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[PdotMichael]

Yeah his "we can't know the future Xbox+ PS4-" is a bit tiresome in it constant application.

Is the PS4 due for a price drop in the West? Maybe not
Japanese price cut doesn't necessarily herald worldwide reduction.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/09/is-the-ps4-due-for-a-price-drop-in-the-west-maybe-not/

That Microsoft shilling. I hope for Microsoft that he does it for free.

 

[Sayad]

Wii was way cheaper

Was it?! Maybe with inflation, but I think they were both sold for $300 at launch. The PS2 might have dropped its price earlier than the Wii too.

Edit: unless you're comparing PS4/Wii.

 

[Beautiful Ninja]

Was it?! Maybe with inflation, but I think they were both sold for $300 at launch. The PS2 might have dropped its price earlier than the Wii too.

I think he means the Wii in comparison to the PS4, not the PS2.

 

[Pancakes R Us]

Wii was way cheaper

Wii was a phenomenon.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

Best thing about PS4's historical success is how the Japanese third parties have reacted to it.

 

[Bastables]

That Microsoft shilling. I hope for Microsoft that he does it for free.

You have to wonder right?

Compare M Walton's just the facts ma''am reporting on PS4 price drop
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/...o-350-in-the-us-429-in-canada-uk-likely-soon/

against Kyle Orland's little public service announcement: please consider buying a Xbox one.

In any case, if you've been eager to find out what it's like to yell at your TV to change the channel, now's a good chance to jump on board.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/10/psa-xbox-one-kinect-bundle-drops-to-400-w-three-games/

 

[Gurish]

Did...did he really link to an article about YouPorn statistics as evidence that the Xbox One was close to PS4 sales in NA?

NPD is pretty close, but come on, using YouPorn statistics as an indicator?

Wow that Youporn article is embarrassing
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/09/what-porn-site-statistics-can-tell-us-about-the-worldwide-console-wars/

Like, seriously?? it's like he is assuming everyone are using their console for this so the data is valid, not to mention there are other 100000 porn sites that people go to, and that most people are using their phones anyway so it's a really niche audience, like WTF basing a serious analysis on this, those statistics doesn't tell us shit about actual numbers.

 

[PdotMichael]

Even Richard Leadbetter in his wildest time when he believed the secret sauce stuff a little too much appears like a delicate flower to that.

 

[Ryng_tolu]

Humm, so, in this thread so many people doubt the XB1 has ship 15 million, but then they say the PS3 has outsold the 360...

There is some of wrong here.

 

[Man]

$399 PS4 is almost as successful as the $249 Nintendo Wii during the first two years. Craaazy.

 

[Dazza]

That Microsoft shilling. I hope for Microsoft that he does it for free.

I would be truly surprised if they were. Arstechnica have been in Microsoft pocket for a good while now. They have a pretty bad reputation for shilling, oh how the mighty have fallen

 

[AnthonypUK]

Humm, so, in this thread so many people doubt the XB1 has ship 15 million, but then they say the PS3 has outsold the 360...

There is some of wrong here.

Show us evidence otherwise

 

[Sez]

Humm, so, in this thread so many people doubt the XB1 has ship 15 million, but then they say the PS3 has outsold the 360...

There is some of wrong here.

It's ridiculous. We only know that both consoles are over 80m and under 90m and it will never reach 100m because sales plummeted worldwide after ps4 and x1.

Show us evidence otherwise

That is NOT how this works. The people who think ps3 has sold more are the ones who should bring evidence. All people who claim that are just speculating.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Nice numbers. I'm waiting for ps4 slim to jump in. Never waited this long to get a game console before, but might add will wait for the slim, now.

 

[Taurus]

$399 PS4 is almost as successful as the $249 Nintendo Wii during the first two years. Craaazy.

Wii was sold out what, 3-4 years. That might even out the numbers in favor of PS4.

 

[Purest 78]

Humm, so, in this thread so many people doubt the XB1 has ship 15 million, but then they say the PS3 has outsold the 360...

There is some of wrong here.

Well we know ps3 always sold pretty well worldwide people just use the US as a reference. We also know x1 is around 8 million sold in The US. So where exactly are the rest of X1 numbers coming from?

 

[IvorB]

This really highlights how howard stringer was a really shitty CEO.

He was really, really bad. They paid a heavy price for appointing him and I have no idea what they were thinking. Even gaming aside, I'm really glad they are doing well. As someone who grew up in the Eighties it was pretty dispiriting to see Sony Corp on the ropes.

 

[AnthonypUK]

It's ridiculous. We only know that both consoles are over 80m and under 90m and it will never reach 100m because sales plummeted worldwide after ps4 and x1.


That is NOT how this works. The people who think ps3 has sold more are the ones who should bring evidence. All people who claim that are just speculating.

No they aren't they are looking at the evidence, the PS3 has been outpacing the Xbox ever since it launched, its why it has caught up despite launching a year behind, please show the evidence that the PS3 has declined more then the 360, because you can't, so you have to go with the trend that was occuring before.

Launch aligned it sold more...fact, its been outpacing the 360 since launch..fact,

Microsofts only 2 real markets the UK and US have been quick on the uptake of new gen, where is the 360 going to sell outside of there?

 

[Arkham]

Sony must be hiding their unfavorable numbers!

I don't think you'd want to compare PS4 PS+ members to XBone Live Gold members.

 

[viHuGi]

PSN numbers must be insane, still alot of people one >87m Ps3s out there.

 

[crinale]

I don't think you'd want to compare PS4 PS+ members to XBone Live Gold members.

I thought live gold membership numbers were huge but that's from 360 era so I don't know.

 

[eerik9000]

I don't think you'd want to compare PS4 PS+ members to XBone Live Gold members.

Why not? The 39 million from Microsoft's latest financial report is not for Gold members.

 

[Amentallica]

If Xbox One is ~8 million in the U.S., and if U.S. accounts for ~70% of Xbox One's worldwide sales (from what I've read in this thread), then how can the Xbox One be >15 million worldwide?

 

[Loris146]

8 Ml is a sold through number from NPD. Hope we'll get some info about hw sales in UK from MS.

 

[jjonez18]

Show us evidence otherwise

Unless I'm reading this wrong, I think the point is either you guys are underselling XB1 and overselling 360 or vise versa. MS has only given combined shipment numbers. So depending on the splits 360 could be high/low.

If XB1>PS3 launch aligned then definitely 360<PS3 LTD

If XB1<PS3 launch aligned then there is a case for 360>PS3 LTD

I'm not saying one way or the other, because personally, I don't care.

 

[ApharmdX]

That Microsoft shilling. I hope for Microsoft that he does it for free.

I doubt that he does. Arstechnica in general shills for Microsoft across MS's whole product line. Have you read their reviews of other MS products? I work in IT with some of this stuff every day and it's unthinkable how positive they are about some of the broken, bad Microsoft stuff, or how they have glossed over the worst aspects of it.

Reviews for pay, is what this is, by all appearances. And Ars used to be an amazing tech site. I started visiting the site 15 years ago but over the last few years I've stopped. It's become a joke.

 

[StevieP]

Wii sales dropped off for a few reasons that I don't think the ps4 shares. Third party support for the wii was drying up and Nintendo didn't appear to have a long term strategy to fix that or keep core gamers. Sony seems to have found a balance of core and casual, not to mention that this party support isn't going anywhere.

I don't see how there is balance with the ps4. It is targeted solely at gamers, and mostly young male gamers at that. Unlike the other successful consoles from the past. Which is exactly why people shouldn't make predictions about reaching the sales heights of previous generations winners. Those had the support of "casuals" because the software was there for them (and yes what we call shovel ware is a part of that). They're on mobile now (and to some extent PC), and happy there, and I don't see how they come back to make these boxes reach those sales heights.

 

[TBiddy]

Yeah I know right one should never never call people out for being wrong and using tortured logic consistently, it's the internet after all...

plus dodgy graphs.

Good show in not complaining about Amirox's "Sony is dead" and "1% china =victory". Even though they're also in this very topic and the antithesis of your dislike of calling out people who were wrong.
Because gaf is all about realizing history started yesterday

I've never seen that Amir0x post before. I'm still new here, so I don't know how often it goes around.

That which you posted, I have seen though. Why not just ignore him and be happy that the consoles are selling like hot cakes?

 

[Ryng_tolu]

and if U.S. accounts for ~70% of Xbox One's worldwide sales

LMFAO. Not even close. Seriusly, XB1 is selling bad outside US, but not THAT bad.

XB1 marketshare in US is most likely < 60%, and we talk about shipments, not sales.

 

[SMOK3Y]

LMFAO. Not even close. Seriusly, XB1 is selling bad outside US, but not THAT bad.

XB1 marketshare in US is most likely < 60%, and we talk about shipments, not sales.

Id say US/UK account for about 70% of xboxs sales

 

[Boombloxer]

LMFAO. Not even close. Seriusly, XB1 is selling bad outside US, but not THAT bad.

XB1 marketshare in US is most likely < 60%, and we talk about shipments, not sales.

I suggest you look at some of the past EU/MC threads.
It is quite close to that.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

If Xbox One is ~8 million in the U.S., and if U.S. accounts for ~70% of Xbox One's worldwide sales (from what I've read in this thread), then how can the Xbox One be >15 million worldwide?

LTD, definitely not.

If you're talking in terms of how it's selling right now, then I would agree.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

LMFAO. Not even close. Seriusly, XB1 is selling bad outside US, but not THAT bad.

XB1 marketshare in US is most likely < 60%, and we talk about shipments, not sales.

Actually, that estimate is probably correct. Zhuge came to that figure too.

Id say US/UK account for about 70% of xboxs sales

Looking at MS's change in strategy, new boss in charge, and low or even negative revenue generated from Xbox division historically, I setiously doubt there will be another Xbox console. Perhaps XB Live, in some form, will continue as an online service only.

 

[rambis]

Funny how the PS4 is lagging behind the Wii but still ahead of the PS2. At some point in the future, the reverse will be true.

Yeah I can see this. I don't think PS4 will do 150m but 100m certainly looks within grab. Especially if Nintendo flops again with NX.

 

[Ryng_tolu]

Id say US/UK account for about 70% of xboxs sales

US+UK seem likely, maybe even more since XB1 is close to 2 million and most likely we have near / over 10 million XB1 in US+UK.

But he was talking about US only, not UK.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

US+UK seem likely, maybe even more since XB1 is close to 2 million and most likely we have near / over 10 million XB1 in US+UK.

But he was talking about US only, not UK.

At this point in time maybe .
Truth is as time goes on i see the US being worth more that it was in the beginning .

 

[IAmRandom31]

Best thing about all this is the operating profits from the gaming division. Even with the bajillion marketing deals and first party projects and helping out on other projects the division is still in the black.

VERY good news in that department.

 

[FATALITY]

Wii was sold out what, 3-4 years. That might even out the numbers in favor of PS4.

lol

 

[privitsan02]

Wii was sold out what, 3-4 years. That might even out the numbers in favor of PS4.

Err, that false... Three to four years later was the peak of Wii sales. You could find Wiis pretty commonly a year after launch. Year and a half if I'm generous.

Best wishes.

 

[Verendus]

I don't see how there is balance with the ps4. It is targeted solely at gamers, and mostly young male gamers at that. Unlike the other successful consoles from the past. Which is exactly why people shouldn't make predictions about reaching the sales heights of previous generations winners. Those had the support of "casuals" because the software was there for them (and yes what we call shovel ware is a part of that). They're on mobile now (and to some extent PC), and happy there, and I don't see how they come back to make these boxes reach those sales heights.

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

 

[panda-zebra]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

Informative post, killer punchline. 29.3/10

 

[Omnistalgic]

I think PS4 will boost PS4 sales tbh...nothing like Wii craze, but I think a lot of gamers would generally want to at least experience racing games, movies/shows, and original VR experiences on top of porn in a headset. Why not get a plug n play headset to do all those things? Sony would be in even better shape if they had a few genuine must play experiences on VR as well. I dunno, I see It being a second life for PS4, and something that will target that more casual gamer. SFV, Uncharted, GT, those will be big days for PS but I think what could potentially put it in the 100 million mark is VR, emerging markets, and timely price cuts. Sony should also be thinking about what to do as far as ecosystem. I think its too easy to pick up and leave from PS+, needs to be more reasons for consumers to stay committed.

 

[FranXico]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

Damn Verendus, you should write serious posts more often.

 

[KurtSloane]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

Quality post good sir, thank you for the info.

 

[Elandyll]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

 

[kswiston]

Err, that false... Three to four years later was the peak of Wii sales. You could find Wiis pretty commonly a year after launch. Year and a half if I'm generous.

Best wishes.

Wiis were still hard to come by through the end of 2007 in Canada. I assume it wasn't that much different in the US. No clue about EU or Japan. After holiday 2007 though, it was pretty easy to find a console if you wanted one.

 

[Sidewinder]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

I know what would boost PS4 sales into overdrive and take care of the "haz no gamz" situation: COLONY WARS!

You're welcome

I'm sure PSVR will get both casuals and core gamers to buy tons of PS4s, just don't sell it for more than 300$.

 

[kswiston]

The "has no games" argument only holds the the multiplatform people who are mainly interested in exclusives. If you already have a beefy gaming PC or an XB1, then sure, there aren't a ton of reasons to own a PS4 already. However, I don't think average (ie. not on GAF) gamers are all that likely to have more than one gaming platform this early in the generation. If you are moving on from 360 or PS3, the PS4 has a ton of games that you couldn't play previously.

Third party games are what drive most hardware sales these days.

 

[Alo0oy]

PS4 does have the support of casuals, and we have data points showing owners who didn't previously own a PS3 or 360, and instead owned a Wii. Then we have a segment that didn't own any console in the previous generation. The distinction between casual and core gamers is based solely on their engagement level. Franchises like Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Fifa, tend to appeal to casuals too, which is part of why they're so successful. Casuals isn't used as a blanket term to group in different demographics and audiences in reality like it is on GAF. You have different segments that you have to appeal to in different ways.

SCE's modus operandi is to pitch the PS4 as a mass entertainment device. That isn't any different than it has been since the PS2 era. The current demographic split on the PS4 is better balanced than it was on the PS1 or the PS3 from consumer data, so we're already aware that it's positioned quite well in respect to what's been accomplished in the past. The plan isn't to focus on just core gamers or casuals at different points in the life cycle, but instead to increase engagement levels of core gamers, while continuing to court casual gamers, and convincing them to buy in to the platform. There's evidence of that already slowly happening, which is why PS4 is so successful, but the larger problem is there are many price conscious consumers who you can't really target until the price becomes further reduced. That's more of a long-term strategy however, and will take effect from 2017 onwards. Beyond that, the future of PS4 is much more secure than the PS3 simply because of inroads being made in other markets, and the more flexibility PS4 will afford at the end of the generation due to various factors.

Of course, none of this really helps with the real issue of it having no games, but what can you do? You win some, you lose some. That's life.

Thanks for the info, it was pretty clear from the outset actually, there are no 30 million "core gamers" out there, if there were, more games would sell like GTA or CoD, but thanks for the confirmation.

 

[Silvard]

The "has no games" argument only holds the the multiplatform people who are mainly interested in exclusives. If you already have a beefy gaming PC or an XB1, then sure, there aren't a ton of reasons to own a PS4 already. However, I don't think average (ie. not on GAF) gamers are all that likely to have more than one gaming platform this early in the generation. If you are moving on from 360 or PS3, the PS4 has a ton of games that you couldn't play previously.

Third party games are what drive most hardware sales these days.

It doesn't really hold for anyone since the PS4 has more exclusives than any of its direct competitors in the console space. People just find ways to disqualify them.