This
So THIS is the Half-Life 3 confirmation we've been looking for.
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Smash Wii U/3DS: 3 Character Slots & 3 Stage Slots Found in Recent Patch Data (1.1.1)
- Thread starter Neoxon
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So THIS is the Half-Life 3 confirmation we've been looking for.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
The real twist will be when Retro's next game ends up being DK 64 2
kunonabi
Member
If Snake tags along fine, but if Konami is only getting one character in Smash then Simon, Bomberman, and even Goemon all deserve the spot more. Capcom has two characters so getting Simon and Snake isn't all that outrageous a thought now.
With a 400% completion rate.
10 Kongs! 20 Levels! You'll be collecting forever! HAHAHAHAHAHA!
APZonerunner
Member
I phrased that poorly, really, but I meant more in the handheld space - where that's always been Pokemon (which is a different beast), FE, GS. Seems GS is the dead one, sadly. Alas.
And, sure, you're right. The Excitebikes, Resetti etc got cut... though I will say the difference between a lot of the ones that got cut and Isaac is I always felt his trophy was one of the better ones (whereas Resetti was just a pain in the ass annoyance, etc), and he's a character with a moveset that'd work.
Alas. I'm just being salty because in my heart of hearts I know we're probably going to get wolf and he's going to be a clone right down the landmaster again (which irritates me even with Falco given that in their own damn lore he refuses to drive one). Knuckles or K. Rool would make up for that, though.
BassForever
Member
I would assume a scenario where Bomberman was dlc and Snake didn't come back would be to the cost of licensing the character, or Konami just being tighter with it's own original IP and not as tight with it's acquired IP from Hudson.
Goemon hasn't had a "real" entry in its IP since a Japan-only DS game from 2005, and doesn't have any future titles planned.
Snake is a SSB veteran, there's no contest here.
I just want them to add the ability to disable stage hazards. It shouldn't just be an all-or-nothing thing. I like the layout of certain stages, but the hazards just ruin them a lot of the time. Also I would love the ability to lock stages that change over the course of a match to one of its forms for good.
TheDinoman
Member
Not to mention, Metal Gear Solid is a more popular and important franchise than Castlevania, Goemon and Bomberman combined.
I mean, really, Goemon deserves it more than Snake? An obscure character from an inactive game series vs. a notable gaming icon with games still coming out to this day?
Aaronrules380
Member
Snake icon status is almost entirely associated with Sony though. It's not even comparable to Ryu, who had one of his most notable roles on a Nintendo platform. Snake's popularity has pretty much nothing to do with the Nintendo games he's been on, and he isn't even coming to Nintendo platforms anymore. In my mind, what's important about a third party isn't there icon status so much as there relevance to Nintendo and it's history. That's why I think an indie rep is more deserving than Snake. Indies are a huge part of Nintendo's current strategy, so while no individual indie is a huge icon (by the nature of being indie), they play an important role in Nintendo's history. Snake really doesn't IMO
WiiRevolution1
Member
So the same person also is saying Shovel Knight? So thats four characters?This
Two of these slots were there since the April update, so two are before the ballot.
Lucky guesss, and I'd be ok with it, but I highly doubt a Konami character would get in and not being Snake. Sure, two could get in but thats not what this is saying, unless Nintendo bought Bomberman. Plus "Sakurai wouldn't want Snake due to Konami and Kojima BS"? Then why would he want to work with the company that fired his friend on a different character? Doesn't add up. Sure anything possible, but even I don't believe something that crazy could happen. (Unless Nintendo DID buy Bomberman...)
#Quotingapostthreepageslate
balladofwindfishes
Member
A clone again? When was Wolf a clone the first time?
Roy & Ryu's data were in Mewtwo's update & came out in the following update. If this is any indication, we may see these 3 characters as soon as the next update. However, since we just got an update, I wouldn't expect the next one until sometime in November.
UglyRareCharacter
Member
You know people who post vitriol like this think that they are being totes hilarious and subversive about a popular character
They are not
They are just being jack asses.
Nintendo's current strategy is pray Mario Maker keeps selling until their stock goes up when they announce NX details.
Snake's popularity or affiliation with Nintendo is an outlier, they decided to put him into the series on Sakurai's whom and now he has a coveted veteran spot. We aren't far enough into the franchise for it to be too overstuffed, so you can expect all previous fighters to make it in eventually.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Yeah, people kept on listing Snake's involvement in Nintendo when the matter of fact is he got in because Kojima asked Sakurai. Nothing more or less.
I use ROB because of the "they're not video game characters at all and are only partially related due to their involvement" - their origins, not whether Sakurai picks them. You bring up ROB's origin, which solidifies my point that he is in fact not a character but a peripheral. You keep bringing up Nintendo but that wasn't why I bring up ROB to begin with - I am simply stating the similarities of their origin, not the "chances" or shit.
She is a persona of a synthesizer that is later used in video games. She pioneered the "vocaloid" phenomena which IS a niche similar to that of VNs. She might not have started it, but like Doronbo Gang she made it big.
And likewise, if you read my posts, I don't think she will get in, but I am laughing at the fact that people rank her quite low as though she is a cartoon character, using arguments that sound like hypocritical which I tackled. And even then Sakurai never made big rules.
Also I'm not moving goalposts. I'm just sitting here looking at all the gymnastics show because I just corrected the assumption on Miku's place.
But Wolf's not a clone.
I use ROB because of the "they're not video game characters at all and are only partially related due to their involvement" - their origins, not whether Sakurai picks them. You bring up ROB's origin, which solidifies my point that he is in fact not a character but a peripheral. You keep bringing up Nintendo but that wasn't why I bring up ROB to begin with - I am simply stating the similarities of their origin, not the "chances" or shit.
She is a persona of a synthesizer that is later used in video games. She pioneered the "vocaloid" phenomena which IS a niche similar to that of VNs. She might not have started it, but like Doronbo Gang she made it big.
And likewise, if you read my posts, I don't think she will get in, but I am laughing at the fact that people rank her quite low as though she is a cartoon character, using arguments that sound like hypocritical which I tackled. And even then Sakurai never made big rules.
Also I'm not moving goalposts. I'm just sitting here looking at all the gymnastics show because I just corrected the assumption on Miku's place.
But Wolf's not a clone.
BassForever
Member
I'd be cool with Miku in Smash but I honestly don't see it happening, even in her Mirai version. One day I'd love a straight answer from Sakurai on why Snake didn't return in Smash 4 as it would help to quell conversation about the character in all future Smash DLC/game discussion
You're right, it's not impossible for them to include Miku.
I'd put her odds somewhere around Riddick, or maybe Harry Potter.
Edit: oh, and Coachella Hologram Tupac.
There are no similarities in their origin. "Origin" means their start, their beginning. One was created with gaming in mind and one was not. Whatever happened with Miku later does not count as an "origin".
What is this phenomena? You keep saying "later used in video games" but can I have some examples that aren't just games based on the Vocaloid franchise? How is this any different from a character like Popeye or Mickey Mouse that started in one medium but eventually got their own games?
Green Mamba
Member
Yes, weird coincidence, that's what it was.
Yeah, said Shovel Knight Amiibo is completely separate from the Smash line, & isn't even made by Nintendo. Plus Tamaki already said numerous times that the SK Amiibo was separate from his Smash rumor (even before said Amiibo leaked).
Yep. It gets tiring after a whole seeing the K. Rool hate posts. I don't get it.
APZonerunner
Member
Semantics, obviously; Ryu and Sakura aren't clones either, but ultimately Wolf had a version of the reflector, a version of the dash, a version of the Fire Fox, a version of the blaster, the Landmaster, and similar-but-tweaked normals. He's no model swap, obviously - there's a lot different to him, and he plays differently - but he's in that same archetype with that same base set of moves conceptually, they just function differently across the three of them, and three is, IMO, one too many. So, I use clone broadly - I wouldn't want a third version of Link either, I've always thought the people who've asked for Young Link back as well as Toon Link to be nutcases for the same reason. Regardless, as far as Wolf goes, I'm actually fairly okay with most of the former (though I'd love to see some more moves outright replaced with an entirely new thing with radically different properties) but the Landmaster has always struck me as a shitty move on all levels. Starfox doesn't have much lore, but Wolf and Falco both deserved their own unique FS for their own unique personalities and backgrounds.
Then again -- I've always felt wolf, as a third reflector/blaster/dash character, was a mis-step. I'm no fan of the character, but if they wanted another Starfox character it always should've been Krystal, with the Staff from Adventures (which originally belonged to her before Fox gets it) & moves inspired by the magic powers in that game. That'd be something entirely new and different - Zelda-esque magic, and a staff, which'd be a nice change from the sea of sword users as far as close quarters weapons go, but alas. We did at least get a staff user of a sort in Smash 4 with Palutena at any rate.
But... he plays and feels just like FOX and FALCO!
/s It's the same silly hoopla surrounding Roy, and he is so different from Marth.
Judging by the fact that Krystal is no longer canon in Star Fox Zero, Nintendo may be moving away from her as a whole.
Mysterious
Banned
How do we know she's no longer canon?
APZonerunner
Member
Sure, but I'm talking there from the perspective of Brawl, when they picked Wolf, which was coming off the back of a game where she was a major character, to be fair. I understand why they'd bring Wolf back now; he's already half-done in a sense, anyway. I just lament he's not more different.
If I recall, Nintendo turned back the clock on Star Fox canon for Zero. Who knows, maybe they'll change their minds & reintroduce her in a later Star Fox game.
Mysterious
Banned
What do you mean? I'm confused. Wouldn't that make it an interquel? Do you have a link to this?
Jawmuncher
Member
But isn't star fox zero a prequel?
APZonerunner
Member
Star Fox Zero is in a weird place, as it's a complete 're-imagining' of the series (though Nintendo has repeatedly warned press off describing it as a reboot - at E3 PR kept hammering this into us, 'it isn't a reboot, it's a re-imagining', describe it as such), so it's basically a remake of Starfox 64/Starfox again from a fresh perspective, so, yeah, she's gone, Peppy is back in an Arwing, the Panther dude is gone from Star Wolf, Pigma is alive again, etc.
It is essentially a different take on the 'core' Starfox story, which is what Starfox 64 is (it isn't a sequel to Starfox, more the same story again with new wrinkles).
Yeah, which was all I meant in describing him as a 'clone'. I know of course he doesn't play identically, but the way his move-set is constructed is very similar, and ultimately he was chosen because he was easy to do. Which, in a sense, makes him being a DLC slot a little tougher to swallow, but I'll buy it anyway; I'll always support Smash.
kunonabi
Member
Castlevania is a far more important franchise than MGS when it comes to Nintendo's legacy. There is so much there in terms of stages, assist trophies, and music that would elevate Smash than what Snake brings to the table.
Didn't Goemon rank pretty highly in one of the Japanese polls? The vast majority of his titles are with Nintendo and he isn't any more or less dead on Nintendo platforms than Snake is at this point who is far more distinctly tied to Sony platforms and even the MSX in comparison to Nintendo.
Despite Konami owning him, Bomberman would represent Hudson who certainly deserves some recognition, If Ryu can get in to pay tribute to the series that defined fighting games then Bomberman can get in for being the face of franchise that was pretty much a cornerstone of local multiplayer.
Mysterious
Banned
So basically it's going to be the same plot as Starfox 64, as it's just the same story from a different angle. That has nothing to do with what comes next. They also specifically said its not a reboot, so the old canon is still valid. Unless they explicitly say it's no longer canon, it's still canon.
But since she's not in this upcoming reimagining, she doesn't have a purpose of being in this Smash game to promote something. But that still doesn't mean the other games are no longer canon.
This
It sounds legit... until you realize Bomberman also belongs to Konami.
Its a reboot.
Hot Coldman
Banned
If K.Rool gets in Smash 4, I'll perform the DK Rap on Twitch
akidnamededdy
Banned
Snake Eater 3D came out many years after the last Goemon game.
The rest of your points are moot anyway. Snake will sel DLC, Goemon will not. I love Mystical Ninja 64 but it's true. Plus Snake is basically already done, so...
TheDinoman
Member
I'm talking about gaming in general, and in that regard Metal Gear has Castlevania beat. Even if the latter is more associated with Nintendo, the former has probably made a bigger impact in gaming history, and I'd say that's what matters.
I don't know anything about Goemon ranking high on polls, and it really doesn't matter. He is nowhere near the level of Sonic, Ryu, Pac-Man and even Snake. Also, I don't think Bomberman is as huge a character as people think he is. He was just the mascot of a minor (and defunct) game company back in the 90s, and I can't really think of what makes him such a heavy hitter like the other third parties in Smash. I'm pretty sure games like Mario Kart had it beat in terms of being "a cornerstone of local multiplayer".
Do people really think Inklings are happening? Just simply because of their ink mechanics I don't think they'll be playable here; seems like they'd have to put in way more work than most DLC characters.
I think it would use a lot of processing power to make the ink mechanics faithful to Splatoon(ink reacting to and staying on terrain), and if the Wii U can handle it, the 3DS certainly can't. Seems like a character they need way more time to add, to the point that they'd be better off waiting til the next Smash.
I think it would use a lot of processing power to make the ink mechanics faithful to Splatoon(ink reacting to and staying on terrain), and if the Wii U can handle it, the 3DS certainly can't. Seems like a character they need way more time to add, to the point that they'd be better off waiting til the next Smash.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Nah more like Segata Sanshiro actually.
Yes I know he got a game near the end of Saturn, but his proper goal is an advertising material.
Origin in terms of the program, not the persona. The program was used in video games (iirc even in stuff like Quake).
The vocaloids never left their stuff, they remained as they are outside of "live" concerts. They exist in the software.
Uh no, that doesn't make him a clone.
He was easier to implement because they are more familiar with Wolf's look. Remember they already did him in Melee. In fact, if you notice, that actually freed them enough time that they designed him quite differently in looks
Uh no. Those aren't just "tweaked" moves. This is where I draw the line.
You can say that for some of his specials/FS (and I disagree, the only truly tweaked stuff is his Final Smash, the rest are no more different than saying "Link's arrow shot is the same as Mario's fireballs because they are projectiles), but his normals? Fuck no.
Those aren't tweaked normals. They are their own animation. They have their own attributes. Saying they are tweaked is stupid, as that's just saying Marth's forward smash is a tweaked Link forward smash.
People thoroughly analyzed the character and outside of miscellaneous animations (which many characters share anyway), he is unique. So what if he shares an archetype? I guess that makes Ryu a Mario clone then because they share the same archetype? Is Shulk a Marth clone too because most of his specials are derivatives of the typical sword users? Wouldn't surprise me when people also said Ike was a clone back then.
And to counter this staff bullshit, look no further than Ganondorf. And just to spite, nearly all of the Adventure spells can be modified to look like the Star Fox archetype moves.
And you know what, Wolf may not have a staff, but he is quite distinct. Go tell me in front of my face that Fox and Falco fight like a feral beastman. Krystal won't give me the thrill of fighting like a wild animal who rends his enemies with his claws or fangs with touches similar of Jon Talbain.
Green Mamba
Member
They made a FMV model of Wolf in Melee that you see for a split-second. Sakurai stated they made Wolf because he was built off of a similar framework as Fox.
EDIT: And holy shit, stop with the Miku garbage.
EDIT: And holy shit, stop with the Miku garbage.
PadWarrior
Member
Gotta love smash hype lol
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