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[Hoje0308]

I have no doubt that the PS4 probably is faster but I've yet to see a game on PS4 that has impressed me graphically like some of the Xbox launch games do. Infamous looks amazing...but it's not up there with Forza.

Funniest thing I've heard all day.

Wait, you're serious? Oh dear, someone needs to buy you glasses before teaching you a lesson in technology. (hint: Shadow Fall and Second Son both destroy Forza, with its baked lighting, static backgrounds and faked reflections.)

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Infamous: Second Son looks to be a system seller for the PS4. In fact, there are many people who're specifically waiting for that game to purchase a PS4.

Yup, it getting delayed into next year is what caused me to hold off on getting a PS4 at launch.

Not exactly sure it's that big of a franchise in-itself though.

 

[Massa]

Random idea: Couldn't Sony simply enforce a 1080p native resolution requirement through TRC? This could give them an automatic edge over the Xbone and reduce the risk of gimped versions a bit.

They don't have to. Just heavily promote games that look great on PS4 and the market will take care of the rest.

 

[dragonelite]

Random idea: Couldn't Sony simply enforce a 1080p native resolution requirement through TRC? This could give them an automatic edge over the Xbone and reduce the risk of gimped versions a bit.

The order 1886 devs would like that i guess.

 

[Claude Kenni]

I predict a situation where MS panics and reduces the price below that of the PS4.

Sony may stick to their guns and make them look silly depending on their momentum.

Much like XBOX ended up cheaper than PS2 but everyone still went for PS2.

Are you speaking about the UK? I assume MS having FIFA packed in will be about all they can do for a while.

I just don't see how a price drop could happen anytime soon after release unless they bite the bullet and put out a Kinect-less SKU. I'm very curious about how adoption of the new MS and Sony consoles will go though in the UK. Very value-minded consumers and the 360 and PS3 provide tremendous value.

 

[chadskin]

Are you speaking about the UK? I assume MS having FIFA packed in will be about all they can do for a while.

What I don't get about it: FIFA comes free only with the Day One Edition which was mostly sold out across Europe before that announcement anyway.

 

[dragonelite]

What I don't get about it: FIFA comes free only with the Day One Edition which was mostly sold out across Europe before that announcement anyway.

Allocated extra skus from what i heard on twitter. So they are selling if they aren't lying about it.

 

[eddfromtheriver]

I predict a situation where MS panics and reduces the price below that of the PS4.

Sony may stick to their guns and make them look silly depending on their momentum.

Much like XBOX ended up cheaper than PS2 but everyone still went for PS2.

I'm sure they will, the question is how soon?... TGS maybe?

 

[StuBurns]

Unless MS ditch the Kinect requirement, there is no possible way they drop the price to even match Sony, let alone under cut them.

 

[Caronte]

Infamous: Second Son looks to be a system seller for the PS4. In fact, there are many people who're specifically waiting for that game to purchase a PS4.

I am one of them

 

[eddfromtheriver]

Unless MS ditch the Kinect requirement, there is no possible way they drop the price to even match Sony, let alone under cut them.

They claim that they won't drop it, but if history is a good indicator... they're not good at sticking to their guns at all... i wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if they announce a kinectless sku @ TGS.

 

[Brera]

Oh, of course, dropping the Kinect etc to get the price down.

Let's face it...no one wants that shit any more. Motion controls are thankfully dead.

 

[Betta Lines]

Let's face it...no one wants that shit any more. Motion controls are thankfully dead.

I disagree with both statements.

 

[Racer1977]

When a next-gen launches, all bets are off regarding what the system sellers are going to be.

Take Infamous SS, I didn't buy the previous two games, didn't have much interest in them, but the PS4 is bringing that franchise to life, I could well see it becoming a top tier franchise like Uncharted. Same could be said for Killzone SF, so much is down to releasing at the opportune time, and KZ certainly looks to be a graphical powerhouse, with good gameplay to boot.

 

[N.Domixis]

Does infamous have a history of moving systems? I thought it was petty niche. It's the game I'm most looking forward too except for Titanfall but I don't imagine it will sell much extra consoles.

I think both consoles will struggle for a while, I only think TF gives the XB1 a slight edge in US/UK, nothing more than that.

Why buy an xbone for titanfall, when casuals can buy it for their 360? I keep hearing how ps4 being more powerful doesnt matter, well a slight bump in graphics between the 360 and bone version should not matter to casuals either.

 

[TGO]

IMHO if you are buying a console solely based on power your reasoning is very flawed.

Exactly and I think I said this to someone else, if the games you interested in aren't on the more powerful console then it don't matter if its more powerful.

 

[Metfanant]

Take Infamous SS, I didn't buy the previous two games, didn't have much interest in them, but the PS4 is bringing that franchise to life,

thats a mistake! you should get the first two...great games!

 

[Manmademan]

Exactly and I think I said this to someone else, if the games you interested in aren't on the more powerful console then it don't matter if its more powerful.

This is a good point, but it's worth pointing out that MS didn't really bother expanding their first party portfolio last round, while sony did.

Third party games will likely end up on both platforms (a few games here and there aside)
so if it comes down to "who has the strongest first party lineup" MS is going to have a really bad time this round. Halo and Gears alone aren't going to get it done.

 

[Metfanant]

IMHO if you are buying a console solely based on power your reasoning is very flawed.

Exactly and I think I said this to someone else, if the games you interested in aren't on the more powerful console then it don't matter if its more powerful.

the flip side to that argument is this...

-most will be one console gamers
-the majority of AAA titles are multiplatform
-so because of that i would imagine most gamers spend most of their time playing multiplat titles
-the more powerful console will give you the better of the experiences for multiplat games...

 

[Beerman462]

Why buy an xbone for titanfall, when casuals can buy it for their 360? I keep hearing how ps4 being more powerful doesnt matter, well a slight bump in graphics between the 360 and bone version should not matter to casuals either.

Yup

 

[StevieP]

They could still drop the requirement later in the life cycle if they have to. But in theory they could mandate it. The 7850 is definitely capable of handling 1080p. Xbone gpu is probably not.

Anything is capable of 1080 depending on load. You're talking about a comparison between (approximately, in part comparisons on PC) a Cape Verde and a Pitcairn. It's not the difference between a Cape Verde and a Tahiti.

Nobody's mandating anything and there are going to be lots of sub 1080 games on both platforms throughout the generation, even at launch.

Microsoft "mandated" 720 in their TRC for the 360 and launched it with sub HD.

The developers will make the choice what they do with their available hardware.

By the consoles for whichever games you're interested in. Not based on power.

 

[Brera]

You can either play Titanfall with awesome graphics on your own.

Or Titanfall with decent graphics with all your friends on Live inbetween Halo 4 and COD....Massive mistake on MS part to not go all out Xbone exclusive but I can see why EA wouldn't go all in.

 

[gioGAF]

I don't get all this Infamous SS being a system-seller talk. The first 2 games achieved respectable sales, but they are nowhere near a "system-seller". Infamous SS will hopefully be a good game. Hopefully I will enjoy it more than I did Infamous 2 (which has nothing on Infamous 1 other than better graphics/performance).

I'm going to get a PS4 when a game I want is released (Demon's Souls 2?) or when they release enough of the games I don't plan on buying now (Diablo 3, Bioshock Infinite, GTA5, etc.). That being said, I believe something like Titanfall or Destiny has a better chance of moving systems than things like Infamous or Killzone.

 

[nib95]

Why buy an xbone for titanfall, when casuals can buy it for their 360? I keep hearing how ps4 being more powerful doesnt matter, well a slight bump in graphics between the 360 and bone version should not matter to casuals either.

Lol. Pretty good point.

 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

ps4 games will have better systems, not just prettier graphics and faster performance.

the 8 aces will definitely work their magic. ps4 titles might not *look* like they are 50% better, but the execution of better ai, or more complex collision detection or other physics sim, etc. i.e. better looking liquid or fire effects, will be possible on ps4. the sum of those parts will enable gamers to have a better, more immersive experience.

Thanks!! This is exactly what I was thinking also.

 

[Manmademan]

I don't get all this Infamous SS being a system-seller talk. The first 2 games achieved respectable sales, but they are nowhere near a "system-seller". Infamous SS will hopefully be a good game. Hopefully I will enjoy it more than I did Infamous 2 (which has nothing on Infamous 1 other than better graphics/performance).

launch games tend to move a lot more software just by the virtue of having the playing field to themselves. The PS3 launched in 2006. Infamous didn't show up until 2009. By then the Generation had pretty much been decided. (at least in the US and UK).

Infamous SS is going to generate a LOT more publicity than either of it's predecessors, as well as higher sales. New console owners are going to be chomping at the bit for a game that shows off the hardware, and Infamous SS is a great example of that.

edit: it's probably worth mentioning also that infamous launched at almost the exact same time as "prototype" a game that was EXTREMELY similar in mechanics and concept.

 

[Brad Grenz]

the 30GBs on the Xbox is coherent link, that's only 10 on the PS4 so there is a big difference but the Xbox has all the custom processors that will benefit and be using this.

the PS4 can also skip that and get 20GBs, I assume the Xbox can also skip this and get faster access,

pretty sure the Xbox has much more potential access via the CPU due to it being a more CPU heavy design.

This however is will potentially using bandwidth the gpu needs and the ram only has 68GBs in total so its going to be a delicate balancing act and I can't think CPU memory bandwidth will be a big multi platform divider.

These figures are all wrong. The PS4's coherent link is 20GBps. The cache bypass link is 10GBps. Total CPU memory bandwidth is 30GBps for both. They can't access memory any other way. Having a cache bypass option is a performance enhancement because flushing/invalidating cache can be time consuming and wasteful if you don't need it.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Why are people still debating the power difference? It's done, let it go. The PS4 is more powerful, end of story.

Because being a console warrior isn't just about strutting around during the good times, laughing at PS3 multi platform releases.
Sometimes, like now. You've got to dig in. And dig in hard...

Revenge is a dish best served cold. Next up - NPD threads as xbox ecosystem loses against Sony family.

 

[CorrisD]

launch games tend to move a lot more software just by the virtue of having the playing field to themselves. The PS3 launched in 2006. Infamous didn't show up until 2009. By then the Generation had pretty much been decided. (at least in the US and UK).

Infamous SS is going to generate a LOT more publicity than either of it's predecessors, as well as higher sales. New console owners are going to be chomping at the bit for a game that shows off the hardware, and Infamous SS is a great example of that.

edit: it's probably worth mentioning also that infamous launched at almost the exact same time as "prototype" a game that was EXTREMELY similar in mechanics and concept.

I would also say a lot more know of the series thanks to the welcome back program after the whole hack fiasco which allowed pretty anyone with a PSN account to get the first game, and PS+ which has had inFamous 2 has one of the games for a year.

I don't doubt more people know the series, and hopefully for Second Son that will convert into future sales.

 

[seventynine]

launch games tend to move a lot more software just by the virtue of having the playing field to themselves. The PS3 launched in 2006. Infamous didn't show up until 2009. By then the Generation had pretty much been decided. (at least in the US and UK).

Infamous SS is going to generate a LOT more publicity than either of it's predecessors, as well as higher sales. New console owners are going to be chomping at the bit for a game that shows off the hardware, and Infamous SS is a great example of that.

edit: it's probably worth mentioning also that infamous launched at almost the exact same time as "prototype" a game that was EXTREMELY similar in mechanics and concept.

It's a fresh start, and same goes for Killzone too since neither game has a number in the title.

 

[ricardo_sousa11]

I think thats a pretty realistic comparison.

 

[bonus_sco]

Hold on, hold on, hold on...

The figures in the article suggest the GPU advantage and memory advantage are cumulative so in real world terms PS4 could have 80-100% advantage.

Here's the math:

1920 × 1080 = 2,073,600
1600 × 900 = 1,440,000
line1/line2 = 1.44
30/24 × line3 = 1.8

If we assume the twenty-something is around 24 then PS4 has an 80% advantage. If its actually 21-22 then the PS4 advantage is DOUBLE.

Am I totally off-base here? Can someone please check the maths.

Could PS4 really be double the graphical power of XBone in real-world scenarios?

That's the problem I have with the article, it completely overstates the difference.

Platform agnostic code means they haven't used the ESRAM even for their render buffers. So yes, you'd need a resolution drop and a frame rate drop on Xbox One if only using the 68 GBps of DRAM and completely ignore the ESRAM.

I can't imagine anyone doing that.

 

[bonus_sco]

Anything is capable of 1080 depending on load. You're talking about a comparison between (approximately, in part comparisons on PC) a Cape Verde and a Pitcairn. It's not the difference between a Cape Verde and a Tahiti.

Nobody's mandating anything and there are going to be lots of sub 1080 games on both platforms throughout the generation, even at launch.

Microsoft "mandated" 720 in their TRC for the 360 and launched it with sub HD.

The developers will make the choice what they do with their available hardware.

By the consoles for whichever games you're interested in. Not based on power.

You're talking about a Bonaire with less CUs and lower clock. Not quite the same.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Judging by the Wii, maybe a metric ton of them. If it's used correctly. I firmly believe that bundling the Kinect was the right decision. A console can't survive on specs alone and the PS4 has nothing to attract the casual crowd with.

The PS3 is the home of netflix through consoles, and with MS unwilling to remove the apps from the paywall, it's going to stay that way. The hyperbole on both sides of this argument is getting out of hand. Come on people, use some discretion when you comment.

 

[jhendrix]

To me it is worth the price to have both consoles so spec wars are just a fleeting glimpse to determine which consoles run which multi plats better. It's going to be a such a stress reliever to not be so invested in the hair splitting that goes on at times.

 

[Manmademan]

The PS3 is the home of netflix through consoles, and with MS unwilling to remove the apps from the paywall, it's going to stay that way. The hyperbole on both sides of this argument is getting out of hand. Come on people, use some discretion when you comment.

Exactly. as far as casual interest goes, Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon instant streaming are sufficient. Even the PS3 as a box kicks the living crap out of a roku or appletv.

chasing after casuals with motion cameras or tablet controls (*cough*nintendo*cough*) is a quick path to some pain, IMHO.

 

[DieH@rd]

Magnificent.

 

[jhendrix]

Exactly. as far as casual interest goes, Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon instant streaming are sufficient. Even the PS3 as a box kicks the living crap out of a roku or appletv.

chasing after casuals with motion cameras or tablet controls (*cough*nintendo*cough*) is a quick path to some pain, IMHO.

Honestly it just depends on the demographic and what your intentions are with the console. I can tell you this if the Xbox one was simply a weaker PS4 without kinect I most likely would not be getting one. I'm older with a family and a 3 year old so kinect does bring value and does differentiate itself. I'm also interested in the idea of it being a universal remote with voice commands.

My logitech remote cost over 100$ by itself and does not work with voice commands, I don't actually know if you can even buy a stand alone universal remote product that supports voice commands. People like me may not buy it in droves because of it but I'm pretty sure it will be a sustainable console during it's life and still get enough AAA games to justify it's existence. At least it does have something to set it apart.

The idea that my 3 year old can just in theory say "Xbox netflix sponge bob" and start watching is a pretty big selling point at least for me.

I just don't think it has to survive in absolutes, not being the number one selling console will not kill it as long as it is profitable and it seems to be setup to do that day one.

 

[Loakum]

*mind blown at the sheer epic awesomeness of this gif*

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

No. In time, the native resolution for even sony's first party games will drop and will be upscaled. The only difference is that, hopefully, unlike last time, no game will ever drop below the 720p mark.

The reason is that resolution happens to be one of the most resource intensive aspects of visual processing and lower resolution in pursuit of better visuals (more realistic, better filters, framerate etc) will be more noticeable and preferred by majority.

It will be mandated that all 1st party titles be 1080p. I guarantee it

 

[GribbleGrunger]

Has this been posted anywhere? It all means nothing to me:

http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1019252/PlayStation-Shading-Language-for

 

[nib95]

How the hell do you keep coming out with these? GAF GIF'ers really are some of the best on the interwebs.

 

[RoboPlato]

It will be mandated that all 1st party titles be 1080p. I guarantee it

Probably, unless they do the letterboxing approach like The Order and Beyond since the IQ is the same as 1080p. Very few PS3 exclusives are sub-720p, even fewer from Sony first party.

 

[SwiftDeath]

You know what?

I think all that will remain of gaf decades from now will be random eltorro gifs floating in the ether

And I'm ok with that

 

[sestrugen]

keanuwoah.gif

 

[Manmademan]

Honestly it just depends on the demographic and what your intentions are with the console. I can tell you this if the Xbox one was simply a weaker PS4 without kinect I most likely would not be getting one. I'm older with a family and a 3 year old so kinect does bring value and does differentiate itself. I'm also interested in the idea of it being a universal remote with voice commands.

thanks for the response. always interested in seeing a perspective of someone a little older like myself. I've got a 17 (soon to be 18) month old myself, always getting into my remotes.

My logitech remote cost over 100$ by itself and does not work with voice commands, I don't actually know if you can even buy a stand alone universal remote product that supports voice commands.

well..yes and no. Standalone remote? not that i'm aware of. built into tv as part of it's functionality? absolutely. as part of your cable box? That's a bingo!

and the Xbox One hasn't actually launched yet. Give it a year or two and this functionality will be all over the place. I've said before in this thread that the launch of this product was VERY ill timed by microsoft.

People like me may not buy it in droves because of it but I'm pretty sure it will be a sustainable console during it's life and still get enough AAA games to justify it's existence. At least it does have something to set it apart.

The idea that my 3 year old can just in theory say "Xbox netflix sponge bob" and start watching is a pretty big selling point at least for me.

see the above. This is being integrated into TVs and Cable boxes without the need for microsoft's xbox one.

I just don't think it has to survive in absolutes, not being the number one selling console will not kill it as long as it is profitable and it seems to be setup to do that day one.

The Xbox as a project is an interesting one for microsoft. it's valuable as a brand, but does not really drive revenue- definitely not to the extent that the rest of their portfolio does. The living room is also clearly no longer the successor to PC, that's smartphones and tablets, and MS is getting beaten fairly badly there. The console segment as a whole is very risky and a bad decision can leave your business model in shambles, as nintendo is finding out.

MS was pretty quick to drop the Xbox when it failed against the PS2. The 360 is probably their best case scenario in the home console space, and managed to only tie sony worldwide. With a more expensive console, with weaker specifications, that's giving up nearly half the WW market to Sony from day 1 (no japan or half of the EU) things do not look great here for the Xbox one as a long term investment.

 

[Fresh Face]

O_O

niiice.

 

[Biker19]

ROFL! I just love GIF's like this.

 

[jhendrix]

thanks for the response. always interested in seeing a perspective of someone a little older like myself. I've got a 17 (soon to be 18) month old myself, always getting into my remotes.



well..yes and no. Standalone remote? not that i'm aware of. built into tv as part of it's functionality? absolutely. as part of your cable box? That's a bingo!

and the Xbox One hasn't actually launched yet. Give it a year or two and this functionality will be all over the place. I've said before in this thread that the launch of this product was VERY ill timed by microsoft.



see the above. This is being integrated into TVs and Cable boxes without the need for microsoft's xbox one.



The Xbox as a project is an interesting one for microsoft. it's valuable as a brand, but does not really drive revenue- definitely not to the extent that the rest of their portfolio does. The living room is also clearly no longer the successor to PC, that's smartphones and tablets, and MS is getting beaten fairly badly there. The console segment as a whole is very risky and a bad decision can leave your business model in shambles, as nintendo is finding out.

MS was pretty quick to drop the Xbox when it failed against the PS2. The 360 is probably their best case scenario in the home console space, and managed to only tie sony worldwide. With a more expensive console, with weaker specifications, that's giving up nearly half the WW market to Sony from day 1 (no japan or half of the EU) things do not look great here for the Xbox one as a long term investment.

Interesting about the X2 cable box we JUST got X1 in our area a few weeks ago and I was quick to jump on that. Right now X1 is simply a better more modern menu with a few apps but not much else. I agree the voice functions will probably be everywhere at some time but it is also worthwhile in my specific scenario because it is only a few months away and my son is a year or two away from being able to competently use a remote control by himself so the timing is pretty perfect for me but this situation is probably going to be niche at best. Also besides the remote he will enjoy kinect games until he is able to properly use a controller. My HDTV situation is pretty set until 4k or 8K res HDTV's hits a mainstream point as I don't see any reason to upgrade. I have an LG 3D smart TV that has waggle but no voice commands which should be good enough for a few more years.

It's temporary situation that benefits him but it was still something to consider and helped make my launch day decision on which console to get. Right now a PS4 would only be useful to me while the Xbox one will provide extra value for my whole family because of the additional features which would cost more than 100$ if I tried to duplicate them outside of the Xbox One. Just for fun I'm going to see how it works to control the PS4 through the kinect IR blaster when I get a PS4 several months after launch.

I realize my case for the kinect related features are going to be niche and even time dependent on the growth of my son but it was still a real deciding factor and the timing of the added features were perfect for where my son's competence level is with the living room electronics. He can wiz around a touch screen and even type in simple words in you tube for himself to watch but navigating the remote to watch TV or netflix on the big tv is out of his range right now. He still tries to touch the big tv to navigate cause he thinks everything is a touch screen.

 

[SuperEpicGuy]

Beautiful. One of the highest polished gifs I've ever seen.