• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Phil Spencer "I honestly don't goal the team on how many units Sony sells"

adixon

Member
This thread is ridiculous.

He obviously meant "I honestly don't gaol the team on how many units Sony sells."

Gaol just means to put someone in jail. Phil is just pointing out that under microsoft's new, friendlier corporate structure, employees are no longer jailed based on units sold by the competition.
 

Iced Arcade

Member
I don't care about what corporation has in terms of numbers. All I know is it's a damn good time for xbox owners. If the so called "losing" is the cause of it... hope it loses every month this generation.
 

Emedan

Member
Irregardless of the naive understanding of the stock market, Microsoft's long term plan is to get people in the W10 ecosystem for monetization. Xbox One is essentially going to be a plug and play "steam" box in the home where you can buy products that they receive the licensing fees from. The Xbox One is already tethered to the W10 PC via Xbox -> PC game streaming and the PC-->Xbox is coming. There is an Xbox App on the PC which allows you to do a lot of the stuff you couldn't do there normally in a native fashion. The integration of Xbox onto W10 allows Microsoft to have a product in the home that uses their ecosystem. They want you to use OneDrive they want you to use all of their services. They really don't care if you do it via PC or XBox. Microsoft is selling you on their ecosystem. You may have a PS4, but if you have a PC and can consume their products via W10, they really are indifferent.

You do not make any money on selling hardware, you make it on the ecosystem. Gaming is not a lucrative business. Its why developers are flocking to mobile because the ROI is incredible and it dramatically opens up their approachable market. If you really think that the Xbox is the key to MS' future you do not understand the market. Go breakdown their P&Ls and dig in on their financials. Their focus in on the following (W10, Azure and Office). Xbox is a part of that but not the key.

Would MS like to be number one in console sales? Sure. However, they would like to be number one only because that creates more users of their overall products. They are giving away W10 for free so they can monetize the market. They aren't expecting the Xbox division to be a significant generator of profitability because it just doesn't happen in this industry. Sony is going all in on gaming as a business and more power to them, but its an incredibly risky bet. Gaming is a low margin business.

You get stuck in the console warrior mindset and you miss the bigger picture here. Both sides are happy where they are right now. A lot of you guys get too wrapped up in Console War bullshit and ignore the fact that both consoles are doing well. I really hope that a lot of these troll posts on both sides are from people under the age of 20.

This is my point, you just assume I don't understand it, I do very well and my point still stands - If MS wants to sell its ecosystem it needs to sell devices that are part of it. I'm absolutely positive MS thought the XBO would be the next big thing, they said so themselves, the next watercooler, entertainment focus. They wanted to break through to a wider market, not only gamers - problem was that the wider non gaming market already have excellent devices that doesn't force them into an ecosystem with big brother. You're underestimating my understanding of these things just cause I simplify them or assume you would know what i talk about when i mention hardware sales.

I got no console warrior mindset, last console I owned before I bought my PS4 was an OG XBOX, I've always been a PC gamer. I think the XBO is the inferior product on the market, so I don't buy it - and I'm not alone in this. I can specifically say what's wrong with it too, why it's a bad product. I don't just say PS4 is better BECAUSE.

Sure. Profit is good.

But Nintendo is languishing in 3rd place this gen. And yet, its stock has increased from 13.38 to 24.30 over the past year. Weird, huh?



I would be very happy with 2nd place if it meant I was more profitable than I would be trying to get into first.

Share, profit and stock prices are not directly related to each other.

Sure but you can't deny the ultimate goal is to grow on the market, increase profit and so on, I'm simplifying it - but growing in a market should be the goal since it increases your customer base, which you can sell your products to. I'm not major in economics, or a stock shark, but I'm pretty sure selling more>selling less.

your giant assumptions about the factors to success miss the giant point. the number one reason MS is in second place is bad word of mouth, and this stems from the decisions you discuss, but the cable box/entertainment sphere phenomena were much less an issue than the gargantuan internet response to an always-online, NSA derived future MS proposed at first. That they chose to focus on the all-in-one multimedia capabilities just contributed to the message among gamers that PS4 was putting games first.......so what mattered most in determining the XB1s current well established and good-performing second place was opinion and ideology among a group that is very interested in fitting in and doing what's right amongst their friends. Not all gamers skew younger, but much of the audience is younger, was younger for the PS4/XB1 at launch, and this audience is highly determinated by what's important and cool among their peer groups. this is basic psychology. People who jumped onto the PS4 bandwagon without fully understanding the capabilities of XB1, endlessly complaining about little features that they didn't even engage with in a personal way, these are the people who created the PS4s indominable position currently. I celebrate this indominable position! Go PS4 with all your sales and fans!

Word of mouth created the position and word of mouth was cemented against the flexibility of the XB1 platform.....which as time goes on will be reversed in some forms, and the lead will begin to dissipate [but probably not completely be eliminated. As more and more people are forced to be less narrow in their thinking, as a result of compelling games and features of the system, and as XB1 continues to evolve and demonstrate its flexibility through important software updates, more and more people will realize that they blindly went along with the crowd. Which, I don't have a problem with, because I think the PS4 is a fine system. I think it's great that PS4 is doing amazing, and I am very happy that XB1 is doing very well.


There's a reason the XBO got a bad word of mouth, cause it was a bad product.
 
You take issue with the weirdest things on this forum. Like nothing I said was insulting or even negative about Xbox. When Phil holds meetings with people like Penello or Greenberg do you not think they discuss how to be competitive with Sony? Do you not think that competition with their market rival is always at the forefront of their discussions?

I didnt take issue with anything nor did I say you were insulting anything? I was merely responding in line to the quote the OP took from the interview.

Penello and Greenberg are very high up people in the division and strategy to sell more units is obviously a part of that, but you've picked two people in senior roles, Xbox has a whole lot more people than that in it and he doesnt set them targets based on how many Sony have sold, which seems very reasonable to me.
 
One of the best parts in the interview!


I have to think more intelligently about the breadcrumb trails that we leave.

hmmm.... let's see....

Obviously Halo Wars makes perfect sense for PC. Would it make sense for a mainline Halo to come to PC as well?

Phil Spencer: Well, we're doing Halo Online. Some of it's around the business model - it's just different than console - some of it's about control, and other things are creative. If you think of Team Fortress or going back to Half-Life, which obviously had great success on PC and would make complete sense on console as well.
well.

Half-Life 3 confirmed for Xbox to be announced at e3 2016 BOYSSS!!!!!
 

Catdaddy

Member
When you shoot the horse before it leaves the gate, it's hard to make up all that ground.... but glad to see they are still trying..

So if history is correct, they'll have the next gen cause Sony will do something stupid...The PS5...only USD$999 (and only one controller - charging cord sold separately)
 

joecanada

Member
When you shoot the horse before it leaves the gate, it's hard to make up all that ground.... but glad to see they are still trying..

So if history is correct, they'll have the next gen cause Sony will do something stupid...The PS5...only USD$999 (and only one controller - charging cord sold separately)

thats some revisionist history, basically playstation has dominated gaming since day one, except for maybe that ps3 launch, even then they were selling......just not in total dominating fashion.

I don't have any personal investment but those are just the facts, ps1, ps2 were both hits, ps3 sold as well as any other system, and ps4 is selling well so far.....

if history is correct, everyone else is in trouble. but luckily for xbox, it only takes one or two hit game franchise to change the world.
 
Goal the team...

It's actually painful to read that.

This thread is ridiculous.

He obviously meant "I honestly don't gaol the team on how many units Sony sells."

Gaol just means to put someone in jail. Phil is just pointing out that under microsoft's new, friendlier corporate structure, employees are no longer jailed based on units sold by the competition.

xD
 

aaronwt

Member
lol I got my xb1 on day one and I still feel ripped off over that Kinect. I couldn't believe they had that price drop so fast. I am still salty to this day and it definitely made me rethink supporting MS at launch again.
Without Kinect I wouldn't want a third XboxOne. Kinect is the one thing I use everytime I turn my Xbox Ones on. I had hoped my PS4 camera would be somewhere close to useful like Kinect, but I never use the ps4 camera any more. So I just us the controller with my PS4, which is a stark contrast to using Kinect on the Xbox One(using just a controller with either system is very different.). For me, Kinect was well worth the $500 and $430 I paid for my launch Xbox One and the one I got in December 2013.
 

Catdaddy

Member
thats some revisionist history, basically playstation has dominated gaming since day one, except for maybe that ps3 launch, even then they were selling......just not in total dominating fashion.

I don't have any personal investment but those are just the facts, ps1, ps2 were both hits, ps3 sold as well as any other system, and ps4 is selling well so far.....

if history is correct, everyone else is in trouble. but luckily for xbox, it only takes one or two hit game franchise to change the world.

Was sarcasm included and was talking about since Xbox 360/PS3 launch. Just to set the record straight, Sony has done well, but "back in the day" Sega and Nintendo and Ps1 were all great. PS2 was the standout....
 

Pejo

Gold Member
I like the hand they are currently playing with focusing on first party stuff and diversifying their lineup a bit over just shotbang. It's sorta what Sony did last gen with PS3 to gain traction, and it's just nice to see.
 
"Xbox customers we have across 360, Xbox One and Windows"

They should simply count all Windows users as Xbox customers. Bam, generation won, no more need for China's 1%.
Sorta. It seems more like they're starting to count XBox users as Windows users.

On the topic itself, I like delivery of the xbox as a software platform message. The "XBox Unifying with windows" pr line is awesome in its power. Its time for the xbox business to wind down, and they are successfully selling the story that it's about to be bigger than ever. I couldn't imagine a more graceful exit.
Well, I guess that's a good point. They've kind of been hinting at where XBox is headed since Nadella took over, but I count figure out why they weren't being more clear about it. A 'graceful exit" is as good an explanation as any, I suppose.

I was gonna post a lot of this in the "Why ____ aren't launching on Windows" thread, but this thread took off before I got a chance. Anyway, it sorta covers their overall strategy for XBox moving forward in the wake of their most recent defeat, so I guess it's sorta on topic for either thread.

Okay, Nadella said he wanted to use XBox "in ways that make sense" after having said MS need to refocus on their core competencies; Windows and servers. A lot of people took that to mean that XBox's future was ensured, but I interpreted as a change in strategy, and he planned to start using XBox in ways that made sense for a company who's business is built on Windows and servers.

As a product, how does XBox benefit MS? Thanks to the nature of the console market, unlike phones and tablets, they're not able to sell the hardware for a significant profit. There's the obvious issue of platform royalties, so let's look at those.

I'm sure we're all familiar with The Anatomy of a $60 Video Game. When a 3rd-party game sells, Nintendo, Sony, and MS collect about $7 from the publisher. If CoD sells a million copies on the Bone, as platform holder, MS collect $7M from Activision. Pretty sweet, right?

But let's take a look at digital publishing. The industry standard split for publishers and retailers is 70/30. Now MS are collecting $18 on each $60 copy of CoD sold, more than two and a half times what they collected on the physical copy. That's a massive increase in revenue, and all it cost them is a bit of drive space and bandwidth. In fact, the price of the digital version would need to fall to about $23 before MS were collecting less than the $7 they'd get from a $60 physical game. From Activision's perspective, they're collecting $42 on a $60 sale, instead of the $27 they get on a physical sale.

So clearly, digital transactions are far more profitable for both publisher and retailer, and as we know, digital distribution is the future. Eventually, at least. So while it's nice to have both, digital sales are ultimately worth more than physical sales, and more so as the world shifts to digital.

You know who are making lots and lots of digital sales these days? Valve, with their Steam store. And they're making huge profits, because their business is basically nothing more than a glorified datacenter. Hey, weren't data centers supposed to be one of Microsoft's two core competencies? And not only are Valve serving more of this data than MS are, they're mostly serving it to Windows users! And now they're coming out with their own OS, FFS!!

While MS have been dicking around with the XBox, gaben just waltzed in and snatched up an incredibly lucrative market that Microsoft should've been all over from Day Zero. Now, instead of dominating that market, they need to fight someone else out of a dominant position, while simultaneously defending from an attack against the other pillar of their business, Windows. If Valve can finally do for Linux what Apple did for UNIX and make it in to a truly consumer friendly OS, that's probably the biggest threat to Microsoft hegemony, well, probably since Jobs returned to Apple with NeXT in hand. I'm not saying Valve will finally put Linux in to non-geek homes, but it's a possibility MS can't afford to ignore.

So while XBox owners have been asking themselves what W10 integration means for XBox, with MS being beaten at their own game by some dude that made a couple of popular games, I think Phil's been more focused on what meaning XBox has for Windows. I think that's what Nadella meant by "ways that make sense." Can XBox offer anything that makes Windows more attractive? Can XBox help us expand the Windows ecosystem? If so, how? If not, it's dead weight, given the company's stated focus on Windows and servers. MS need to start luring users away from places like Steam and in to their own marketplace. The XBox division may be able to contribute with any remaining mindshare/goodwill they have, services possibly worthy of store preference if not an actual subscription, and possibly even games exclusive to the MS storefront.

Beyond that, with XBox finally becoming "just another Windows device," the XBox product itself doesn't really have anything to offer MS. Selling the hardware itself doesn't do anything for them other than tie up a bunch of capital. It makes no difference to them if a game is sold for Windows or XBox if they collect the same 30% of the sale either way. As I understand it, going forward, all development will be done for Windows 10, and if developers tick the Universal box, it will magically deploy for all of the WinDevices — phones, tablets, and consoles — as well. With no real interest in making hardware themselves, in the future MS may license an XBox-like UI for Win10 that companies like Dell can use in an HTPC kind of like Big Picture Mode, or maybe they'll just include it as an optional UI in every copy of Win10. Perhaps an "XBox Certified!" sticker Dell can stick on the case so people can tell the gaming boxen from the ones that just play Blu-rays and stuff.

Anyway, it seems like the general idea is that once again, MS are all about Windows. If you're a Windows user, they've now extended that ecosystem in to additional devices — phones, tablets, and consoles — to help improve every aspect of your life. Everything is Windows now, but if an experience makes sense on an additional device, that dev should definitely click that button and give it to you! At least, that's the direction they appear to be headed.
 
Don't worry Phil, you tried.

tumblr_mc9u862zn11r44l79o1_500.gif

EDIT: Late, heh.
 
Doing the right thing, they probably can't win this generation but the race to win the next generation has already begun (momentum/mindshare) and that they can win.

The "next gen" is not even a twinkle in anyone's eyes yet. And, there is no "momentum" going toward the "next gen" only 2 years into a 7 to 10 year cycle. If there was, then PS5 would already be declared winner of next gen, too. PS4 is outselling XB1 month after month no matter what MS does. And that is before Sony launches its "big guns" next year.
 
This thread is ridiculous.

He obviously meant "I honestly don't gaol the team on how many units Sony sells."

Gaol just means to put someone in jail. Phil is just pointing out that under microsoft's new, friendlier corporate structure, employees are no longer jailed based on units sold by the competition.

Pretty much this. All that ever mattered to me is that a console is a success. Selling well basically. This whole "winning" thing doesnt really mean automatic stream of amazing games. MS has the money to fund new experiences and keep good franchises going, and even if them "losing" is making them try harder with that money, its a win for gamers.

Having a steady stream of good games should be the focus for all platforms.
 

Backflip

Junior Member
During Gamescom, we (as in Gameblog) got the opportunity to chat with Phil Spencer about a variety of topics (backwards compatibility, the state of the European market, the Shenmue III announcement, and more). It's a pretty interesting chat (and it's in English): http://www.gameblog.fr/news/52790-phil-spencer-nous-repond-en-exclu-xbox-one-retro-compatibili

For example, Phil talks about the number of people who work on backwards compatibility.

I'd like to create a topic about the interview since it has new information but my account seems to be locked on "Junior".
 

Crayon

Member
big snip... With no real interest in making hardware themselves, in the future MS may license an XBox-like UI for Win10 that companies like Dell can use in an HTPC kind of like Big Picture Mode, or maybe they'll just include it as an optional UI in every copy of Win10. Perhaps an "XBox Certified!" sticker Dell can stick on the case so people can tell the gaming boxen from the ones that just play Blu-rays and stuff.

The problem with your Xbox-Box here is that it can either run steam or it can't. It can run steam, and everyone just uses their xbox-box to shop on steam. Or it can't and it's a thousand games short of steamos.
 
Was sarcasm included and was talking about since Xbox 360/PS3 launch. Just to set the record straight, Sony has done well, but "back in the day" Sega and Nintendo and Ps1 were all great. PS2 was the standout....

It was a pretty decisive lead over Nintendo for the original PlayStation. Much larger than gap the Wii has over the 360 or PS4. PlayStation has been in control of every generation since its inception except the previous one.
 

ILoveBish

Member
During Gamescom, we (as in Gameblog) got the opportunity to chat with Phil Spencer about a variety of topics (backwards compatibility, the state of the European market, the Shenmue III announcement, and more). It's a pretty interesting chat (and it's in English): http://www.gameblog.fr/news/52790-phil-spencer-nous-repond-en-exclu-xbox-one-retro-compatibili

For example, Phil talks about the number of people who work on backwards compatibility.

I'd like to create a topic about the interview since it has new information but my account seems to be locked on "Junior".

Great interview, i really liked how phil went through it all. He seems like a good dude.
 
During Gamescom, we (as in Gameblog) got the opportunity to chat with Phil Spencer about a variety of topics (backwards compatibility, the state of the European market, the Shenmue III announcement, and more). It's a pretty interesting chat (and it's in English): http://www.gameblog.fr/news/52790-phil-spencer-nous-repond-en-exclu-xbox-one-retro-compatibili

For example, Phil talks about the number of people who work on backwards compatibility.

I'd like to create a topic about the interview since it has new information but my account seems to be locked on "Junior".

Nice interview, the part about where they ask him if "there was a unannounced game that he has played" and he answered "no" I find very interesting. Does that mean we won't have new Xbox One first party games announced until next E3 then?
 

Chobel

Member
During Gamescom, we (as in Gameblog) got the opportunity to chat with Phil Spencer about a variety of topics (backwards compatibility, the state of the European market, the Shenmue III announcement, and more). It's a pretty interesting chat (and it's in English): http://www.gameblog.fr/news/52790-phil-spencer-nous-repond-en-exclu-xbox-one-retro-compatibili

For example, Phil talks about the number of people who work on backwards compatibility.

I'd like to create a topic about the interview since it has new information but my account seems to be locked on "Junior".

LOL at 1:04
Phil Spencer said:
We want to have sex... success in all the markets
 
I think being behind might work in their favour somewhat. When Sony was behind with the PS3 it worked damned hard to secure studios and exclusive games and ended the generation outselling the 360, if I'm not mistaken?
 

Wynnebeck

Banned
I think being behind might work in their favour somewhat. When Sony was behind with the PS3 it worked damned hard to secure studios and exclusive games and ended the generation outselling the 360, if I'm not mistaken?

Yes but it's a completely different situation. It's not that Sony wasn't popular and tried to gain people back. Playstation always had a fanbase. People just didn't want to deal with Sony's PS3 bs price. Once the price lowered and more games came out, everything was gravy. For Xbone, it was hit with a triple whammy of bs original price, a shitty system MO (that got reversed thankfully) and hubris filled leadership who did nothing but fan the flames. Add all of that to the fact that the Xbox has nowhere near the clout Nintendo or Sony has globally and you get today's Xbone situation.
 

psn

Member
I think being behind might work in their favour somewhat. When Sony was behind with the PS3 it worked damned hard to secure studios and exclusive games and ended the generation outselling the 360, if I'm not mistaken?
Sony always had a great library of games. I can't think of a Playstation console with a bad library.
If the PS3 would have sold better (and it did sell really good from the start in most markets), then I don't think there would have been a big difference. They always tend to focus on games.

In contrast, see the Xbox 360 lineup after 2009. They heavily relied on 3rd party games because they already sold more units in the US and A (and UK obv. They were resting on their laurels more than Sony ever did imo.
 

MDSLKTR

Member
Must have seen all the ps4 bundles coming out this year and said to himself "what's the point anymore", I hope we hear from greenberg this year too
 
The problem with your Xbox-Box here is that it can either run steam or it can't. It can run steam, and everyone just uses their xbox-box to shop on steam. Or it can't and it's a thousand games short of steamos.
Sure, but that's true of every Windows box, and that's sorta the problem. Everyone is buying from Valve instead of MS, even on Windows. The overall Windows software market is far larger than the console software market — especially when you're only looking at Microsoft's share of the latter — and it's Microsoft's market.

If Nadella wants to "refocus on Windows," surely correcting things like that must be part of the plan, and as I said, Team XBox does have some things to offer that may help lure users away from Valve. Like I said, there are people out there who, for whatever reason, think XBox is cool, so simply slapping the XBox name on the service will draw some people in. And while Microsoft Studios' output may pale in comparison to someone like Nintendo or even SCE, they've made a lot more games than Valve have, at least. Then there's stuff like "first class" matchmaking, Games with Gold, etc.

So yeah, the XBox Too will probably be "sorta like a Steam Machine, except with MS stuff," but if MS can persuade Dell to sell those instead of Steam Machines running Linux — or at least in addition to them — then that's a win as far as MS is concerned, because it helps prevent users from wandering away from Windows. And keep in mind MS intend to sell a lot more than games in their store, but if the XBox brand helps lure in a few game to jump start the new storefront, then great.
 

Crayon

Member
Sure, but that's true of every Windows box, and that's sorta the problem. Everyone is buying from Valve instead of MS, even on Windows. The overall Windows software market is far larger than the console software market — especially when you're only looking at Microsoft's share of the latter — and it's Microsoft's market.

If Nadella wants to "refocus on Windows," surely correcting things like that must be part of the plan, and as I said, Team XBox does have some things to offer that may help lure users away from Valve. Like I said, there are people out there who, for whatever reason, think XBox is cool, so simply slapping the XBox name on the service will draw some people in. And while Microsoft Studios' output may pale in comparison to someone like Nintendo or even SCE, they've made a lot more games than Valve have, at least. Then there's stuff like "first class" matchmaking, Games with Gold, etc.

So yeah, the XBox Too will probably be "sorta like a Steam Machine, except with MS stuff," but if MS can persuade Dell to sell those instead of Steam Machines running Linux — or at least in addition to them — then that's a win as far as MS is concerned, because it helps prevent users from wandering away from Windows. And keep in mind MS intend to sell a lot more than games in their store, but if the XBox brand helps lure in a few game to jump start the new storefront, then great.

The steam machine is a wedge tactic. You are already on the right track with your thinking but just take a step back on look at the big picture.

Years ago, Newel made a statement about windows 8 being a disaster, and the decision to support linux and develop the steamos distro was to make a fallback plan for steam if ms was ever to wall off windows with a store. Valve has actually made themselves appear quite vulnerable with steamos. Especially vulnerable when you consider thst ms could flip xbox from a playstation too, to a steam machine-too in a shortish timespan. It seems like would stamp out steamos if they did this because of the larger games library on windows and the huge windows usership. But in truth, many those compatible games and invested gamers are really on the steam platform as much as they are windows. MS must now tread lightly because any motion against valve is a motion against pc gaming at large.

Valve and ms are conjoined in pc gaming now. Valve, in defiance of the status quo, has put a wedge between them and is inviting ms to pry them apart. The ball is in microsoft's court now. They either stay perfectly still and be content with pc gaming meaning using steam on windows like it does today, or start striking that wedge and taking steam users.
 

hipbabboom

Huh? What did I say? Did I screw up again? :(
During Gamescom, we (as in Gameblog) got the opportunity to chat with Phil Spencer about a variety of topics (backwards compatibility, the state of the European market, the Shenmue III announcement, and more). It's a pretty interesting chat (and it's in English): http://www.gameblog.fr/news/52790-phil-spencer-nous-repond-en-exclu-xbox-one-retro-compatibili

For example, Phil talks about the number of people who work on backwards compatibility.

I'd like to create a topic about the interview since it has new information but my account seems to be locked on "Junior".

Such a silly point to fixate on but Is France considered a Latin country?
 
I think being behind might work in their favour somewhat. When Sony was behind with the PS3 it worked damned hard to secure studios and exclusive games and ended the generation outselling the 360, if I'm not mistaken?

Not quite, Sony always had games, the price point was the cause of the outrage among the media. Sony didn't "need" to secure exclusive japanese games, those japanese games will always appear on the Playstation system.

Take a look at Tales of Vesperia, when they ported that thing on the ps3 for Japan it double the 360's opening day sale. Japan will always favour the Sony system, after the Vesperia debacle, have you seen any Tales of series in Microsoft system? Even the 2 latest Tales of will be exclusive to the Sony system (ps3 & Ps4)

That's the difference between Sony and Microsoft, Sony will always have the support of the Japanese devs, they won't have problems securing Japanese games because Japanese devs will favour Sony over Microsoft. Look at the PS4, it's becoming the JRPG machine just like the PS2 with the return of some of the most awaited titles and other JRPGs to bolster Sony's RPG line-up:
Dragon Quest X and XI
Phantasy Star Online 2 Ps4 (jap only)
Persona 5
Unrevealed Level-5 RPG
FF7R
Tales of Berseria
Tales of Zestria
Sword Art Online: Lost Song
Yoru no Nai Kuni
Dragon Quest Heroes II
Digimon Story: Cyber Sleuth
Hyperdimension Neptunia Victory II
Atelier Sophie: The Alchemist of the Mysterious Book
Untitled Ys game

All from the top of my head. While Microsoft will have the western AAA multiplats games, they will always lack the JRPG's that always bolster Sony's line-up. It happened with the PS2, it happened with PS3 and now early on the PS4's life it already have a great JRPG line-up coming out.
 
The steam machine is a wedge tactic. You are already on the right track with your thinking but just take a step back on look at the big picture.

Years ago, Newel made a statement about windows 8 being a disaster, and the decision to support linux and develop the steamos distro was to make a fallback plan for steam if ms was ever to wall off windows with a store. Valve has actually made themselves appear quite vulnerable with steamos. Especially vulnerable when you consider thst ms could flip xbox from a playstation too, to a steam machine-too in a shortish timespan. It seems like would stamp out steamos if they did this because of the larger games library on windows and the huge windows usership. But in truth, many those compatible games and invested gamers are really on the steam platform as much as they are windows. MS must now tread lightly because any motion against valve is a motion against pc gaming at large.

Valve and ms are conjoined in pc gaming now. Valve, in defiance of the status quo, has put a wedge between them and is inviting ms to pry them apart. The ball is in microsoft's court now. They either stay perfectly still and be content with pc gaming meaning using steam on windows like it does today, or start striking that wedge and taking steam users.
Sorry, but I'm not sure what you're getting at. I'm not entirely certain who you think has the upper hand here. You're saying that while appearing vulnerable and inconsequential, Valve have been quietly entrenching themselves, and are now a force to be reckoned with, so MS can't take them lightly?

Then I think we agree? When I said MS would be going after Steam customers, I didn't mean all out war. MS just made a point of saying they have no intention of going after Steam, so obviously they're trying to fly casual, but I've no doubt Valve and Steam are on their radar if not directly in their sights. It seems to me that SteamOS is the wedge, and it's splitting off users just under its own weight. MS have no choice but to respond. Linux has already been encroaching on their business from the server side; they don't need a serious Linux push joining Apple from the consumer side. Not to mention Android.

You say there are a lot of gamers "on the Steam platform." Do you just mean using the store and stuff, or actually running SteamOS? Do we have any stats on how many run SteamOS now? What portion of the Steam library is actually available on Linux? I mean, yeah, MS would love to have the money Valve are collecting on Steam, but I think SteamOS is the real "threat" here.
 
Must have seen all the ps4 bundles coming out this year and said to himself "what's the point anymore", I hope we hear from greenberg this year too

He'll be his usual bullish bullshitting self during fall/holiday/christmas/autumn wins/near misses that can be fudged, and nowhere to be seen otherwise. If Spencer had any sense he would have fired him.
 

Crayon

Member
Sorry, but I'm not sure what you're getting at. I'm not entirely certain who you think has the upper hand here. You're saying that while appearing vulnerable and inconsequential, Valve have been quietly entrenching themselves, and are now a force to be reckoned with, so MS can't take them lightly?

Valve is seemingly moving in anticipation of microsoft, which shows insight. If they are correct (with steamos) there is much to gain and if they are wrong there is not much to lose, which shows strategy. It's hard to say who has the upper hand because both steam and windows stand to lose if split apart. But yes, I'm saying that ms cannot take them lightly. Cannot bully them or shut them out.


Then I think we agree? When I said MS would be going after Steam customers, I didn't mean all out war. MS just made a point of saying they have no intention of going after Steam, so obviously they're trying to fly casual, but I've no doubt Valve and Steam are on their radar if not directly in their sights. It seems to me that SteamOS is the wedge, and it's splitting off users just under its own weight. MS have no choice but to respond. Linux has already been encroaching on their business from the server side; they don't need a serious Linux push joining Apple from the consumer side. Not to mention Android.

Steamos is indeed the wedge. And it's a serious one. It along with steam for linux has created a commercial game market on linux. Which was deemed impossible by many just befor it's launch. The wedge is set. The important thing is that both valve and ms stand to lose if the PCgaming = Windows + Steam paradigm is upset. Valve is saying "if you hit this wedge and push us apart, were taking a piece with us."

It's not just a bluff tho. Valve expects ms to hit the wedge. They can't help themselves. They've already concocted the competitor to steam with the new xbox app and store integration. It's only a matter of time before they start leveraging every anticompetitive edge and making life hard for users who prefer steam. Of course, microsoft could go the other way and ensure that windows stays hospitable and supportive of steam users, in which case valve can continue doing business unfettered and minimal blood would be spilled. This is the art of war.

You say there are a lot of gamers "on the Steam platform." Do you just mean using the store and stuff, or actually running SteamOS? Do we have any stats on how many run SteamOS now? What portion of the Steam library is actually available on Linux? I mean, yeah, MS would love to have the money Valve are collecting on Steam, but I think SteamOS is the real "threat" here.

I mean using the steam platform to buy, install, launch and essentially do everything with their games. As far as people running steamos now, it's probably in the thousands. Hardly any. There are around a million linux users on steam, tho. As far as what portion of the library, maybe 20-25%.

Steamos or linux is no threat to ms by itself. It doesn't have the weight on it's own to split off many users. However, MS could make steamos more successful by undermining steam's business on windows. It's kind of a beautiful irony.
 
Top Bottom