I'm ready for a substantial leak. Where is vgleaks?
The form factor tells you that, and also that it's a silly comparison.
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Nintendo NX rumored to use Nvidia's Pascal GPU architecture
- Thread starter nhlducks35
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I don't think so. Once NX is revealed it will be judged for what it is and for its games. Anything before it doesn't really matter. What could hurt is if they reveal NX too early before release, because the hype may die down a little by the time it's actually on the market. But even then, it's all about how they market the device.
The early NX announcement definitely did hurt Wii U and to a lesser extent 3DS though.
What's more silly is saying it's going to have PS4 like visual when it clearly won't.
I would actually argue the opposite. Nintendo right now has this brilliant strategy of marketing the NX, which is to say no strategy at all. And it works: People are talking about the "mysterious" ever elusive NX everyday. Especially Youtubers want their slice of the big juicy NX pie and it spreads awareness around left and right.
If the reveal is the kind of bomb everyone is envisioning it to be, then this approach will probably turn out successful in the end.
Well I kind of agree, but people hype themselves up (unreasonably?) more and more before the announcement. It only gets worse the longer it takes. This could backfire for Nintendo if they can't meet the expectations the users have. If they do meet or exceed expectations it's a win situation for them.
I think this conveniently placed leak actually helped set the expectations straight, because everyone kind of knows what to expect now (ie. people that expected a home console have time to get used to the idea of a hybrid console).
That was a mix of bad presentation (insignificant tech demoes) and no marketing. Here I am talking more about bad marketing because of so many uncontrolled rumors
My impression is that they unleashed so many rumors that the actual thing will never be able to stand up against them. They didn't controll rumors at all and they risk to be bad perceived even if they will show an actual 3ds successor with super mega specs and good support because people was expecting an home console. They risk to show a brand new gimmick that will be criticized because of no free form display nor scroll triggers. They risk to be badly perceived even presenting a portable with MH, Pokémon, Mario Galaxy 3 or other stuffs like those because of no COD and so on.
I mean, their silence, the Zelda announcement and so at e3, the abandoned wiiu...it was legitimate at a certain point to expect a home console, and being the wiiu the starting point, expecting a ps4 like power, with porting so easy to foresee a minimum third party support for the home itself.
Instead they are prova creating something different, that per sé could be very good, but being judged as a home console it risks to be seen in the wrong way.
I think that they managed the hype build in the wrong way, with no official info nor controlled rumor
Fourth Storm
Member
True, I'd like a specs list like they got us for Wii U. Preferably with the core config this time.
James Scott
Banned
I wonder if it would be smart to confirm if it's a handheld when they give the new date.
That way journos can't say "Is it a new console? Or an accessory for the Wii U?" as well as keep people's expectations in check
could hurt them in the end though. Some people have these unrealistic expectations, and with all these future patents, etc. The mind can wonder with all the possibilities. When the reveal actual comes and its just a suped up hand held with a minor gimmick, then people will start to feel let down with no hype left.
Obviously the people I am talking about are just a small percentage of the hardcore.
Only some real marketing will really sell the system. And then good word of mouth beyond that.
If they use a Tegra X1, the amount of ram is 2 megas for the GPU plus the amount for the OS. Maybe a 4 GB in total.
If they use pascal, they can use 5 megas or more for the GPU, what give us numbers close of the Xbox for gaming (5) plus the amount necessary for OS.
I really hope it's pascal.
If they use pascal, they can use 5 megas or more for the GPU, what give us numbers close of the Xbox for gaming (5) plus the amount necessary for OS.
I really hope it's pascal.
Some people will be disappointed no matter what Nintendo will release. Many of the rumors (like the fake controller a NeoGAF user made) actually made people think badly of NX, so they will be happy when in reality it's actually something appealing.
In the end it doesn't matter if what Nintendo reveals isn't what people believed it to be, as long as it's actually a machine we think is worth buying and appeals the audience Nintendo targets.
That *might* turn out to be true here on GAF, but the (alleged) target demographic likely have heard 1/100 of those rumours... probably even less lol.
So I guess in the end this will have virtually no inpact whatsoever.
As I said in another thread, what I would do here is to have the NX as a unified console, but sell it in 2 different packages.
· Portable-only: A cheaper package, containing the tablet screen/controller and the detachable controls. It would also feature its own cartridge port, so it is capable of executing the games, obviously.
· Desktop experience: Contains all of the above, plus a charging dock for the controller and an extra box that connects to the TV and has its own bigger CPU and GPU, and also its own cartridges slot.
This way, you can have a handheld device that works as a standalone handheld and is a fully portable console on its own, and also a, let's say, PC-like box connected to the TV that will be capable of displaying the handheld games on the TV with better resolution and framerate. On the other hand, the TV box, with its own cartridge slot, would receive its own line of games that require more power to be executed, hence becoming the de facto home console of Nintendo.
This way Nintendo would have a unified platform, but 2 lines of products: the handheld-only games that could also be seen on a TV screen for the audience that's not interested on desktop gaming; and bigger, more resource-needy games that could only be played in the more powerful TV box.
· Portable-only: A cheaper package, containing the tablet screen/controller and the detachable controls. It would also feature its own cartridge port, so it is capable of executing the games, obviously.
· Desktop experience: Contains all of the above, plus a charging dock for the controller and an extra box that connects to the TV and has its own bigger CPU and GPU, and also its own cartridges slot.
This way, you can have a handheld device that works as a standalone handheld and is a fully portable console on its own, and also a, let's say, PC-like box connected to the TV that will be capable of displaying the handheld games on the TV with better resolution and framerate. On the other hand, the TV box, with its own cartridge slot, would receive its own line of games that require more power to be executed, hence becoming the de facto home console of Nintendo.
This way Nintendo would have a unified platform, but 2 lines of products: the handheld-only games that could also be seen on a TV screen for the audience that's not interested on desktop gaming; and bigger, more resource-needy games that could only be played in the more powerful TV box.
OrbitalBeard
Member
If anything, it's helping. People are dying for NX info.
The only way it hurts is if NX is a Wii U-level disaster in its concept.
Skittzo0413
Member
Yeah and this is what has me kinda worried. I'm sure they know what their mistakes with the Wii U were but I have no confidence that they fixed what is likely the biggest one: marketing.
Whoever thought that Nintendoland fireworks demonstration was good hopefully has nothing to do with the NX reveal.
Actually, the max that can be supported is entirely dependent on the memory bus. The X1 can support up to 6GB currently, since that's the largest size of a single, 6GB, 64-bit LPDDR4 chip. If Nintendo uses a 64-bit bus in a Pascal chip, the limit is the same.
What?
Starchasing
Member
Marketing is only as good as the product. When you have a great product like Wii, everything comes easy. When you have something like Wii U nothing does.
lwilliams3
Member
Well, the Wii U had all kinds of issues that affected the efficiency of marketing. Kinda hard to market something that was collapsing before launch.
IIRC, the fireworks thing was due to them cutting stuff out of the conference.
Yes.
The main issue is that in the few occssions they talked about it They already discussed it as a new way of play. I can already see that being their mmarketing claim
I think this hybrid will be one hell of a concept to market
Fourth Storm
Member
I don't think this is necessarily true. Not sure about the specifics with lpDDR4 (Thraktor, you around, bud?), but other types of RAM do not impose this limitation. PS4 initially used a clamshell design w/ twice as many chips as its memory bus required. Also, think of DIMM modules, which are often loaded w/ many more RAM chips than required for a 64-bit I/O. Maybe lpDDR4 is different, though, I dunno. Regardless, more than 6 GB of RAM probably isn't happening anyway, because lpDDR4 is expensive and there's also limited room on the PCB.
Parker (Pascal based) is said to have an 8GB ram limit plus 4GB vram.
James Scott
Banned
The fireworks also had confetti that was supposed to drop, but it never did. It was apparently because something go cut out, but I'm not sure that was confirmed.
The Wii U issue is probably why *if* they're releasing a new console alongside what's reported on in the EG article it would be best to announce it at a later date.
Skittzo0413
Member
That may be true to an extent, but their marketing with the Wii U was at a whole other level of terrible. For months after the initial announcement, nobody seemed to know if this thing was a new console or an add-on to the Wii. With competent marketing that would never have been an issue.
Regarding the Nintendoland fireworks, I do understand if they simply didn't have enough content to show, but the way they presented it was just horrendous. I remember them essentially saying, "Oh, and before we're done we have one more thing:"
In my mind this type of statement is only reserved for bombshell type announcements, like Metroid Prime 4 or a trailer for Super Smash bros or the like, but no, they decided to get everybody's hopes up even though they knew all they had were crappy little electronic fireworks. It's completely baffling to me that one person even thought that was a good idea, let alone likely their entire event planning team.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
Correct. They did not want to abandon the huge brand awareness the Wii name had and thus stuck with the name which I think is the heart of most of the issues.
They focused on the controller in all the ads. Makes sense, its the unique selling point. Failed to adequately convey it was a NEW console. Unfortunatly, most of those adds involved multiplayer showing other people with wii motes. RIP. Being tied so closely to the ecosystem of the previous console, both in hardware and software, means i dont think there was any easy way to market yourself out of that hole. To make it worse, they fell in the same trap the previous year with the name 3DS though it was no were near the market confusion of the U imo
The market had moved on and the similar name did them no favors in getting people excited about something NEW. Add to that the name was poison for the "hardcore" they wished to earn back. The worst part about the launch was that they failed to get ports of 2012s biggest games, only 2011 ones. Then the software drought from Jan (the first sales collapse) until August with Pikmin destroyed any momentum permanently.
I can only imagine, starting fresh without all the baggage of the previous system, along with the near decade long restructure finally being able to bear fruit shortly, means they will come out of the gate kicking.
It's nothing specific to LPDDR4. There are ways around it of course, but they typically involve limiting the interface of the RAM itself unless more channels are added. I believe what PS4 did was it used 16-bit chips rather than 32-bit, or at least the chips operated at a 16-bit I/O. Thus, it is possible that Nintendo could use two LPDDR4 chips if both are 32-bit.
Parker uses a 128-bit bus, which requires 2-4 chips. I don't think that 8GB is the limit. Also, that VRAM is not for Parker; it's for the dedicated GP106 GPU (same chip as the GTX 1060) used with Parker in the Drive PX2. With all of that said, I highly doubt that Nintendo plans to use an off-the-shelf Parker chip.
Father_Brain
Banned
Eh, the marketing wasn't great, but if people thought Wii U was just a Wii accessory, that just means they didn't find Wii U a compelling enough product to do even basic research into it. Is there really anyone who was excited to buy the "new Wii controller" but was turned off when they found out it was actually a new console?
Also - what "near decade long restructuring?" They merged their handheld and console R&D divisions in early 2013, but I'm not aware of any major restructuring before that.
LegendofLex
Member
This despite Satoru Iwata both showing the console and describing it as one multiple times at E3 2011.
And even if it was just an add-on to Wii, the content (games) and concept (GamePad + HD visuals + Miiverse + Nintendo TVii) should have been enough to attract people if either of them were at all worthwhile. Being interested enough in the content and concept would have led people to find out it was a new console, at which point if they weren't interested anymore it was because of the price.
I said it then and I'll say it now.
The people who clearly couldn't tell the Wii U was a new console and successor to Wii belonged in remedial school, away from functioning members of society.
The Wii U reveal was a good way to weed out the dumb people and enforce natural selection.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
That was when the building was done and the teams actually phycially merged. The plan has been in place for longer than just 2013. The restructuring of development teams and how they handle the producer / available pool of workforce has evolved a bit as well.
It should really all culminate next year and 2018. I can imagine at least half a dozen major games were moved out of the WiiU due to low expected RoI.
TyMiles2012
Member
I agree. I was confused at first as well.
Starchasing
Member
The controller also looked like a wii accesory, they shared the same design philosophies. This was on porpouse, they wanted to carry the wii brand on. But the product was just awful.
I am a hardcore nintendo fan. I follow nintendo news and during the reveal i thought it was a wii accesory.
They showed the gamepad and introduced it as a new console with the actual unit shown in the background.
TyMiles2012
Member
It wasn't awful, the marketing was just terrible.
Fourth Storm
Member
Indeed, limiting the I/O on each chip is exactly what I was talking about. Not exactly in line with Nintendo's philosophy of hardware efficiency however. Likely they set the memory bus some time ago, and if denser chips become available in the interim period before launch, they may consider using them and increasing capacity.
Skittzo0413
Member
Even if it was crystal clear to those paying attention to the reveal (which it was not) they could have nipped all of that confusion in the bud with a followup presentation or press release, but they failed to do that.
I didn't mean to derail this thread, let's get back to Pascals and Parkers and Flops and such
nckillthegrimace
Member
I don't think they ever said it was a new console during that presentation. Hell, I knew they were announcing a new console and I thought it was just an accessory at first and the new console would appear later in the presentation. You have to remember that back then Nintendo was constantly introducing new Wii accessories, so a tablet controller wouldn't be that out of place. It wasn't until they showed the Zelda tech demo that I was like, "Oh, this is the new thing."
It was a terrible unveiling.
Father_Brain
Banned
Yeah, look at the initial 2011 reveal trailer:
https://youtu.be/4e3qaPg_keg
Barely any acknowledgement of the console itself, and most of the games shown have Wii-esque graphics.
But again, none of that would really have mattered if the "New Controller" were a good product that offered sufficiently compelling experiences to the masses, which it clearly wasn't and didn't.
Dark Cloud
Member
I don't see there being a problem with Marketing now that Kimishima is in charge. I read one of his answers to investors to Wii U and he said how "he told everyone that you needed to explain what the Wii U was because it wasn't going to just sell 100 million systems. He also said he told NCL, but he thinks there was some confusion or maybe he came off too negative." Lol. Like Kimishima also said "he's a businessman".
Grok4Spock
Member
It was a little thing called willful ignorance...
Fourth Storm
Member
My 2 cents: The reveal was absolutely atrocious, no question. To a casual who doesn't follow gaming news, I can see where the confusion stemmed from, especially when the console, when it was actually on screen, does look alot like the OG Wii. However, for people who were following the threads on GAF or journalists who had covered the reports of the Wii successor (which started around that April), there should not have been any mistake. I think some were being deliberately obtuse when they questioned if it was a new console.
Yeah the reveal was horrible but the Gaming Press was also complicit in driving the confusion.
They had been given access to the Wii U prior to the reveal. There was no wow this is the first time we saw it stuff yet what were most articles at E3 that year? Is it a Console or a Controller? etc.
There was a large amount of purposeful distortion on the subject
They had been given access to the Wii U prior to the reveal. There was no wow this is the first time we saw it stuff yet what were most articles at E3 that year? Is it a Console or a Controller? etc.
There was a large amount of purposeful distortion on the subject
They could've played with the similar sounding "Two" and "Too". Wii Too as a name could've been a good way to portray the concept behind the Wii U name without using Wii U as the official name.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
Anyone that thought the Gamepad was the console isn't that bright.
They said right before they showed the controller "this is the new controller for Wii U".
I guess I could see some thinking it was a controller for the Wii but they didn't say Wii.
They did a bad job of conveying what the system entailed but people really need more common sense at the same time.
They said right before they showed the controller "this is the new controller for Wii U".
I guess I could see some thinking it was a controller for the Wii but they didn't say Wii.
They did a bad job of conveying what the system entailed but people really need more common sense at the same time.
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