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[Zatoichi's Cane]

My point is where does the conspiracy end?

It pisses me off when people, after everything that has come to light recently still use the conspiracy word that has a negative connotation when discussing privacy concerns.

This is not a just a Microsoft issue, it's apple, Dropbox and countless other that are participating with the NSA to feed them whatever they need, with no oversight.

Is it so inconceivable to think that NSA will get another one of their bullshit court orders to access people's kinnect cameras?

Remember Microsoft did say that they would fight these requests, they didn't deny it was possible.

It's funny how the "tin foil hat" people actually ended up being right about some of these things.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

It's unfortunate that someone with such a bad post history has a similar username to mine. I don't want any of your baggage, Jawabreaker!

Lol when I saw your name I was like wtf?

 

[SwiftDeath]

Jawabreaker is now an instant internet celeb on the misterX blog!...being used as evidence to show not only GAF is actually OWNED by Sony, but n4g.com as well...

All your domains belong to Sony

It may have been Misterxmedia himself

All things considered

 

[Cidd]

So many throwing themselves on their own swords, bugs to a light bulb indeed.

 

[RedNumberFive]

It pisses me off when people, after everything that has come to light recently still use the conspiracy word that has a negative connotation when discussing privacy concerns.

This is not a just a Microsoft issue, it's apple, Dropbox and countless other that are participating with the NSA to feed them whatever they need, with no oversight.

Is it so inconceivable to think that NSA will get another one of their bullshit court orders to access people's kinnect cameras?

Remember Microsoft did say that they would fight these requests, they didn't deny it was possible.

It's funny how the "tin foil hat" people actually ended up being right about some of these things.

You're correct. It seems like everyone is doing this, but I still wouldn't trust Microsoft to fight for our digital privacy. They were the first to roll over, giving the NSA the digital keys to the castle. They've already handed over out data on a silver platter, why would anyone trust them now?

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

It may have been Misterxmedia himself

All things considered

But on a serious note, it's getting really tiresome. It's evident that some newly approved juniors are just trying to be outspoken and obnoxious, so when they get banned they can act like martyrs on their respective forums. They completely fail to realize that GAF is full of staunch Xbox supporters, who actually know how to conduct themselves!

 

[Guymelef]

It may have been Misterxmedia himself

All things considered

misterxmedia isn't a person, is a entity created by some people hopes.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Please tell me how I was part of a clearly coordinated PR campaign?

Whether it's a "coordinated campaign" or not, are you saying your posting on here isn't remotely in a public relations capacity in the lead up to the launch of this product?

 

[SwiftDeath]

But on a serious note, it's getting really tiresome. It's evident that some newly approved juniors are just trying to be outspoken and obnoxious, so when they get banned they can act like martyrs on their respective forums. They completely fail to realize that GAF is full of staunch Xbox supporters, who actually know how to conduct themselves!

Yes I find that interesting

I'm starting to think there may be more Xbox fanboys from other forums joining on a daily basis than MS shills

Perhaps that's a sign the advertising push and FUD campaign is working?

misterxmedia isn't a person, is a entity created by some people hopes.

Pretty sure delusions works better in this case

 

[Imperfected]

There are a few ways we can think about the theoretical 10% increase in gpu resources.

1 Start with the raw paper specs: 1.31 - 10% + 10% which of course makes the result look unimpressive. Who cares? PS4 still has 40% more specs on paper right? And yes at launch it's really 56% and probably best case scenario is a 45% difference once the GPU resource gets returned to game allocation. Again why would Microsoft bother talking about this?

2 Start with the report from devs that stated PS4 has 50% better performance in games. This I can imagine is the bigger problem for Microsoft. And this information is factoring in the 10% usage to Kinect and snap that PS4 doesn't need. If this can be reduced it makes Xbone look better (reducing real world performance to hopefully just a 40% difference).

So out of the two I think the PR is tackling the second idea and saying the difference you see in an actual Xbox game vs a PS4 game at launch will diminish. People in this thread are mostly thinking about it from the raw specs point of view when M$ wants you to see it from a strictly visual point of view. The games will look better down the road than what's been shown and a current disadvantage will Diminish.

Off topic: I wonder if the flexible amount of ram resources Sony allows the developer to access (512 MB of the GDDR5) pertains to the PlayStation 4 Eye? If so, is Microsoft going to give a similar choice to developers to give the somewhat costly resources of the camera back to developers to use as they see fit? Just a thought.

The 50% figure is a pure hardware number. That is, speaking in terms of the raw physical capability of the respective parts, rather than their utilization. That number hasn't (and won't, short of an up-clock) actually changed at all. The number that's changed is how much of the X-Box One GPU is going to be reserved for Kinect and whatever other OS tasks (apparently 10%). At the moment, we do not actually know one way or another what the comparative number on the PS4 is, though open speculation is that it's probably lower to begin with because the console doesn't have a GPU-intensive peripheral built into it.

They X-Box One is only "gaining" GPU power here in comparison to how much it originally had available, whereas it's entirely possible (and likely) that it "loses" yet more in comparison to the PS4 due to the latter likely having a smaller GPU reservation than the One can manage without sacrificing Kinect utility. That's why some people here have consistently been recommending Microsoft's PR should stop making direct comparisons to the PS4: they come out looking a lot better if they just talk about their own system rather than trying to one-up the competition.

As for RAM reservations, both systems already have considerable - probably somewhat excessive, even - amounts of it set aside for OS functionality. The amount chosen was almost certainly greater than will be needed for the sake of future-proofing, and it's quite likely you will see more of it freed up for application use on both systems moving forward as they receive OS optimization. That could be several years down the line, though, as neither company wants to get blindsided by having some hot new app crop up that they want to integrate into their OS only to find out they're short the RAM to run it alongside existing applications.

 

[IHaveCandy]

If Microsoft is dead set on always having Kinect included, I don't see how they can ever make the system affordable to the mainstream. When the Xbox One goes down to $399, Sony will likely be able to go down to $299. When the Xbox One can finally go down to $299, the PS4 will likely be able to go down to $199.

The PS3 had a price issue at first, but it got rid of it and that is what helped it outsell the 360 worldwide. In the US, a PS3 is now cheaper than a 360. I don't see how the box One with Kinect will ever be cheaper.

And don't suggest that subsidized option. That option is not appealing as long as the PS4 is cheap enough.

 

[Freki]

If Microsoft is dead set on always having Kinect included, I don't see how they can ever make the system affordable to the mainstream. When the Xbox One goes down to $399, Sony will likely be able to go down to $299. When the Xbox One can finally go down to $299, the PS4 will likely be able to go down to $199.

The PS3 had a price issue at first, but it got rid of it and that is what helped it outsell the 360 worldwide. In the US, a PS3 is now cheaper than a 360. I don't see how the box One with Kinect will ever be cheaper.

And don't suggest that subsidized option. That option is not appealing as long as the PS4 is cheap enough.

If initial and ongoing sales are bad enought MS will ditch Kinect and offer it serperately - there's no reason to sacrifice a whole console generation because of a gimmick.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

It pisses me off when people, after everything that has come to light recently still use the conspiracy word that has a negative connotation when discussing privacy concerns.

This is not a just a Microsoft issue, it's apple, Dropbox and countless other that are participating with the NSA to feed them whatever they need, with no oversight.

Is it so inconceivable to think that NSA will get another one of their bullshit court orders to access people's kinnect cameras?

Remember Microsoft did say that they would fight these requests, they didn't deny it was possible.

It's funny how the "tin foil hat" people actually ended up being right about some of these things.

Absolutely. After all the NSA drama how can anyone be criticized for doubting?

 

[Tsundere]

This is not a just a Microsoft issue, it's apple, Dropbox and countless other that are participating with the NSA to feed them whatever they need, with no oversight.

Well, this is the gaming forum you know?

 

[avaya]

Just perused the misterxmedia blog.....I feel brain damaged from it.

Absolutely. After all the NSA drama how can anyone be criticized for doubting?

They are playing teams, they will criticise anything that doesn't fit the narrative.

 

[qa_engineer]

It's unfortunate that someone with such a bad post history has a similar username to mine. I don't want any of your baggage, Jawabreaker!

I actually did a double take and said, 'HE LIVES TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY!'

 

[killatopak]

This is the first time I've 'twigged', "oh yeah, they're using 10% because you can run Internet Explorer alongside your game". I've been sitting here thinking my iPhone must reserve a lot for this functionality but it is essentially different from what MS are doing.

Phones are already doing this snap feature right? Specifically Samsung Galaxy S3 and S4. As far as I know, they do this using the "Multi Window" feature. If phones are doing it, I can't understand why snap needs 10% reserves. Shouldn't it be smaller?

Granted, the "Multi Window" feature is not compatible to all apps and I think its not compatible to games at all.

 

[USC-fan]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

 

[Kalren]

Phones are already doing this snap feature right? Specifically Samsung Galaxy S3 and S4. As far as I know, they do this using the "Multi Window" feature. If phones are doing it, I can't understand why snap needs 10% reserves. Shouldn't it be smaller?

Granted, the "Multi Window" feature is not compatible to all apps and I think its not compatible to games at all.

For phones, Snap type feature is limited to certain software and, as you said, usually excludes games. Most phones are not really pushed in terms of usage unless it's a game.

However with XB1, Kinect is always on. The Kinect can track up to 6?(someone feel free to correct me) individuals at a time.That means facial recognition, positioning and skeletal structure and maybe ever further. The 10% set aside is to insure that all the Kinect features PLUS any app that you may concurrently run (Skype can run at the same time as you are gaming) is feasible.

Microsoft certainly can reduce the 10% cost as the OS, kinect and background software become more efficient, but there won't be any large gains unless they completly change(ie remove) the snap ability of their console.

 

[Garrett 2U]

It pisses me off when people, after everything that has come to light recently still use the conspiracy word that has a negative connotation when discussing privacy concerns.

This is not a just a Microsoft issue, it's apple, Dropbox and countless other that are participating with the NSA to feed them whatever they need, with no oversight.

Is it so inconceivable to think that NSA will get another one of their bullshit court orders to access people's kinnect cameras?

Remember Microsoft did say that they would fight these requests, they didn't deny it was possible.

It's funny how the "tin foil hat" people actually ended up being right about some of these things.

You completely missed my point by getting upset by the word.
I was agreeing that the government will indeed do anything to get info on you if they really want to. I agree with you, and him, on that.

My use of conspiracy was in regards to "what next". If you stop using closed source software, you stop using mobile phones, there is still information out there that they can access to spy on you. Where do you stop worrying?

The only solution to stop the government spying is for them to stop spying.

 

[RoboPlato]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

They've outright denied a second GPU multiple times. The fact that people still are clinging to these rumors less than two months from launch is unbelieveable.

 

[artist]

Please tell me how I was part of a clearly coordinated PR campaign? Because after I posted something, you saw Major or other people respond the same way?

Let me propose an alternative: I was very clear if you search back about topics I would post on. I said I would only post details on things that were public. Because of my job, I have access to more specifics about the system then many in the organization.

Major Nelson has somewhere over 500K twitter followers and he's very active online. People would see something I posted here, ask him if it was true. He would then, obviously, post the same thing.

I also don't post really anywhere but here. I don't have time. So, of course, he'd be on Reddit repeating what I'd said.

I'll accept plenty of accusations about things, but this one I will dispute. The closest thing to "coordinated" would be that I'd occasionally give him a heads-up before I posted on a topic so he would be prepared - he fields about 100X the number of questions I have to, so that was purely done out of respect. Nothing about my posts here are part of a grand plan, period.

Wait, you say you were not co-ordinated and then go on to admit exactly that (I give him a headsup out of "respect") ..

This is hilarious.

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

That's just the GPU co-processor. The core GPU has been rated at a rumoured 5.3TF

Spoiler

(Totally False)

.

 

[Raist]

They've outright denied a second GPU multiple times. The fact that people still are clinging to these rumors less than two months from launch is unbelieveable.

I remember when he posted "there's no additional dGPU" and some people went "no additional dGPU? IT MEANS THERE'S ONE dGPU THEN!".

That was hilarious.

 

[Pistolero]

Tech Gaf, there's a question I'm interested in having an answer to...
The prevailing opinion is that the PS4 has a better memory configuration. Isn't that somehow mitigated by the superior theoretical bandwidth of the eSRAM? What would be the pros and cons of each configuration, concretely?
Thanks in advance!

 

[Aussie Legend]

I have to say, I am still shocked they aren't giving people an option of subsidising the Xbone with 2 years of Gold on a payment plan. Madness, MADNESS, if you ask me

 

[SHADES]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

I know your only after confirmation put this stupid rumour to bed once & for all, but do people really think with the perceived rough time MS have had since their reveal that they would not disclose the one thing that could turn the tide back in their favour? Not forgetting the up clocks, pre-order incentive's, 180's PR & marketing disasters and all that could be solved with one announcement.

If MS had that up their sleeves that card would have been dealt by now.

 

[Raist]

Tech Gaf, there's a question I'm interested in having an answer to...
The prevailing opinion is that the PS4 has a better memory configuration. Isn't that somehow mitigated by the superior theoretical bandwidth of the eSRAM? What would be the pros and cons of each configuration, concretely?
Thanks in advance!

The "real-life" eSRAM bandwidth is actually around the PS4 main memory's.
Nevertheless, it only applies to a small chunk of memory so it's fairly limited.

 

[Nafai1123]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

Is this a serious question?

 

[Oemenia]

Tech Gaf, there's a question I'm interested in having an answer to...
The prevailing opinion is that the PS4 has a better memory configuration. Isn't that somehow mitigated by the superior theoretical bandwidth of the eSRAM? What would be the pros and cons of each configuration, concretely?
Thanks in advance!

For starters MS had to sacrifice their silicon budget to get the eSRAM in and as a result had to scale back on the GPU. But besides that, high bandwidth is important for the GPU and IIRC mostly for IQ purposes. I hear that the WiiU's GPU power over the current-gen is nullified by the systems bandwidth which is half of the 360's.

From my limited knowledge the eDRAM on the 360 didn't actually provide more power but massive bandwidth which helped the GPU immensely.

 

[vdo]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

It's these types of questions that Microsoft should really just ignore. If they come back and deny it, it just reinforces people concentrating on the performance gap. Any denial just comes across as "No, we're sorry but our system has the lower amount of power that you wish it did not have."

 

[SwiftDeath]

Albert Penello,

MS have been very open about the specs of the system but there are rumor MS is hiding a lot of the gpu power. For example there are rumors about another gpu or part of the gpu power is gated off to be unlock down the road. I know you said on twitter there is no second gpu. The rumor is the xbone total gpu power is 3.2Tf.

Is the only gpu power in the system the 1.31 Tflop?

Thanks

Albert has already quashed that rumor specifically

The GPU in the XB1 is 1.31 Tlops total with around 1.18 TFLOPs available for games

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=673713&highlight=albert+penello

Tech Gaf, there's a question I'm interested in having an answer to...
The prevailing opinion is that the PS4 has a better memory configuration. Isn't that somehow mitigated by the superior theoretical bandwidth of the eSRAM? What would be the pros and cons of each configuration, concretely?
Thanks in advance!

First off I'm not a card carrying member of TechGaf unfortunately

That being said I do know that the PS4 memory solution is far easier to develop for currently

As well as the high bandwidth being available from the entire 8GBs instead of just a 32mb scratchpad with slower DDR3 memory pool behind it

Furthermore it has yet to be clarified in what scenarios you will get what bandwidth from the EDram

I.E. Perhaps they can get very good bandwidth but in what scenarios and how much of the total usage will that be?

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Albert has already quashed that rumor specifically

The GPU in the XB1 is 1.31 Tlops total with around 1.18 TFLOPs available for games

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=673713&highlight=albert+penello

Oh god... misterxmedia's FUD is spreading to XB1 fans to the point where they ignore public MS statements about the power of their console. The delusion is powerful.

 

[Pistolero]

The "real-life" eSRAM bandwidth is actually around the PS4 main memory's.
Nevertheless, it only applies to a small chunk of memory so it's fairly limited.

But then, would it be correct, as it's sometimes hinted at, to add the bandwidth of the eSRAM to that of the DDR3, or is it an exemple of faulty logic?

 

[vcc]

The "real-life" eSRAM bandwidth is actually around the PS4 main memory's.
Nevertheless, it only applies to a small chunk of memory so it's fairly limited.

Isn't that the aggregate ESRAM + DDR3 bandwidth? The ESRAM itself is capped at 109gb with a trick that allows a few extra reads and writes under ideal conditions?

 

[FeiRR]

Are you for real? They make the money back by people who are going to buy the Xbox One for the NFL deal. Those people are most likely going to buy a game or two and pay for XBL Gold. I see plenty of ways to get their money back( without selling peoples data).

Oh, now I see where you're getting at. I wasn't implying they need ads for return of their investment (altough I can't imagine they won't take a dig on it because... why else invest so much in Kinect?). The other guy said that you pay extra 100 for Kinect and I just gave an example there are a lot more things you need to pay for the premium price of the box. Of course the NFL deal is to draw people in but it's aimed at less than half of their current customers and maybe 10% of their potential customers. That's why I think it's wasted money. They could fund 10 good 1st party games with that money and appeal to almost all of their potential customers, like with Titanfall.

 

[Hubble]

I'm still here, reading with great interest. I stated very publicly I wasn't going to chime in on these posts, but I read them.

When I see a question, I still try to answer if I can.

At this point, most everything is known about the system so the need for me to post is reduced - it was more interesting back when we weren't being very clear on some points.

Just the fact that we're 2 months from launch means there's less for me to say. But I'm around.

Hi Albert,

Thanks for taking the time to participate in the forums in addition to your job responsibilities. As a console gamer, I enjoy all consoles and owned them all but there is always a "primary" console. Even though I owned many of the consoles of the generation at one time, my primary consoles was the Genesis, PS1, PS2, and X360. I own a PS3 but my 360 has been my primary console and my preference. The 360 offers better multiplatform performance and I personally prefer the 360 UI, better online gaming, the 360 controller, etc., far more than my PS3. However, it seems much of this is in doubt this upcoming generation. The PS4 looks to have a revamped UI, including recorded videos linked to a players profile, which is an appealing feature, cross-game chat, but most importantly better hardware ensuring better multiplatform performance and higher quality of graphics especially in exclusives in years to come.

As someone who really likes the X360 and I consider myself unbiased is, I am really disappointed about the hardware in Xbox One. I am also not a computer engineer. The 360 has won this generation and earned substantial revenue in Xbox Live far outnumbering what Sony has made in PSN throughout this entire generation and it is no doubt Microsoft is one of the largest companies in the world with sizable resources. With this success, I fully expected Microsoft as a company to invest heavily in the Xbox One hardware to better the PS4 with the latest future designs or the least equal it, even if it means selling the console at a greater loss than Sony. It would have been worth the cost, and probably win the generation. It seems this is not the case with Microsoft being more cost conscious with the Xbox One hardware (lesser GPU, less expensive ram, DDR < GDDR).

Prior to its unveil, I was certain in getting an Xbox One. With the DRM restrictions, I was certainly not getting it but then I was after the reversal. Now with the latest information on the XB1 hardware, and more news and reports of XB1 titles struggling to hit 1080p, I am really on the fence. In all honesty, I am extremely disappointed in Microsoft and the Xbox One hardware that has me leaning towards the PS4.

I know you say all to know about the hardware is known so you have reduced your participation, but I disagree. Perhaps more details of the system has been released but I feel the argument that the PS4 is significantly more powerful than the XB1 has not been defended to satisfaction by Microsoft hence the discussions in these forums, or it is likely the PS4 does indeed have much better hardware. I have a feeling your using Digital Foundry's articles as an outlet to counter this, and while the articles are great and insightful, I don't think they are in layman terms and more of a 'spin', or maybe too technically written more suited for computer engineers.

I know there are many more people like me who were maybe an X360 user or even not, who are now getting the PS4 simply because it has better hardware. My question is what can Microsoft say/argue in simple terms if any about its hardware being less powerful than the PS4?. A possible totally made-up example is if the XB1 has more on-board processors than the PS4 alleviating CPU usage by offering its separate use and for instance providing better audio.

P.S - I'm a longtime lurker on these forums and is why this is my first post.

 

[Crimson_Fate]

Oh, now I see where you're getting at. I wasn't implying they need ads for return of their investment (altough I can't imagine they won't take a dig on it because... why else invest so much in Kinect?). The other guy said that you pay extra 100 for Kinect and I just gave an example there are a lot more things you need to pay for the premium price of the box. Of course the NFL deal is to draw people in but it's aimed at less than half of their current customers and maybe 10% of their potential customers. That's why I think it's wasted money. They could fund 10 good 1st party games with that money and appeal to almost all of their potential customers, like with Titanfall.

So your thinking that Its like what Direct TV does with the NFL package. They draw in NFL fans with the "FREE" package but everyone is actually paying for it, even the people who could care less. Have they actually released any details about if any money actually changed hands with MS ? I

 

[jayu26]

Oh god... misterxmedia's FUD is spreading to XB1 fans to the point where they ignore public MS statements about the power of their console. The delusion is powerful.

Okay, so I just read through some of the comments on misterxmedia, because I'm insane! But now I want to know who this fuckers is...

the sonygaf is a fucking joke
(Anonymous)
2013-10-03 04:33 pm (UTC)
Yesterday after 5 posts xbounity on neogaf bish did a search on me because I wasnt agreeing with the assertion that the 10 percent wont be avail to devs based on the article and goossen comments. I was banned for the reason of being a grassroot viral marketer for msft. Lol needless to say im complimented. My wife and most of systemwars had a good laugh. Talk about insecurity by sonygaf. Day by day the truth comes out. It is losing cred real fast. Bish is one insecure mental case mod. So delicious. Seems like the lack of games graphical prowess for the ps4 is getting to the sony dicksucking

 

[SwiftDeath]

I know there are many more people like me who were maybe an X360 user or even not, who are now getting the PS4 simply because it has better hardware. My question is what can Microsoft say/argue in simple terms if any about its hardware being less powerful than the PS4.

Yes I have heard this from several others before as well

Some went back to Xbox once the reversals happened, some were unaware of the reversals but honestly there is a decent chunk of my friends who were primarily X360 gamers and are going PS4

They just don't see why they should pay $499 for the XB1

 

[RoboPlato]

Okay, so I just read through some of the comments on misterxmedia, because I'm insane! But now I want to know who this fuckers is...

LOL at him bragging about the ban to System Wars.

Yes I have heard this from several others before as well

Some went back to Xbox once the reversals happened, some were unaware of the reversals but honestly there is a decent chunk of my friends who were primarily X360 gamers and are going PS4

They just don't see why they should pay $499 for the XB1

All my friends are in the same boat. They were dedicated 360 gamers because of Halo but now that Bungie's gone they refuse to pay extra for a weaker console since they don't even have any exclusives to be super excited for.

 

[LowEndTorque]

Hi Albert,

Thanks for taking the time to participate in the forums in addition to your job responsibilities. As a console gamer, I enjoy all consoles and owned them all but there is always a "primary" console. Even though I owned many of the consoles of the generation at one time, my primary consoles was the Genesis, PS1, PS2, and X360. I own a PS3 but my 360 has been my primary console and my preference. The 360 offers better multiplatform performance and I personally prefer the 360 UI, the 360 controller, etc., far more than my PS3. However, it seems much of this is in doubt this upcoming generation. The PS4 looks to have a revamped UI, including recorded videos linked to a players profile, which is an appealing feature, but most importantly better hardware ensuring better multiplatform performance and higher quality of graphics especially in exclusives in years to come.

As someone who really likes the X360 and I consider myself unbiased is, I am really disappointed about the hardware in Xbox One. I am also not a computer engineer. The 360 has won this generation and earned substantial revenue in Xbox Live far outnumbering what Sony has made in PSN throughout this entire generation and it is no doubt Microsoft is one of the largest companies in the world with sizable resources. With this success, I fully expected Microsoft as a company to invest heavily in the Xbox One hardware to better the PS4 with the latest future designs or the least equal it, even if it means selling the console at a greater loss than Sony. It would have been worth the cost, and probably win the generation. It seems this is not the case with Microsoft being more cost conscious with the Xbox One hardware (lesser GPU, less expensive ram, DDR < GDDR).

Prior to its unveil, I was certain in getting an Xbox One. With the DRM restrictions, I was certainly not getting it but then I was after the reversal. Now with the latest information on the XB1 hardware, and more news and reports of XB1 titles struggling to hit 1080p, I am really on the fence. In all honesty, I am extremely disappointed in Microsoft and the Xbox One hardware that has me leaning towards the PS4.

I know you say all to know about the hardware is known so you have reduced your participation, but I disagree. Perhaps more details of the system has been released but I feel the argument that the PS4 is significantly more powerful than the XB1 has not been defended to satisfaction by Microsoft hence the discussions in these forums, or it is likely the PS4 does indeed have much better hardware. I have a feeling your using Digital Foundry's articles as an outlet to counter this, and while the articles are great and insightful, I don't think they are in layman terms and more of a 'spin', or maybe too technically written more suited for computer engineers.

I know there are many more people like me who were maybe an X360 user or even not, who are now getting the PS4 simply because it has better hardware. My question is what can Microsoft say/argue in simple terms if any about its hardware being less powerful than the PS4?. A possible totally made-up example is if the XB1 has more on-board processors than the PS4 alleviating CPU usage by offering its separate use and for instance providing better audio.

P.S - I'm a longtime lurker on these forums and is why this is my first post.

What kind of answer are you hoping to get out of this question other than the same FUD and PR spin we’ve been getting for weeks?

PS4 being notably more powerful than Xbone is not an argument. It's a cold hard fact.
The power gap is not something that needs to be defended by MS. It’s not something that can be defended. It’s something that needs to be admitted and put to bed, so we can move on from the cycle of misinformation, straw grasping and silly discussions.

 

[Aussie Legend]

I am also a 360 convert if you will, not only because graphical power obviously (though I'd be lieing if I said it wasn't a plus, its just added potential for talented developers to tap into), but more for Sony's overall core philosophies from dealing with development to its first party studios.

I love my 360 (do not own a PS3) and its sad to say goodbye to Microsoft (for the time being at least) after all the good years I had with you but facts are facts... they are service provider, both are, and as a consumer I go where I believe the best product for my needs, desires and money are... and at this point that is undoubtably the PS4. No loyalty, but value and utility wins for me here. I hope in the future either the XB1 or the next Microsoft console can refocus, but for now I'm happy to be on board with Sony as an expat and I know a lot of my friends are doing the same.

 

[Skenzin]

There is a lot of trust for MS online infrastructure and their unified experience among MP oriented gamers. One of the concerns myself and other going mulitplatform, and considering /purchasing a PS4 is the online experience. By reading the forums it does seem online gaming is less popular among the Sony faithful on average compared to the 360 crowd. Its going to be interesting this generation to see how Sony delivers to 360 converts in this area. From my experience with MS and Azure it is near the top in cloud computing, and next to AWS but with different focuses.

I would not consider myself a 360 refugee because I will be day one on both consoles. But if you were to ask me which I will be playing MP on, Im still up in the air on launch games.

 

[robertsan21]

What kind of answer are you hoping to get out of this question other than the same FUD and PR spin we’ve been getting for weeks?

PS4 being notably more powerful than Xbone is not an argument. It's a cold hard fact.
The power gap is not something that needs to be defended by MS. It’s not something that can be defended. It’s something that needs to be admitted

WORD!


I do not agree on that we need to stop talking about it yet. MS tried to ruin the entire gaming world by banning used games and forcing shit down our throats just to make more fucking money and gimping the console for gamers. Thank god for Sony, that showed everyone that they are not an evil company trying to ruin the way we like to play our games. If gamers dont stick up for what they want from a product, then we will get run over and forced to pay for gimped shit that we dont really want. This apply to every market out there, and some markets are so fucked up its sad. just look at Cable TV, we are forced to pay for 50 channels that we dont even fucking watch, just to get the ones we want to watch. This way of running things should be fucking illegal. That is why I dont have cable anymore. fuck that shit I watch films and tv shows online they way I want it to.

Companies are be our bitch, and not vice versa. We take advantage of them, they dont take advantage of us.

 

[Skeff]

I am also a 360 convert if you will, not only because graphical power obviously (though I'd be lieing if I said it wasn't a plus, its just added potential for talented developers to tap into), but more for Sony's overall core philosophies from dealing with development to its first party studios.

I love my 360 (do not own a PS3) and its sad to say goodbye to Microsoft (for the time being at least) after all the good years I had with you but facts are facts... they are service provider, both are, and as a consumer I go where I believe the best product for my needs, desires and money are... and at this point that is undoubtably the PS4. No loyalty, but value and utility wins for me here. I hope in the future either the XB1 or the next Microsoft console can refocus, but for now I'm happy to be on board with Sony as an expat and I know a lot of my friends are doing the same.

I know this probably isn't the thread for this, But I've seen many people with the same intentions as yourself so it's not aimed purely at you, if you really feel like this, would it be a good idea to wait for next gen?

I know some people are jumping in to next gen and not looking back but for yourself who has never owned a PS3, perhaps a PS3 stop gap would be a good idea to see if the xb1 is released without kinect? there are plenty of PS3 exclusives which would be like new games to you.

I know you may just want to be in next gen straight away, but maybe this could provide another option to yourself and other readers. Good luck either way.

 

[Aussie Legend]

I know this probably isn't the thread for this, But I've seen many people with the same intentions as yourself so it's not aimed purely at you, if you really feel like this, would it be a good idea to wait for next gen?

I know some people are jumping in to next gen and not looking back but for yourself who has never owned a PS3, perhaps a PS3 stop gap would be a good idea to see if the xb1 is released without kinect? there are plenty of PS3 exclusives which would be like new games to you.

I know you may just want to be in next gen straight away, but maybe this could provide another option to yourself and other readers. Good luck either way.

Completely fair question, and I've contemplated picking up a PS3 for probably two odd years now (the Last of Us was a very very big incentive). But I can tell you the reason why and that boils down to what I'll throw under the umbrella of "social gaming" (couldn't think of a less buzzwordy way to put it sorry):

I can not remember the last time I played a game sitting alone without talking to people online, I mean that sincerely. If I'm playing a multiplayer game I'm in a party or skype call (I play a lot on PC as well) and even if I'm playing a singleplayer game I'm constantly talking to people playing different games. Gaming is no longer a solitary activity for me, its a chance to interact with many different people (most of which are my friends in real life obviously but many I talk for hours on end I've never met in real life, that's so awesome) who all share a passion for similar things. Now unfortunately for Sony, imo this is the biggest thing they fucked up with the PS3, Microsoft killed them in this respect and it became the console where I went to go to play and chat with friends. Still to this very day its, imo, the only percieved strength that the Xbox One has over the PS4: its online

Now, I am kind of taking it at good faith that Sony have addressed the majority of these issues. We know some definitively like Cross-Game chat but we can't really know if Sony has caught up to Microsoft on the Online Infastructure and Stability standpoint until both products are out... but I have faith that they've fixed it to the point where its okay for me as someone who doesn't play a whole lot of multiplayer to get in whenever a friend wants a game and for it to just 'work' without lag and nonsense

So, bit of a long winded answer (and very tangential to the topic being discussed, sorry about that), but that's predominantly why I chose the 360 over the PS3 this gen and why I probably won't pick one up and will skip to the PS4. Also I'm a nerd, I like new shiny things!

 

[jaypah]

Is this a serious question?

Of course not, he knows better. But he wants a direct answer from AP so Misterxmedia can try to spin it.

 

[SwiftDeath]

Of course not, he knows better. But he wants a direct answer from AP so Misterxmedia can try to spin it.

Oh man his entry today is hilarious

Completely and totally unbiased look at neogaf and n4g

No personal opinion or bias in that at all...

 

[jaypah]

Oh man his entry today is hilarious

Completely and totally unbiased look at neogaf and n4g

No personal opinion or bias in that at all...

Well...gotta deflect.