliban were pretty much the owners of the statues when they were bombed.

Not at all. You are using an example with hundreds of years between it's creation and now. Over that time it has become an example of culture. In the context of art, culture is a degree of sophistication, an example of a learning or method. Those statues very much meet that criteria now. P.T does not, how can it?

And the people that built those statues very much matter, because they have every right to determine what is and is not done with them. That they are not around anymore is a convenience to your point, rather than an irrelevance, because you get to use owner instead. The creator of P.T is around, and calling the shots with what happens to something you personally consider culturally relevant. Fortunately neither of us get to make that call, but common sense tells me P.T offers nothing of cultural relevance to our generation or species or hobby that other examples do not, and that in 5 years 99.9% of the planet will never of even heard about it, let alone have any idea what it is, if that even is not already the case, which it likely is.

You can't play keeps with every single little thing and say 'but culture' because it's pointless when far more relevant examples exist. It is shit how this has played out, but your position is weird.

You're too fixated on the example.
Seriously the argument is that the owners of an art piece has the right to do anything he wants to it.
The point of my example is that the owners of the statues at the time wanted them gone and they pretty much had the law on their side in that case.
My point is that gaming as an art form is not disposable, obviously we disagree on that.

 

[Garlador]

At the end of the day this will spur more PS4 hacking than any other event.

I kind of agree with this.

I'm legitimately curious if this happens. As a proponent of game preservation, I almost feel the need to encourage it, just to keep the game accessible, because it's such a memorable experience.

 

[Mandoric]

The problem is less the removal of it from "sale" (i disagree, but I understand), but to actively go in and bar those that DID acquire it from accessing it in their library.

That, to me, is the equivalent of someone handing you a free CD, then coming back a month later, taking your CD without permission, and tossing it away and claiming "well, it was a sample CD for a full album that's not happening, so the songs you DID like you won't ever be allowed to listen to again".

Regardless of intent, Konami are not the ones that determine the worth and value and artist merits of a piece of interactive art. CULTURE does... and we tended to like what they put out, more so than many of their actual full releases.

Since it's something that can be stored locally, isn't it more like the guy who's always handing out free CDs, to the point where you don't get worried about maybe scratching one, suddenly stopping?

It's certainly unfortunate that it's going back ~in the vault~ indefinitely, and it will be nice when preservationists get it running on arbitrary hardware, but getting public access at all to something like this, even if it's killswitched rather than just pulled from distribution (and the only evidence of that is someone making a joke on twitter) is far, far, FAR above and beyond what we see for most early vertical slices or demo tapes or pilots. It's certainly fair to be pissed about the game being canceled, but keep in mind just how much more exposure this got, as a piece of mass media pulled after a successful first run, than things like the Sonic prototype also on the front page that were pulled out of a developer's garage two decades later when even the video cards it can run on are extremely rare and expensive.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

i hate that I cant download it again.

heart broken even.

 

[kaskade]

I deleted it to free up some space not really thinking I wouldn't even be able to redownload it. This sucks. I know it's free but it was still fun.

 

[jetjevons]

Ah, that's unfortunate. I put it on my download list, but don't have a PS4. I'll never be able to play it then, well unless I would know an acquitance that has a PS4 with P.T.


And wow at the drama here for a free teaser.

It's not just a free teaser though.

It was a unique self-contained horror experience/experiment. And a damn effective one at that.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

While I doubt other devs would cop quite as much fanboy rage when they took down their nonrepresentative teaser, they'd still be on the receiving end of quite a bit; this thread is packed full of people who've somehow missed the past few decades of games, even digital games, going away forever and are convinced that not offering extra copies indefinitely is a tort.

So really, apart from Early Access hype-cashing-in (and we've seen how justifiably disappointed people get THERE when major revisions occur) offering something like this is a lose/lose; the only explanation I can see for this one slipping out the door is something similar to the "lost" MML3 teaser where the losing side in a debate over whether to continue development was attempting a hail mary.

Now that I think about this whole situation again I believe you're totally right. We are not going to see more examples of Playable Teasers of big AAA projects. The backlash a company would suffer once they made them unavailable would be too much for them. Also, at the same time they'd have to spend money to even make them. As you said a lose/lose situation.

I suppose they did this P. T. for Silent Hills because it was Kojima who thought about it. I guess a P. T. by another team wouldn't be approved.

 

[Neuromancer]

I'm glad we have all these art and culture experts coming out of the woodwork to tell the rest of us why it doesn't matter that this game we really care about is effectively going to cease to exist.

 

[ThePeoplesBureau]

Well, one can dream...

 

[JoJoSono]

Like I said, get over it with your holier than thou "preservation of human culture" attitude. At the end of the day, it's just a demo no one will talk about in a year.

I loled at this. It's only a demo and yet people have not stopped talking about it and it's almost been a year since it came out.

This was something special and you'd have to be an idiot if you think people will stop talking it or will just forget about it.

 

[Mandoric]

I'm glad we have all these art and culture experts coming out of the woodwork to tell the rest of us why it doesn't matter that this game we really care about is effectively going to cease to exist.

By the "no new copies are being made" standard, easily 95% of games ever have ceased to exist.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

You're too fixated on the example.
Seriously the argument is that the owners of an art piece has the right to do anything he wants to it.
The point of my example is that the owners of the statues at the time wanted them gone and they pretty much had the law on their side in that case.
My point is that gaming as an art form is not disposable, obviously we disagree on that.

No, we don't disagree on that, I don't consider it disposable, only parts of it. I mean, Nintendogs and Brain Trainer could be examples of culture. People of a certain age will all know what they are and they have influenced society as interactive teaching and learning respectively. Fossil Fighters: Frontier is not in any way of cultural relevance, and no one would ever cite it as such. It is disposable in this context. P.T can easily be considered the same and in time I'm sure it will be. It's removal is arguably now of more note than it's existence was a year ago, so depending on where this goes, you may well get it in that book of gaming culture

But my position was never owner, I said creator. That caveat is important when talking about a work I think.

 

[Zoned]

It is fucked up since rise of digital distribution, online DRM and shit. That's why i always, if possible, buy games in physical form on consoles. Always. It's also reason why i'm not buying anything on Steam (GOG is a bit different story). Fuck Digital Distribution. And of course #Fuck_Konami

I'm curious how useful will be my account on XBLA or PSN in twenty years? I doubt that companies like Microsoft or Sony will be keeping our paid content on theirs servers. I'm certain that in that relatively not so far future i will not be able to download my stuff.
I still can play my Atari 2600 games today...

Talked like a full blown naive customer.

 

[Neuromancer]

By the "no new copies are being made" standard, easily 95% of games ever have ceased to exist.

That's not really the same thing because at least fair use copies can be made of most physical media.

 

[Mael]

No, we don't disagree on that, I don't consider it disposable, only parts of it. I mean, Nintendogs and Brain Trainer could be examples of culture. People of a certain age will all know what they are and they have influenced society as interactive teaching and learning respectively. Fossil Fighters: Frontier is not in any way of cultural relevance, and no one would ever cite it as such. It is disposable in this context. P.T can easily be considered the same and in time I'm sure it will be. It's removal is arguably now of more note than it's existence was a year ago, so depending on where this goes, you may well get it in that book of gaming culture

Well I guess you don't care that we couldn't preserve most of the silent films...

But my position was never owner, I said creator. That caveat is important when talking about a work I think.

The creators didn't want it gone, they were fired.
What is happening is pretty much artist made an art piece on command for the owner,
the owner for some reason wants it gone and destroys it.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Well I guess you don't care that we couldn't preserve most of the silent films...

The creators didn't want it gone, they were fired.

On a personal level? No, not in the slightest. On a cultural level yes, because they are early examples of a medium that is incredibly prevalent today. P.T is not an early example of any medium. It is not an object of sophistication in the video game realm. I think perhaps I posted that example to someone that actually enjoys Fossil Fighters: Frontier and believes it worthy of preservation. If that is the case my apologies, take any other super shit game that offers nothing of worth instead.

Konami are the creators - as the company that put it's creation together in both IP, Developers, finance, distribution, marketing etc - but lets assume you want to take it to a developer level...

You have no idea what they wanted, presumably none of them. They may well have intended for this to exist for a fixed time only. An artist is an individual, and this was made by many of them. It is not the same is it?

 

[Drilbit777]

That is just ridiculous, is Konami trying to erase every trace of Silent Hills? Seriously why can't they just let people redownload the demo?

 

[brandonh83]

In product development, it's not unusual for 80% of ideas to never make it to market, even if they make it to test markets, or limited time trials, or demos, or what have you. That's just reality. This one just happened to have a public demo release.

I simply don't think things should be announced before being locked down. Obviously none of this was locked down. Kojima and even del Toro were like hurrr we dunno after the teaser blew people away. It goes back to my pet peeve of announcements being made way before they should be made. I get it takes a few years or longer to make a product like this, but they were confident enough to make this huge splash with the demo, the people working on it, and so forth. It was a pretty big deal. You talk about reasonable business decisions, but for me the most important thing a business can possibly hope to achieve is trust and they've achieved the opposite here.

Maybe you're right. Maybe they don't "owe" me a game, or anyone else that was super excited and supportive of getting the word of mouth out there. I suppose that was our mistake. Look, I get shit happens and I'm not saying this is an industry first, but some of these companies really need to get their shit together and be firm and confident in their announcements, you know, before the announcement. Otherwise you come across like you have no idea what you're doing and that you care very little about pleasing your consumers, if at all.

By the way I'm not really arguing with you, but I did want to address your initial post and I don't think we're necessarily on opposite ends of the spectrum in this debate.

 

[jelly]

Don't know if it has been said but is there some loop hole for content that is free which allows them to remove it completely ? Games have disappeared in the past but paid ones and they were always able to be downloaded again from your license history.

Hope we hear one day what the fallout was all about and why someone at Konami has such a beef. It's like Kojima shat in their cornflakes.

 

[j-wood]

Attempting to be a voice of reason here, the suits at Konami probably had to take this down because of the silent hills reveal if you got to the ending.

I know we all here know that silent hills was canceled and would ignore that. But I would bet money that the executives at konami were looking at it from the average joe point of view.

If you just bought a PS4 and didn't visit gaming sites/neoGAF, you downloading and install PT. You beat it, see the silent hills teaser, get excited. Then mad at konami for finding out it will never come, sue for false advertising, etc.

Now, could Konami simple take the teaser out? Yeah. That would require some coding work though, and they probably don't want to invest in it.

 

[Mael]

On a personal level? No, not in the slightest. On a cultural level yes, because they are early examples of a medium that is incredibly prevalent today. P.T is not an early example of any medium. It is not an object of sophistication in the video game realm. I think perhaps I posted that example to someone that actually enjoys Fossil Fighters: Frontier and believes it worthy of preservation. If that is the case my apologies, take any other super shit game that offers nothing of worth instead.

i haven't played Fossil Fighters so I have no idea if it's worthy of anything but I can say that there's not a single piece of game out there that isn't worth archiving.
In the same way there's not a single piece of film or a published book that is not indicative of a part of our culture.
Film makers at the turn of last century had as much appreciation of their craft than most companies does now.
We've lost many movies because of that.
They viewed it as disposable then and we do not now.

Konami are the creators - as the company that put it's creation together in both IP, Developers, finance, distribution, marketing etc - but lets assume you want to take it to a developer level...

Meh, the creators of the movie are not the suits that footed the bill for the film to be made.

You have no idea what they wanted, presumably none of them. They may well have intended for this to exist for a fixed time only. An artist is an individual, and this was made by many of them. It is not the same is it?

We have no idea what the creators wanted for this but it's safe to say that considering they were fired by the owners they didn't agree on the value of their work.

 

[Corronchilejano]

Ooh. We got an expert here.

GAF just shot itself in the foot.

 

[alr1ght]

Attempting to be a voice of reason here, the suits at Konami probably had to take this down because of the silent hills reveal if you got to the ending.

I know we all here know that silent hills was canceled and would ignore that. But I would bet money that the executives at konami were looking at it from the average joe point of view.

If you just bought a PS4 and didn't visit gaming sites/neoGAF, you downloading and install PT. You beat it, see the silent hills teaser, get excited. Then mad at konami for finding out it will never come, sue for false advertising, etc.

Now, could Konami simple take the teaser out? Yeah. That would require some coding work though, and they probably don't want to invest in it.

Delisting it from the store, most people would say they're justified. Completely removing it from downloads/accounts is going overboard.

 

[Mael]

Attempting to be a voice of reason here, the suits at Konami probably had to take this down because of the silent hills reveal if you got to the ending.

I know we all here know that silent hills was canceled and would ignore that. But I would bet money that the executives at konami were looking at it from the average joe point of view.

If you just bought a PS4 and didn't visit gaming sites/neoGAF, you downloading and install PT. You beat it, see the silent hills teaser, get excited. Then mad at konami for finding out it will never come, sue for false advertising, etc.

Now, could Konami simple take the teaser out? Yeah. That would require some coding work though, and they probably don't want to invest in it.

I think the more valid reason they would have of doing this would be for the usage of the name of Del toro and the likeness of the actor used which could be a liability for them if they leave the game be.

 

[Justified]

i haven't played Fossil Fighters so I have no idea if it's worthy of anything but I can say that there's not a single piece of game out there that isn't worth archiving.
In the same way there's not a single piece of film or a published book that is not indicative of a part of our culture.
Film makers at the turn of last century had as much appreciation of their craft than most companies does now.
We've lost many movies because of that.
They viewed it as disposable then and we do not now.



Meh, the creators of the movie are not the suits that footed the bill for the film to be made.



We have no idea what the creators wanted for this but it's safe to say that considering they were fired by the owners they didn't agree on the value of their work.

True, but you are looking at it on an individual level, unfortunately we have to look at it from a company/organization level

 

[mattp]

Don't know if it has been said but is there some loop hole for content that is free which allows them to remove it completely ? Games have disappeared in the past but paid ones and they were always able to be downloaded again from your license history.

Hope we hear one day what the fallout was all about and why someone at Konami has such a beef. It's like Kojima shat in their cornflakes.

the loop hole is most likely the fact that its free and a demo

 

[Mael]

True, but you are looking at it on an individual level, unfortunately we have to look at it from a company/organization level

Why? Are you a shareholder?

 

[jester_]

see:

Love it. The board must have erupted in applause at this plan

 

[TRI Mike]

This doesn't give me much trust in digital distribution...

 

[Justified]

Why? Are you a shareholder?

What?

Im talking about when determining who are the Creators.

Yes its true, the developers created, and not the "suits", but both groups work for Konami,using Konami assests, thus the Konami company is the creator

 

[Hedrush]

The OT needs changed as it's still available in the UK.