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Time : The Best RPG of 2015 Is Only Available on the Wii U

James, there is nothing 'silly' or merely 'semantic' about the concrete difference between subjective and objective language.

When discussing ones favourite things, subjective language is simply the correct grammar.

Paid writers like Matt Peckham are improperly using objective grammar in a subjective context. It's what gives these articles their inherently argumentative, didactic & sensational tone.

Don't you think our hobby deserves better ?

It's entirely semantics. Nor was the language they used wrong. Time is making a declaration. But the tone and the context obviously imply personal feeling. They do not need to preface it with I think or I believe. This is essay writing 101. Have you written an argumentative essay before?
 
I'm certainly not ignoring it. It has made MGSV tumble down my list. I've seen plenty of other people express the same sentiment. I'm also a Xenoblade fan and I haven't played this new one but from what I've seen this new one definitely tilts in the directions I least liked about the first game.

This review seems to express the same sentiments:

https://killscreen.com/articles/the-pointless-scale-of-xenoblade-chronicles-x/
I do prefer the structure and story of the first but this one still has good characters and a better dub but the money didn't go to the cutscenes this time around.
It's better in almost every way but it's not necessarily better than the first. I can get that but it's still really impressive and the world is densely packed
 
Every year games like Witcher 3 or FO4 win various GOTY awards. Why is it such an issue when another high profile AAA game wins? I mean, they all received high scores and favorable feedback. I guess I don't remember these kind of threads sustaining like this when any other publication announced their Best of. And we're not even talking best of the year. We're talking best RPG of the year.
 

Riki

Member
Every year games like Witcher 3 or FO4 win various GOTY awards. Why is it such an issue when another high profile AAA game wins? I mean, they all received high scores and favorable feedback. I guess I don't remember these kind of threads sustaining like this when any other publication announced their Best of. And we're not even talking best of the year. We're talking best RPG of the year.
Two words:
Nintendo WiiU
 

Jharp

Member
I just finished Fallout 4 and wasn't planning on starting Xeno right away (100 hour RPG straight into another 100 hour RPG, in a year where I spent 100 hours on MGSV, Bloodborne, Witcher 3, Dark Souls 2: SotFS).

But man, I might have to. Game just sounds so good. It's sitting on my shelf, GAF. What do?!
 
Every year games like Witcher 3 or FO4 win various GOTY awards. Why is it such an issue when another high profile AAA game wins? I mean, they all received high scores and favorable feedback. I guess I don't remember these kind of threads sustaining like this when any other publication announced their Best of. And we're not even talking best of the year. We're talking best RPG of the year.

Nintendo
 

Riki

Member
I think people who don't think X has enough focus on story or characters aren't doing the affinity missions.
This is also what I think. The story expands only as much as you want it to.
Xenoblade was about the progression of a world and the fight against fate.
X is about the evolution of characters trying to survive alone in the universe.
What X lacks in religious tones, it more than makes up for in deep characters.
 
Great analogy and great post.

Yep, 400km2.

Also i love the argument "it *only* (like if it's a short amount of time) takes 30 minutes flying on a skell as fast as you can to traverse the planet". Why don't you try running (without sprinting, only moving the stick) at the same speed as the characters in the TES/Fallout games to see how long does it take to traverse the world.

GTA V is 1/5 the size of this game, people should get over it. It's not like this statistic is that important anyway.


Pillars of Eternity is one of the worst and most boring games i've ever touched. Opinions opinions...


the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.
 
I think people who don't think X has enough focus on story or characters aren't doing the affinity missions.

I've only done about 7 or 8 of em, but tbh, from what I've seen they aren't "that" great. People curbstomped F4 for their limited dialogue choices, but it's even worse in XCX. You usually only get 2 options and none of em are that interesting. There's one affinity mission where some guy in a back alley threatens you into doing missions for him, yet breaking his face is not one of the options there.

I also need to go back to gamefaqs and lol @ whoever said XCX had so much spoken dialogue in it that Dual audio was impossible to fit on the disc. I've heard more spoken dialogue in Fallout 1.
 

djtiesto

is beloved, despite what anyone might say
I haven't played more than the prologue (diving into it full-force in an hour or two) but I'm just happy that the mainstream press decided it was OK to like Japanese games again after that nightmare of last gen.
 
I think people who don't think X has enough focus on story or characters aren't doing the affinity missions.

Character yes, story no. Affinity quests really are about characterization more than anything. They also hid heart to hearts this time which is so fucking stupid. 40 hours in and I havent seen one.

The game is not plot driven. So the expectation of an epic plot will let people down. But thus far the characters seem like they are going to be fleshed out more than the original. They are just less interesting characters because they don't live on different parts of a God. Most games are never going to have a more interesting setting than XBC, I dont think that's largely a negative.
 
Character yes, story no. Affinity quests really are about characterization more than anything. They also hid heart to hearts this time which is so fucking stupid. 40 hours in and I havent seen one.

The game is not plot driven. So the expectation of an epic plot will let people down. But thus far the characters seem like they are going to be fleshed out more than the original. They are just less interesting characters because they don't live on different parts of a God. Most games are never going to have a more interesting setting than XBC, I dont think that's largely a negative.

I would say the game is very plot driven, everything you do is toward the greater goal of sustaining life on this alien world. The story time cutscene bits are spread out, for sure, but I would say even the collect 10 strawlenny quests are part of the plot, minor, but still integral.

On the subject at hand, I'd have to agree. I'be played all the big games of 2015 and I think this is absolutely the best, overall. While some excel at specific aspects, I think XCX is the most complete and rewarding package.
 

Nanashrew

Banned
Every year games like Witcher 3 or FO4 win various GOTY awards. Why is it such an issue when another high profile AAA game wins? I mean, they all received high scores and favorable feedback. I guess I don't remember these kind of threads sustaining like this when any other publication announced their Best of. And we're not even talking best of the year. We're talking best RPG of the year.

Remember that one year A Link Between Worlds won GOTY on Gamespot? So much rage that it was both a handheld game and not they're favorite game that already won hundreds of awards.
 
I've only done about 7 or 8 of em, but tbh, from what I've seen they aren't "that" great. People curbstomped F4 for their limited dialogue choices, but it's even worse in XCX. You usually only get 2 options and none of em are that interesting. There's one affinity mission where some guy in a back alley threatens you into doing missions for him, yet breaking his face is not one of the options there.

Yeah because X isn't a game about making choices. Affinity missions are mean to provide characterization and backstory for the various characters. Not to mention you learn a ton about how citizens of NLA interact with the various xenos, what happened on Earth and what their lives were like before, how they're coping with living on Mira, etc. Of course if you compare it to Fallout, which had it's roots in its dialogue system it's going to fall short in that regard. People are curbstomping F4 because it's dialogue options have become simpler/more limited compared to older ones...

Story missions - move the plot forward
Affinity missions - provide backstory and worldbuilding
 

CrisKre

Member
the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.
Your bizarre agenda is a little sad. X world is one of the biggest in gaming. Deal with it.
 
Your bizarre agenda is a little sad. X world is one of the biggest
in gaming. Deal with it.

I'm sure it's one of the biggest, not the biggest though and we don't know if it actually bigger then witcher 3, and just cause 3 is way bigger based on what I'm seeing.
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.

Sorry, but have you played XCX? It's absurdely huge. To get from one place to another without using teleports or flying skells (which you only get at the end of the game, a non-flying skell took me 30 hours to get) takes an eternity. Yes, it does not take 9 hours, but how horrible would that be? As a matter of fact it's bad as it is right now, the amount of time you take for just walking around is astonishing and I would be grateful if XCX was smaller. The sheer size of the game is mighty impressive and other open world games like the Assassin's Creeds, GTA5, DAI or Batman certainly feel very compact in comparison. I don't think the incredible size of XCX is a positive, but trying to downplay it by using basically the comparison of going by feet or using a jet is dumb.
 
Sorry, but have you played XCX? It's absurdely huge. To get from one place to another without using teleports or flying skells (which you only get at the end of the game, a non-flying skell took me 30 hours to get) takes an eternity. Yes, it does not take 9 hours, but how horrible would that be? As a matter of fact it's bad as it is right now, the amount of time you take for just walking around is astonishing and I would be grateful if XCX was smaller. The sheer size of the game is mighty impressive and other open world games like the Assassin's Creeds, GTA5, DAI or Batman certainly feel very compact in comparison. I don't think the incredible size of XCX is a positive, but trying to downplay it by using basically the comparison of going by feet or using a jet is dumb.

I'm not trying to downplay it, for me gtav, and witcher 3 are more then big enough, but the size of x is always used as a showcase of how impressive it is.
 

PetrCobra

Member
I wonder if ninjablade ever plays a game to take a rest from his Thorough Research Of All The Ways Nintendo Games And Consoles Suck
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I'm not trying to downplay it, for me gtav, and witcher 3 are more then big enough, but the size of x is always used as a showcase of how impressive it is.

And rightfully so. It's very impressive. In particular the scale of the animals habitating the world is incredible and the sheer size is very, very impressive. I'm not happy with the game, but this aspect is truly outstanding. The very moment we change subject to how the world is utilized, what kind of interaction it allows and what quality the mission structure is, it puts the impressive size into context, but for itself, this world is massive and it is lovingly crafted from a presentational point of view. I, at the very least, have not played a more expansive game where visually the different places in the game seem so unique and strongly designed from a presentational perspective.
 

DrWong

Member
I'm not trying to downplay it, for me gtav, and witcher 3 are already big enough, but the size of x is always used as a showcase of how impressive it is.
Because it is fucking impressive, like your crazy silly virtual crusade. You're just fucking tiring. Fun sometime like with your big "no shadow" fail in the FRN thread, but most of the time you're just the king of shitting.

And yes I can say that to you because I'm playing the game and know the thing. You don't, as usual when you come into a Nintendo related thread.
 
the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.

The video you posted is nonsense and you realize it. You compared one character walking to another using one of the fastest means of transportation in the game, outside of flying. It's disingenuous, but you knew that already
 

Branson

Member
Your bizarre agenda is a little sad. X world is one of the biggest in gaming. Deal with it.

Is it really? Is there a comparison out there somewhere? I know its big but eveything I've seen is that its around the same size as all of the other big ones.
 

Bitanator

Member
The video you posted is nonsense and you realize it. You compared one character walking to another using one of the fastest means of transportation in the game, outside of flying. It's disingenuous, but you knew that already

He already stated in the screenshot thread how he is not interested in ever playing the game, yet loves to shit on it at every turn. He is obsessed with Wii U for some reason, his parents must have got him one instead of a PS4 couple years ago I guess.
 
And rightfully so. It's very impressive. In particular the scale of the animals habitating the world is incredible and the sheer size is very, very impressive. I'm not happy with the game, but this aspect is truly outstanding. The very moment we change subject to how the world is utilized, what kind of interaction it allows and what quality the mission structure is, it puts the impressive size into context, but for itself, this world is massive and it is lovingly crafted from a presentational point of view. I, at the very least, have not played a more expansive game where visually the different places in the game seem so unique and strongly designed from a presentational perspective.

Yes it's impressive, but the main showcase that's it's bigger then those games.
 
Because it is fucking impressive, like your crazy silly virtual crusade. You're just fucking tiring. Fun sometime like with your big "no shadow" fail in the FRN thread, but most of the time you're just the king of shitting.

And yes I can say that to you because I'm playing the game and know the thing. You don't, as usual when you come into a Nintendo related thread.

The frn,thread I was actually right, even the developer explained why the shadows underneath the cars didn't react to light. It was to make them more grounded in the game or something, can't remember.

The video you posted is nonsense and you realize it. You compared one character walking to another using one of the fastest means of transportation in the game, outside of flying. It's disingenuous, but you knew that already

Is it really? It's not that hard to calculate running speed vs walking speed.
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Yes it's impressive, but the main showcase that's it's bigger then those games.
The metric you proposed to compare the size certainly is not better than the one NWR used, though. And ultimately, I'd say, there is no good metric for that, because speed of traversal and accounting for obstacles are wildly different between any pair of games.
 
The whole "you're a cog in the machine" is probably my favorite thing about XCX. Every JRPG treats you like some sort of golden god and the fate of the world rests on your shoulders. It's refreshing to see a game take a more, "we're all in this together" vibe.
 
The metric you proposed to compare the size certainly is not better than the one NWR used, though. And ultimately, I'd say, there is no good metric for that, because speed of traversal and accounting for obstacles are wildly different between any pair of games.

I have nothing against the method nwr used it's just that they were way off and didn't do proper run across the map, the used a skell at full speed and said they couldn't run across the map, while kotuka did it with out skell, that's doesn't make sense to me since a skell is suppose to be much faster. Nothing is perfect but it does give a good idea of the world size.
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
It probably depends on which point you choose as a starting point. There are numerous points in XCX where you cannot continue in a straight line if you are not able to fly. But maybe there is one route where you can cross the world map without any mountains in your way. However, if you choose you starting point along the perimeter of the world map randomly, chances are very high that you cannot travel to the point farthest away in a straight line without teleporting or flying.
 

DrWong

Member
The frn,thread I was actually right, even the developer explained why the shadows underneath the cars didn't react to light. It was to make them more grounded in the game or something, can't remember.



Is it really? It's not that hard to calculate running speed vs walking speed.
You have a serious problem and we have a serious problem with you.
You were 100% wrong about FRN but it's not a problem for you apparently because all you have to do is rewrite the story to be the one being right when we all witnessed your fail: you didn't elaborate about what king of shadow (realistic or not) they were using (in fact Blu has to explain it to you but you couldn't understand the nuances...), no, what you were claiming was that the shadows weren't in real time, in your urge to downplay the game. Blu and other explained they were, dev said they were.

And now, you are here travesting the facts ("I don't remember"... ah ah, when it was a few weeks ago,when you can check your post history...) It's baffling. It's intellectually dishonest.
 

pulsemyne

Member
the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.

The difference is in Just cause 3 you walk slow as shit (it's a deliberate choice so you use the grapple/suit). While in X you run like an utter mental case.
 
Is it really? Is there a comparison out there somewhere? I know its big but eveything I've seen is that its around the same size as all of the other big ones.

The verticality and feel, I guess, really sets it apart from others. It's not just sheer size, but also the height and scale of it that makes it so impressive. In between dodging through impossible, unimagineable enemies, scaling bizarre terrain, and enduring odd weather, players will come across beautiful vistas and hidden treasures (which are sometimes one in the same), info, items, or enemies that will help them later on, or checkpoints, landmarks, or just perspectives that help them to progress. Mira (the landmass) is a world that isn't just big, but grand in its design; elaborate, intricate, and labyrinthine in it's complexity, a far cry from the giant, featureless worlds of contemporary open world games.

Like, the Witcher 3 did some best-in-class things to weave together story, quest, and consequences its world seamlessly, but it's Xenoblade Chronicles X that is making the best case for having an open world to begin with. From levelling-up (everything), to equipment progression, to story/world progression, to wealth (both in resources and straight-up money)--even the way players and characters move and the way enemies appear--everything ties back into XBCX's open world. This, coupled with how the world itself is designed (mentioned above), makes progressing in the game more than just ticking a box, but an adventure in and of itself.

It's just breathtakingly well done.
 
You have a serious problem and we have a serious problem with you.
You were 100% wrong about FRN but it's not a problem for you apparently because all you have to do is rewrite the story to be the one being right when we all witnessed your fail: you didn't elaborate about what king of shadow (realistic or not) they were using (in fact Blu has to explain it to you but you couldn't understand the nuances...), no, what you were claiming was that the shadows weren't in real time, in your urge to downplay the game. Blu and other explained they were, dev said they were.

And now, you are here travesting the facts ("I don't remember"... ah ah, when it was a few weeks ago,when you can check your post history...) It's baffling. It's intellectually dishonest.

blu explanation about the 3 suns was stupid and wrong, The shadows UNDER the cars, , are generated using shadow volumes projected into the AO buffer. This was selected in order to root the cars more firmly within the world., meaning the shadows under the car don't react to the light source. argument is done and finished anyway. never said said that were not in real time, lol. just said the shadow under the car is not reacting to the light source, that was my main argument which i was right.
 

Fencedude

Member
Not offended but people are believing a fanboy report by nintendo world report, when the world size is being way over exaggerated. kotuka ran across ran across the whole map world in 30 minutes. mean while, nintendo world report said it took them 30 minute with a skell to run across mira as fast as they could. its a big open world game, but i really don't find it impressive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Qfhg2FJgx8

Its about ethics in open world map sizes
 

Fencedude

Member
the video i posted is with out a skell, it takes 30 minutes to run across the planet mira, mean while it takes just cause 3 9 hours walking to across the world, if you use google maps you would compare walking to bicycle speed, the difference would about 1:45 walking vs 30 minutes on bicycle which i think would be similar to x characters sprinting.

Of course Xenoblade X character run at like 30 miles an hour
 

Battlechili

Banned
Finally Xenoblade Chronicles X is getting the recognition it deserves. Its a shame the game didn't get more hype or always seems to be forgotten when GOTY awards get brought up.
 

Mega

Banned
Remember that one year A Link Between Worlds won GOTY on Gamespot? So much rage that it was both a handheld game and not they're favorite game that already won hundreds of awards.

Pretty much. That immediately came to mind.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=736837

Does every major award need to go to one's favorite game on their favorite console platform? One has to be really insecure to get bent out of shape when another title gets some form of recognition. I'm enjoying X and frankly I don't care if it won any awards. It has no effect on my enjoyment. It's so juvenile to let any of this upset you.
 

Riki

Member
Pretty much. That immediately came to mind.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=736837

Does every major award need to go to one's favorite game on their favorite console platform? One has to be really insecure to get bent out of shape when another title gets some form of recognition. I'm enjoying X and frankly I don't care if it won any awards. It has no effect on my enjoyment. It's so juvenile to let any of this upset you.
It's like 5 year olds mad that someone else's toy gets played with more than their own toy.
Just buy a WiiU already, guys. You obviously want to.
 

exfatal

Member
The way people are so salty against this opinion you'd think Time was arguing a case to why shooting your loved ones is a good idea for the new years. Take it easy guys its just an opinion, which I and alot of other people share.
Also to whoever said combat in XCX sucks then says witcher 3 is better cause of that, is an example opinion thats wrong :p
 
A good reviewer can couch his opinion in unequivocal terms without using any weak sounding language while simultaneously letting the reader know that it's the reviewer's opinion.

Again, you're falsely implying that subjective language is inherently weaker.

They do not need to preface it with I think or I believe. This is essay writing 101.
I never claimed that, to write subjectively, one has to preface in such a way. This is Comprehension 101.

The tone and the context obviously imply personal feeling.

The article is entitled "The best role-playing game of 2015 hands down". How does that possibly imply 'personal feeling' ? It's as didactic as it gets.

Here is a subjective title for a subjective matter - "Matt Peckham explores his most treasured RPG of 2015".

Using objective language in an entirely subjective context, in order to bolster ones opinion, is not sound writing.

An eloquent writer understands the limitations of their own tastes, and this is reflected in their words.
 
Writing "I think", "I believe", "in my opinion", etc is redundant, and a good English teacher coaches that out of you in high school, or earlier. Everyone should know an article about "the best" anything is subjective without having to be explicitly told so. This isn't a fucking research paper lol.
 
I haven't kept up with this thread but IMO, this is the most fun I've been having with an RPG this year, and a more satisfying open world to me than Witcher 3, MGS V, Arkham Knight and Fallout 4. Though admittedly, I've only sunk about 15 hours into Fallout 4, but on the other hand, I stopped playing Fallout to "check out" XBC: X, and haven't gone back yet at all. This is probably my 2nd favorite game behind Bloodborne (which I consider to be more of an action-adventure game with RPG elements) and right above Splatoon.

But again, different strokes.
 
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