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[Elios83]

Am I the only one here thinking 2017? Why have ps4, ps4 slim, ps vr, and ps4 neo all on store sheleves this holiday? Its all very cannibalistic.

Nope because they're all catering to different audiences.
Slim is for the mainstream market, those who still haven't bought a PS4 because the price is too high. And it's just a replacement for the current PS4, not a new product.
Neo is for core gamers and AV enthusiasts. Those people likely already have a PS4 and they want these people to upgrade.
PSVR is a platform on its own, it's a small business, they won't do big numbers at least this year and no one knows if it's going to be a success or the new 3D glasses.

 

[Hawk269]

Slim Available the 20th for $199. Neo Available October 18th for $399.

You need to layoff whatever it is that you are smoking, snorting or drinking. No way it will be $199.99. I am still in the belief that it will be $299.99. Even with the savings, that is still $50.00 cheaper than the current model and I would think Sony wants to maintain that profit margin which has been what has been helping Sony as a whole.

 

[Hawk269]

Nope, we really only have PS4, and its a replacement, not a new product, also PSVR is sold out, there won't be any on the shelves till next year, so.. no problem for Neo

Pre-orders are sold out. There will be units available at launch of the PSVR. Thinking that none will be made available till next year is not thinking straight. I don't think ANY company would announce a release for a product in October heading into the holidays, but not have any on Stores shelves till 2017. I think the confusion is that pre-orders are sold out, most companies have a set amount of pre-order units and then for regular customers. Then you have the many retailers that did not do pre-orders at all.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Am I the only one here thinking 2017? Why have ps4, ps4 slim, ps vr, and ps4 neo all on store shelves this holiday? Its all very cannibalistic.

PSVR is already sold out for the rest of the year stock wise, and PS4 Slim is just a replacement for OG PS4 which has probably already been fully discontinued in many territories, just clearing out stock

You need to layoff whatever it is that you are smoking, snorting or drinking. No way it will be $199.99. I am still in the belief that it will be $299.99. Even with the savings, that is still $50.00 cheaper than the current model and I would think Sony wants to maintain that profit margin which has been what has been helping Sony as a whole.

Just calm down. That is his prediction.

 

[vin-buc]

3cm is more than an inch. That's a pretty significant increase in height, if true.

How much taller is that then the OG PS4 though (assuming 3cm taller than the slim)? I always hoped that the redesign would be taller but not as deep for better cooling. More like a larger Mac mini. The depth annoys me and I like to keep it away from the wall to not draw exhaust.

Btw - I'm liking what I see in the new drawing. It looks proportional.

 

[bitbydeath]

You need to layoff whatever it is that you are smoking, snorting or drinking. No way it will be $199.99. I am still in the belief that it will be $299.99. Even with the savings, that is still $50.00 cheaper than the current model and I would think Sony wants to maintain that profit margin which has been what has been helping Sony as a whole.

Hardware doesn't need to make money, profits come from software and the more hardware in peoples hands = more software sold.

I'm thinking they'll undercut Xbox and go $250 cause they're leaving out 4K/HDR.

 

[Nightengale]

Except Sony is prioritising both hardware and software profit. If we look at the financials, HW is not small amounts of profit to them.

 

[vin-buc]

Slim Available the 20th for $199. Neo Available October 18th for $399.

It'll never happen BUT if it did? Would I love to be looking in at Phils office/conference rooms after an announcement like that.

Good lord it would be glorious.

 

[DavidDesu]

Hardware doesn't need to make money, profits come from software and the more hardware in peoples hands = more software sold.

I'm thinking they'll undercut Xbox and go $250 cause they're leaving out 4K/HDR.

Yeah looking at the XB1S pricing I believe Sony absolutely will undercut them. $199 would be crazy low but ensure PS4 absolutely dominates this Xmas. Even $250 and it will still do that, to be honest. There's no justification for the PS4 to be the same price as the XB1S especially since that console now has 4K HDR built in, and the PS4 was always cheaper at launch AND more powerful than the XB1 originally was.

 

[Primethius]

Hardware doesn't need to make money, profits come from software and the more hardware in peoples hands = more software sold.

I'm thinking they'll undercut Xbox and go $250 cause they're leaving out 4K/HDR.

Sony hasn't undercut MS all gen, not sure why they would start now.

The XB1 has been cheaper then the PS4 by $50 for so long now.

 

[wapplew]

Sony hasn't undercut MS all gen, not sure why they would start now.

The XB1 has been cheaper then the PS4 by $50 for so long now.

Because without 4K support make PS4 look low value.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Because without 4K support make PS4 look low value.

For most of the world that Sony sells PS4 in, 4K content generally isn't going to sway people looking for a games console away from Sony and to MS, although i get your point for western territories

 

[Nightengale]

Yeah looking at the XB1S pricing I believe Sony absolutely will undercut them. $199 would be crazy low but ensure PS4 absolutely dominates this Xmas. Even $250 and it will still do that, to be honest. There's no justification for the PS4 to be the same price as the XB1S especially since that console now has 4K HDR built in, and the PS4 was always cheaper at launch AND more powerful than the XB1 originally was.

Business justification is that PS4 proves to remains highly competitive with XB1 even at $50 premium. So a more powerful console with less features (no 4K/HDR) at same price with XB1S is a logical proposition.

By going low aggressively, you lose the ability to be flexible about your pricing... flexibility. Even if Sony could go 249/199 right now, keeping that for BF or next year means they have more opportunities to utilise the price drop card if sales slow down again.

 

[Primethius]

Because without 4K support make PS4 look low value.

In the eyes of some sure (people interested in that feature set).

In the eyes of the mass market? An evenly priced PS4S is gonna wipe the floor with the XB1S.

So why would Sony undercut and give up profits?

 

[kyser73]

Sony have a 20mn unit target to reach for FY16/17, and to achieve that with the new body PS4 they'll need a significant price drop to drive sales.

IMO Neo is primarily aimed at those of us who are invested in the PS ecosystem, have disposable income and like new things - the same group who are also likely to be PSVR pre-orderers too.

I think the comments House made about retaining PC-owning users are secondary to single gaming platform owners.

Another audience they might pick up are late adopters who want more than the base console - say you've been waiting to jump in, have $399 ready to go this year, Yu can now choose a more powerful, UHDBD & gaming console for the price, or get a super deal on the base model with money to spend on games & services.

Sony are potentially in an enviable situation this holiday - value base model for new users, potentially selling at a true mass market price ($199-229 isn't outside the realm of possibility IMO), and existing users upgrading to the Neo.

 

[Liabe Brave]

Tallest console ever made? Lying flat that is.

No, not even close. Nothing will ever approach the behemoth that is the Atari 5200, long shall he reign. Here it is, making an original Xbox look positively dainty.

And it wasn't flying solo--its entire product line was an empire of gigantism. Here's the 2600 adapter you stuck in the top. Eat your heart out, 32X!

And the greatest console accessory ever made, the 5200 Trak-Ball:

Real men play games with a controller bigger than a console!


P.S. The actual answer for tallest console ever made is the Vectrex, but that kind of feels like cheating.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

For most of the world that Sony sells PS4 in, 4K content generally isn't going to sway people looking for a games console away from Sony and to MS, although i get your point for western territories

I don't even think it matter in western territories .
I don't think 4k disc are a big deal and this is coming from someone who likes them.
Streaming is the future and as more gamers move to DD only it hurts it even more.

 

[icespide]

I'm most worried about width in terms of fitting in my entertainment center. Hope it isn't too wide. it can have a fat ass though

 

[bitbydeath]

In the eyes of some sure (people interested in that feature set).

In the eyes of the mass market? An evenly priced PS4S is gonna wipe the floor with the XB1S.

So why would Sony undercut and give up profits?

Cause more hardware sales = greater profits through software.

 

[Primethius]

Sony have a 20mn unit target to reach for FY16/17, and to achieve that with the new body PS4 they'll need a significant price drop to drive sales.

IMO Neo is primarily aimed at those of us who are invested in the PS ecosystem, have disposable income and like new things - the same group who are also likely to be PSVR pre-orderers too.

I think the comments House made about retaining PC-owning users are secondary to single gaming platform owners.

Another audience they might pick up are late adopters who want more than the base console - say you've been waiting to jump in, have $399 ready to go this year, Yu can now choose a more powerful, UHDBD & gaming console for the price, or get a super deal on the base model with money to spend on games & services.

Sony are potentially in an enviable situation this holiday - value base model for new users, potentially selling at a true mass market price ($199-229 isn't outside the realm of possibility IMO), and existing users upgrading to the Neo.

Not really. They shipped 17.9 million last fiscal year. The first quarter of this year, they were up half a million shipments. If they continue to be up slightly every quarter, they'll land at 18.5-19 million just following last year's model.

Add in a Slim boost, Neo and PSVR, they can hit 20 mil with last year's pricing model.

 

[Nightengale]

Not really. They shipped 17.9 million last fiscal year. The first quarter of this year, they were up half a million shipments. If they continue to be up slightly every quarter, they'll land at 18.5-19 million just following last year's model.

Add in a Slim boost, Neo and PSVR, they can hit 20 mil with last year's pricing model.

This.

PS4 is doing remarkably well globally, even if NPD numbers are kind of meh.

Sure, they'll need a price drop come holidays to boost volume. But actually the existence of Neo negates the need to push a very high price drop, since additional SKUs will drive secondary demand.

 

[Primethius]

Cause more hardware sales = greater profits through software.

This ignores how much profits you give up versus how much you gain.

 

[wapplew]

For most of the world that Sony sells PS4 in, 4K content generally isn't going to sway people looking for a games console away from Sony and to MS, although i get your point for western territories

But sometimes additional feature add value even you don't use it.
Customers buy over price product for useless extra feature all the time. 4K, HDR, blah blah, they heard those marketing buzz word, this and that is the future. They might buy product with those feature, more future proof in their eyes.

 

[icespide]

my guess is still $299 PS4 and $399 Neo

 

[wapplew]

my guess is still $299 PS4 and $399 Neo

$299 PS4 to price parity, $449-$499 Neo because no competition.
I see we recycle the topic back to price. We need something new to talk about, it's getting stale.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

Because without 4K support make PS4 look low value.

Not when you consider XB1's underpowered GPU.

I think they'll want a bigger gap. I lean toward $299 and $449.

I agree.

 

[Liabe Brave]

my guess is still $299 PS4 and $399 Neo

I think they'll want a bigger gap. I lean toward $299 and $449.

 

[Nightengale]

But sometimes additional feature add value even you don't use it.
Customers buy over price product for useless extra feature all the time. 4K, HDR, blah blah, they heard those marketing buzz word, this and that is the future. They might buy product with those feature, more future proof in their eyes.

PS4 buzz word = more powerful than XB1 = worth paying $50 more than XB1.

XB1S buzz word = less powerful than PS4, but has 4K/HDR at $50 less. More worth than PS4 even with less power due it due to richer feature set at lower price.

PS4 Slim (presumed) buzz word = more powerful than XB1, no 4K/HDR, but same price. Better value even with less features due to more power per dollar.

 

[Elandyll]

You need to layoff whatever it is that you are smoking, snorting or drinking. No way it will be $199.99. I am still in the belief that it will be $299.99. Even with the savings, that is still $50.00 cheaper than the current model and I would think Sony wants to maintain that profit margin which has been what has been helping Sony as a whole.

Given tbat the current model is being bundled with a $60 third party game @ $349, a $299 Slim would in effect be $10 -more- expensive.
$249 for the console alone, or including a voucher for 1st party like Second Son, makes a lot more sense imo.

 

[icespide]

PS4 Slim $299 with Lego whatever the fuck bundled

 

[The God]

Pretty much every CE, mobile, computing device, TV, car, shoe, etc, has the concept of model tiers though. This shouldn't make people upset, they'll do what naturally comes to them and buy what they can afford. It's a new thing for consoles but I think we'll adapt quickly.

The PC thing is kind of a joke. When Neo was first rumored, there were a lot of people saying fuck this, I'm jumping to PC. Just more irrational thinking.

How is it irrational? It makes sense.

 

[GIANKRATOS]

These are great, keep them coming.

 

[bitbydeath]

This ignores how much profits you give up versus how much you gain.

Actually selling the hardware offers a continued income through future games and PS+, not to mention if priced right could then reach a larger audience.

 

[eternalcircle]

Has there been any rumors/speculation on the hard drive space size for neo? Like perhaps in the proposed/"leaked" specs. Would be nice to finally go beyond 2.5, but I feel like that's what they're stuck on... I wouldn't be so upset about lack of external hard drive support if they finally allowed 3.5 drives.

 

[Primethius]

Actually selling the hardware offers a continued income through future games and PS+, not to mention if priced right could then reach a larger audience.

Your simplifying it too much and ignoring the several factors involved. Otherwise, why not sell the console at $99 and just be done with it?

If profitability is the goal, you can't simply ignore HW profits for SW ones.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Not when you consider XB1's underpowered GPU.

Its weird, now i'm hearing from many outlets that based on the PS4 slim, apparently XB1S is more powerful than PS4. But do these people not really even know what they are saying? 4K output and Blu ray doesn't mean the hardware suddenly got significantly better for gaming

Has there been any rumors/speculation on the hard drive space size for neo? Like perhaps in the proposed/"leaked" specs. Would be nice to finally go beyond 2.5, but I feel like that's what they're stuck on... I wouldn't be so upset about lack of external hard drive support if they finally allowed 3.5 drives.

If i could stick a 4tb drive in there, i would not have to worry about space again

As it stands, i have to constantly delete and redownload stuff, dealing with the ridiculous limitations where your not even close to filling up the HDD yet you still can't install things.

 

[Nightengale]

Actually selling the hardware offers a continued income through future games and PS+, not to mention if priced right could then reach a larger audience.

And PS4 is facing no major trouble selling at its current premium.

What you say is logically sound, but the other approach of finding the balance between profitable hardware and continued income is also sound, especially if the company is in no hurry to chase excessive volume of an install base.

 

[vpance]

No, not even close. Nothing will ever approach the behemoth that is the Atari 5200, long shall he reign. Here it is, making an original Xbox look positively dainty.

And it wasn't flying solo--its entire product line was an empire of gigantism. Here's the 2600 adapter you stuck in the top. Eat your heart out, 32X!

And the greatest console accessory ever made, the 5200 Trak-Ball:

Real men play games with a controller bigger than a console!


P.S. The actual answer for tallest console ever made is the Vectrex, but that kind of feels like cheating.

Damn that Atari 5200 must've looked classy AF back then. Still kind of does.

 

[Metfanant]

Using the same for as me just a couple pages later?...

 

[wapplew]

Its weird, now i'm hearing from many outlets that based on the PS4 slim, apparently XB1S is more powerful than PS4. But do these people not really even know what they are saying? 4K output and Blu ray doesn't mean the hardware suddenly got significantly better for gaming

That's the clever part of one S, it changed the under power image of Xbox one.
GAF know whatsup, but average consumer think it's improve in every way. More power, more feature, future proof, same price. PS4 slim on the other hand, same power, less feature, same price.
Hell, some might think HDR will make all games look better than PS4.

 

[Hawk269]

PSVR is already sold out for the rest of the year stock wise, and PS4 Slim is just a replacement for OG PS4 which has probably already been fully discontinued in many territories, just clearing out stock



Just calm down. That is his prediction.

I was mostly kidding, hence the comment about laying off the drugs/drink.

 

[bitbydeath]

Your simplifying it too much and ignoring the several factors involved. Otherwise, why not sell the console at $99 and just be done with it?

If profitability is the goal, you can't simply ignore HW profits for SW ones.

I'm not saying remove profits and operate in loss, just minimise them to undercut the competition which should be possible given it won't have an expensive 4K player in it.

 

[funkystudent]

Any update on the theory that this show is replacing Sonys normal pre holiday EU press conference slot (Gamescom, Paris Games Week) this year?

Still dont think we have heard one way or another if they will be doing a stage thing in Paris again which makes me think they are not.


Maybe that means WILD will be here!

 

[Inuhanyou]

That's the clever part of one S, it changed the under power image of Xbox one.
GAF know whatsup, but average consumer think it's improve in every way. More power, more feature, future proof, same price. PS4 slim on the other hand, same power, less feature, same price.
Hell, some might think HDR will make all games look better than PS4.

that's really weird. I dont get it

 

[Hawk269]

Damn that Atari 5200 must've looked classy AF back then. Still kind of does.

The box the 5200 came in was bigger than almost 3 original Xbox boxes. It was MASSIVE when it came out. Later versions the packaging was reduced significantly. Funny thing is that the motherboard in the 5200 is actually not that big and the top part of the 5200 was just a holder for the controllers. I could never get use to the controllers on the 5200, yet the games were damn good looking for it's time. Pac-man actually looked like pac-man versus the trainwreck that was the 2600 version.

 

[Obliterator]

It is kinda odd how silent Sony is on this whole thing. I feel like they are either A) Trying to keep things low key so as to keep expectations in check or B) Drop the nukes

 

[Nightengale]

It is kinda odd how silent Sony is on this whole thing. I feel like they are either A) Trying to keep things low key so as to keep expectations in check or B) Drop the nukes

Spain is hyped though.

 

[Inuhanyou]

It is kinda odd how silent Sony is on this whole thing. I feel like they are either A) Trying to keep things low key so as to keep expectations in check or B) Drop the nukes

They are going to reveal the stuff at their own pace to control the flow of messaging.

So they are gonna reveal the system, price, launch date ect all at once for the wider market not exactly keyed in on the slim's existence.

 

[Creaking]

It is kinda odd how silent Sony is on this whole thing. I feel like they are either A) Trying to keep things low key so as to keep expectations in check or B) Drop the nukes

B

B please

Lets go B

B
B
B

 

[Obliterator]

They are going to reveal the stuff at their own pace to control the flow of messaging.

So they are gonna reveal the system, price, launch date ect all at once for the wider market not exactly keyed in on the slim's existence.

I was always in the camp this was launching in holiday 2016 up until this past week, and now I'm not 100% certain. I'm really interested to see what goes on that's for sure.