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[Afro Republican]

Sony and Microsoft are going to cause confusion by launching two power different consoles SKU's at launch taking up space on shelves and causing customer service nightmares at retailers while releasing an mid-gen refresh 3-4 years down the road after the original launch

So it's clear that home consoles well sell less than this gen (Wiiu/XBO/PS4) next gen.

 

[darkinstinct]

Sony and Microsoft are going to cause confusion by launching two power different consoles SKU's at launch taking up space on shelves and causing customer service nightmares at retailers while releasing an mid-gen refresh 3-4 years down the road after the original launch

So it's clear that home consoles well sell less than this gen (Wiiu/XBO/PS4) next gen.

I think being a digital only SKU Lockhart might only be available as part of Xbox All Access (currently Amazon, to be expanded to others this year) and other direct to customer shops.

 

[gaming_noob]

Xbox to be the unquestionable winner of North America if they have a $299 model.

 

[Esppiral]

Lokhart is a mistake

 

[Panaphonics]

Sony and Microsoft are going to cause confusion by launching two power different consoles SKU's at launch taking up space on shelves and causing customer service nightmares at retailers while releasing an mid-gen refresh 3-4 years down the road after the original launch

So it's clear that home consoles well sell less than this gen (Wiiu/XBO/PS4) next gen.

how fucking stupid do you think people are?
They just look at the price:

If one console is $499 and the other is $299 EVERYONE know what more powerful is. Seriously.

 

[jackets with pockets]

Microsoft will poison the well if they also release a weaker next-generation console alongside Xbox Series X.

 

[Afro Republican]

how fucking stupid do you think people are?
They just look at the price:

If one console is $499 and the other is $299 EVERYONE know what more powerful is. Seriously.

That isn't the problem but thanks for your useless rant I guess?

The problem is that there are two SKU's at launch and one will be a few years later. The average consumer has no idea what they are buying to what ability regardless of the price they see and they'll have a ton of questions for the retailers. This will also impact stock and will take up additional space.

I'm just scratching the surface of the problems that will surface using this strategy, it has nothing to do about whether casuals can count numbers on a price label.

 

[darkinstinct]

Lokhart is a mistake

There are people who don't have a 4KTV (50 % of the US for example, even more in Europe) or that don't want to spend $500 on a console but still want a next gen console.

 

[Jigsaah]

This seems so close to an Xbox One X I can't see any real reason for it to exist outside of marketing.

No CPU Bottleneck.

 

[Panaphonics]

No CPU Bottleneck.

+ SSD + RT

 

[Jigsaah]

That isn't the problem but thanks for your useless rant I guess?

The problem is that there are two SKU's at launch and one will be a few years later. The average consumer has no idea what they are buying to what ability regardless of the price they see and they'll have a ton of questions for the retailers. This will also impact stock and will take up additional space.

I'm just scratching the surface of the problems that will surface using this strategy, it has nothing to do about whether casuals can count numbers on a price label.

The responsibility then falls on Microsoft/apparently Sony and the retailers to properly explain. If nothing else, that's what return policies are for. I don't understand why this is such a huge deal.

 

[Clear]

MS said they will continue to support the systems, they didnt day they will continue to sell the systems.

Why would they not want to though, at least for the duration of the transition period (2 years)? As I pointed out already the older models are still entirely viable at supporting their software and services, so it makes little sense to release it at the same time as the SX.

This is my point about thinking about it in a business-orientated fashion, not like a fan. While it is entirely possible for them to opt for this approach, it seems to me that it'd counterproductive to obsolete the current SKU's for no immediate benefit. Why take the spotlight away from SX, and most of all why not set up potentially troublesome value/performance comparisons between the new cheaper box and the former high end (One X)?

 

[Panaphonics]

The responsibility then falls on Microsoft/apparently Sony and the retailers to properly explain. If nothing else, that's what return policies are for. I don't understand why this is such a huge deal.

Yeah. As if. People who pay $300+ should know what they are paying for. They are not THAT stupid.
I mean look at the iPhone. iPhone 11, iPhone 11 Pro. iPhone SE. No one gets confused by that.

 

[Agent_4Seven]

Just can’t get excited about Lockhart.

Just can't get excited about Xbox as a console in general.

 

[ebullientprism]

Even for someone who keeps track of gaming news this is a confusing mess. I hope this isnt the final name they will go with.

 

[Butz]

Sony and Microsoft are going to cause confusion by launching two power different consoles SKU's at launch taking up space on shelves and causing customer service nightmares at retailers while releasing an mid-gen refresh 3-4 years down the road after the original launch

So it's clear that home consoles well sell less than this gen (Wiiu/XBO/PS4) next gen.

Idk why people are so scared of "confusion", you have two choices, meanwhile on the PC market there's dozens and there's no confusion at all.
If people are too lazy to ask or search for the difference between "S" and "X" or nothing and "Pro" then that's entirely their fault.

 

[R6Rider]

Yeah. As if. People who pay $300+ should know what they are paying for. They are not THAT stupid.
I mean look at the iPhone. iPhone 11, iPhone 11 Pro. iPhone SE. No one gets confused by that.

 

[Afro Republican]

The responsibility then falls on Microsoft/apparently Sony and the retailers to properly explain. If nothing else, that's what return policies are for. I don't understand why this is such a huge deal.

Because you don't have knowledge of the industries involved and get more of your knowledge of it on a niche gaming board?

It's like those wondering why Death Stranding didn't sell 10 million units.

This will be an issue at launch, they just have to hope it won't be a long-term issue.

 

[Afro Republican]

on the PC market there's dozens and there's no confusion at all.

Man you guys are way off on how the average consumer thinks. This has got to be the most baffling one yet,

 

[R6Rider]

Man you guys are way off on how the average consumer thinks. This has got to be the most baffling one yet,

Exactly. At the company I work at people get confused over some of the most basic products we have.

 

[Butz]

Man you guys are way off on how the average consumer thinks. This has got to be the most baffling one yet,

The average consumer doesn't know the alphabet?

 

[R6Rider]

The average consumer doesn't know the alphabet?

You seem to be confused about what he is even talking about.

A perfect example of typical consumer confusion.

 

[Butz]

You seem to be confused about what he is even talking about.

A perfect example of typical consumer confusion.

He's talking about the different SKUs, there are two different ones.
Maybe I'm too optimistic but I'm expecting the average human being to know the difference about TWO +$300 products with different names.

 

[R6Rider]

He's talking about the different SKUs, there are two different ones.
Maybe I'm too optimistic but I'm expecting the average human being to know the difference about TWO +$300 products with different names.

Hearing the stories of direct customer service people in my department, you really are. Lots of people won't be confused, but lots of other will.

It doesn't help that MS chose the dumbest names for the consoles. Reminds me of the Wii U.

 

[Butz]

Hearing the stories of direct customer service people in my department, you really are. Lots of people won't be confused, but lots of other will.

It doesn't help that MS chose the dumbest names for the consoles. Reminds me of the Wii U.

Well the brand is called Xbox.. so it has to have xbox in its name at least

 

[T-I-N-M-A-N dX]

What if Lockhart was a handheld device to take advantage of Xcloud

 

[nordique]

What’s the point in getting the Series S if you have a One X? Seems like the One X is on par or at least more powerful GPU-wise?

 

[Butz]

What’s the point in getting the Series S if you have a One X? Seems like the One X is on par or at least more powerful GPU-wise?

GPUwise they'll most likely be on par but everything else will be better in the S.
Better CPU, SSD etc.

 

[Romulus]

I guess they'll market both as true next gen machines, one for people who want to stick with 1080p, the other 4k. They'll have to be clever on the message though or it'll sound like lockhart is just a gimped machine. I honestly think with a set generational target of 1080p with 4TF and a zen2 it'll keep up just fine with XSX at 4k. Other than the resolution gulf, which is pretty overrated tbh.

 

[NickFire]

I'm still rocking with 1080p TV's, so if MS ends up releasing this there's a good chance I just pick up the cheapest model PS5 to replace one PS4, and then wait a while to see how things shake out before replacing the second PS4 with a high end machine. If MS releases this and Sony just releases one console, I might just get two PS5's near launch. I also might change my mind 10 times today and 200 times in the next few months. I'm kind of excited by the Series X specs, but I can't help worrying that it will be a devs afterthought (just higher resolution is what I mean) if MS sells a much cheaper entry level machine.

 

[MaestroMike]

hope they don't come out with a weaker sku. xsx shld be the base sku and then they should come out with a pro version in a few years. if ps5's cheaper sku is more powerful than xbox's cheapest sku might consider switching to Sony

 

[Jigsaah]

Because you don't have knowledge of the industries involved and get more of your knowledge of it on a niche gaming board?

It's like those wondering why Death Stranding didn't sell 10 million units.

This will be an issue at launch, they just have to hope it won't be a long-term issue.

And I suppose you are some type of expert? Get your Marketing degree from an online school?

 

[Birdo]

I kind of hope Sony do the same. I'd buy the cheaper one for both.

All the screens in my house top out at 1080p 60hz. I honestly don't give a crap about 4K 120fps.

 

[R6Rider]

And I suppose you are some type of expert? Get your Marketing degree from an online school?

Are you implying that it requires a marketing degree to understand that naming your consoles Series X and Series S when you already have a S and X on the market is not a good idea?

As soon as you have people wondering a step beyond "is this better than this one?" you are going have problems.

 

[Clear]

Are you implying that it requires a marketing degree to understand that naming your consoles Series X and Series S when you already have a S and X on the market is not a good idea?

As soon as you have people wondering a step beyond "is this better than this one?" you are going have problems.

This is why introducing just SX to begin with is the smart move. As it at least occupies its own category as the new high end sku.

Lockhart overlaps, and the only way to message through it is to pretend like One S/X simply no longer exist. Which as I said, is questionable given that they are perfectly viable to support the MAU and engagement/spend that is the basis of MS business plan.

 

[Panaphonics]

What’s the point in getting the Series S if you have a One X? Seems like the One X is on par or at least more powerful GPU-wise?

Ray tracing, SSD (short loading times) etc.

 

[Dory16]

Isn't it funny how all speculation threads based on rumors are allowed as long as they are about the Xbox console yet my rumor thread about Sony not releasing the specs until July at least immediately got deleted and earned me a 4 points "strike" or warning (whatever the mods call it)? I know it's just an online forum but I really wish that blatant bias was something that people were still ashamed of. Not in the Trump era I guess.

 

[Afro Republican]

And I suppose you are some type of expert? Get your Marketing degree from an online school?

Poor deflection.

What's funny is you yourself don't even need to do much to get more basic information than you already have, you jsut clearly don't know what you're saying and too full of yourself to even educate yourself on the basic level of this issue, I bet the Wii U performance surprised you after the launch honeymoon.

So those who do actually have better knowledge are way out of your reach. Even now it would take you seconds and you won't do it.

Exactly. At the company I work at people get confused over some of the most basic products we have.

people really don't know how this works, despite the last 15 years of just "gaming" products alone, let alone anything else, shows that consumers are easily confused. I guess people just have bad memories or are in a bubble.

 

[mckmas8808]

Xbox to be the unquestionable winner of North America if they have a $299 model.

So basically you don't have many people buying the Xbox Series X then right?

 

[mckmas8808]

I'm still confused as to why you guys don't seem to understand that MS can't afford to sell Lockhart at $299. Zen2 CPU, expensive SSD, 12GBs of RAM, RDNA2 GPU architecture, and all cheaper than a Xbox One X?

 

[sonomamashine]

I'm still confused as to why you guys don't seem to understand that MS can't afford to sell Lockhart at $299. Zen2 CPU, expensive SSD, 12GBs of RAM, RDNA2 GPU architecture, and all cheaper than a Xbox One X?

If lockhart doesn't have a CD drive in it that means more money from Digital sales.

 

[darkinstinct]

I'm still confused as to why you guys don't seem to understand that MS can't afford to sell Lockhart at $299. Zen2 CPU, expensive SSD, 12GBs of RAM, RDNA2 GPU architecture, and all cheaper than a Xbox One X?

Market share is important. When you can make $180 a year on Game Pass Ultimate, you can afford to sell at a loss. And I think you don't quite understand what this console is. The APU in it will be around half the size of the Xbox One X (and cheaper). It's built on 7nm+ instead of 16nm.

 

[nikolino840]

This seems so close to an Xbox One X I can't see any real reason for it to exist outside of marketing.

Sometimes i agree with you

 

[T-I-N-M-A-N dX]

This seems so close to an Xbox One X I can't see any real reason for it to exist outside of marketing.

That’s why I said and think what if it is a 4TF, 1080p, all digital handheld device.

Plays all your digital content from Xbox One and available 360 BC and accesses gamepass, Live, and Xcloud.

Biggest issues storage and maybe all that in a $300-$350 device.

But it seems like a no brainer and would have quality content available at launch and compete with Switch/Switch mini

 

[NickFire]

I'm still confused as to why you guys don't seem to understand that MS can't afford to sell Lockhart at $299. Zen2 CPU, expensive SSD, 12GBs of RAM, RDNA2 GPU architecture, and all cheaper than a Xbox One X?

I don't think MS decision on the One X price is at all relevant. Just my opinion, but I think MS is looking at next gen as the chance to finally dominate user base while raking in a fortune on subscriptions. With One X I think they were signalling where they were going more than trying to change the status quo. That was not the time to eat significant losses on hardware, but next gen would make sense.

 

[hunthunt]

That’s why I said and think what if it is a 4TF, 1080p, all digital handheld device.

Plays all your digital content from Xbox One and available 360 BC and accesses gamepass, Live, and Xcloud.

Biggest issues storage and maybe all that in a $300-$350 device.

But it seems like a no brainer and would have quality content available at launch and compete with Switch/Switch mini

Im not an expert but I can tell you certainly that a $300 4TF handled is impossible in 2020

 

[Vawn]

That’s why I said and think what if it is a 4TF, 1080p, all digital handheld device.

Plays all your digital content from Xbox One and available 360 BC and accesses gamepass, Live, and Xcloud.

Biggest issues storage and maybe all that in a $300-$350 device.

But it seems like a no brainer and would have quality content available at launch and compete with Switch/Switch mini

I wish, but there's no chance.

 

[T-I-N-M-A-N dX]

Im not an expert but I can tell you certainly that a $300 4TF handled is impossible in 2020

I agree but sometimes MS does some complete wizardary when it comes to devices. I think it could be done but not for $300-$350

 

[mckmas8808]

I don't think MS decision on the One X price is at all relevant. Just my opinion, but I think MS is looking at next gen as the chance to finally dominate user base while raking in a fortune on subscriptions. With One X I think they were signalling where they were going more than trying to change the status quo. That was not the time to eat significant losses on hardware, but next gen would make sense.

The only problem with this thinking is that, MS must bank on gamers spending $10-$15 a month for their subs. And not the $1 a month stuff that they've been getting people in with.

 

[NickFire]

The only problem with this thinking is that, MS must bank on gamers spending $10-$15 a month for their subs. And not the $1 a month stuff that they've been getting people in with.

I assume they consider the $1 a month loss leaders and/or chalk up the loss as advertising expense.