Wow people losing there shit over 2 or 3 frames, come on son it's launch week and the upgrades to iq etc are worth the odd drop here and there at launch, if it's a practise that continues months in then yeah but a few games dropping a few frames here and there worth the trade off for the massive increase in iq for now.
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Watch Dogs 2 PS4 Pro - First Look/Analysis | Digital Foundry
- Thread starter Equanimity
- Start date
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Flawless victory.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
What is the business case for putting not just a bit more effort, but the sizeable more effort to make this and Scorpio sing so to speak? I struggle to see it and I am prepared for cross-gen titles until some more cross gen titles until PS5 is like 1 year old or so (providing Sony does not make PS5 titles forcefully forward compatible for the PS4).
I'm guessing 1-2 fps drops here and there wasn't enough for them to put their foot down, and I'm not sure that was a bad decision. I've played the game for hours and it holds up just fine on the Pro.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Both consoles are being made to play superior versions(theoretically) of current gen games.
I've learned that my perception of performance issues generally does not match the vocal crowd on here either. I mean want every game to run better on the Pro, but I'm not going to balk because minor issues. I expect that most of these early games will get performance patches clear up these minor deficiencies.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
dp
My impression as well. There was a patch yesterday but I dont know if it adressed the performance though. Game looks incredible and plays fine. I was rather impressed with how stable the 30fps are on Pro.
But we need to rise awaraness for this not to be a practice that continues month.
If we are apathetic devs may not bother and they'll ignore the framerate performance on Pro patches.
Why are developers focusing on 4kPR over everything else?
Why not PC-version style ultra settings instead @ 1080p? And why not a base-PS4 mode option?
Been incredibly disappointed with my Pro so far, even with Tomb Raider it isn't the step up I was expecting. I'm sure developers will take better advantage of the power in the future, but only if Pro sells well. And at this rate, it won't be.
Why not PC-version style ultra settings instead @ 1080p? And why not a base-PS4 mode option?
Been incredibly disappointed with my Pro so far, even with Tomb Raider it isn't the step up I was expecting. I'm sure developers will take better advantage of the power in the future, but only if Pro sells well. And at this rate, it won't be.
You can't be reasonable in these discussions. This is about nitpicking to the extreme.
It's obvious that delivering 1800p checkerboard is such a huge improvement that far outweighs some extra occasional small drops that no one will notice about anyway.
And it's unrealistic to expect that developers will spend time and money to rework the code to fix such minor things.
What they can do is to add more options like a full OG PS4 mode or much better a 1080p performance mode in every game.
In that case to each one its own.
This is what we should ask, that those with a 1080p TV should get a performance mode in every case.
But right now a lot of these patches are just rushed to have support ready for launch.
Basically Ubisoft is just running the game at an internal higher res and that's it. Close to zero effort.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I agree that we should be vocal so devs don't become complacent with Pro patches, but let's not overstate the issue. I think that criticism loses impact when it is exaggerated.
The original Watch Dogs DID NOT get a PS4 Pro patch -- he's just thinks there was... there isn't one at all.
Seems like Richard really looked for the tipping point for the analysis.
Having played through the game with the Pro, I never experienced noticable frame drops or screen tearing. Sure, if you start stressing the game like in the DF video, that might occur, but the impression they leave people with is way blown out of proportion. Gameplay is solid and the game looks great.
Overall the image quality is really clean and draw distance impressive. Sad, that HDR is still missing.
Having played through the game with the Pro, I never experienced noticable frame drops or screen tearing. Sure, if you start stressing the game like in the DF video, that might occur, but the impression they leave people with is way blown out of proportion. Gameplay is solid and the game looks great.
Overall the image quality is really clean and draw distance impressive. Sad, that HDR is still missing.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Yep I am gamer that is happy with 30fps for the most part so the increased visual fidelity is well worth it.
It's a few frames when the engine is getting stressed with mass amounts of alpha effects etc, I'd understand if it was constant drops etc people are reporting smooth gameplay.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
You don't need a 4K TV see to enhance visuals. No one is upset about people complaining. Pro games should not be running worse under any circumstances, but I think there is reasonable way to go about voicing your displeasure. And it's not like these games are constantly performing worse.
That is why asking for a 1080p performance mode in every case for those with a fullHD TV is legit.
But thinking that for example a native 4K presentation as in games like Skyrim isn't worth some extra random drops to 27 fps and needs some serious fixing....that is unrealistic if not borderline crazy in my opinion.
Yautja_Warrior
Member
Seems like some developers are doing the usual, push graphics over performance again. Luckily the few games with this performance issues are only smaller 1-5fps dips, so hopefully the can fix it with a new patch, as it feels like some have rushed just to get the Pro mode out on time.
dr guildo
Member
Haha !
Yeah, I'm surprised to see that kind of sentiment in a performance thread. Being disappointed that this isn't performing in line with the base is perfectly understandable and it shouldn't be responded with defensiveness or snark.
Anyway, I hope Ubisoft can eventually find a better balance for image quality and performance over the coming weeks. I'm interested, but I still have a lot on my plate so I won't be playing this day one.
Yes, i agree with this. But it should go for everyone, I don't think it's right to see DF looked to get a bad comparison, cherrypicking comparisons or how a "normal" person will not notice this.
Some of these patches were given no substantial time to be conceived. Dropping resolution would be an immediate and easy fix.
Games with dynamic resolutions have faired a lot better here and first parties.
I'm so happy with the Pro, its excellent and I'm not going to let dropping a few frames tarnish my experiance. Its good the word is getting out, but the fixes are going to be easy to make.
Also Sony should consider adding a compatibility mode to the pro console in the OS to make it run like the OG PS4. I'm sure the mandate of no lower frame rate was supposed to prevent the need for this. But it hasn't worked and Sony just need to accept that there are some people who can't stand frame drops.
Games with dynamic resolutions have faired a lot better here and first parties.
I'm so happy with the Pro, its excellent and I'm not going to let dropping a few frames tarnish my experiance. Its good the word is getting out, but the fixes are going to be easy to make.
Also Sony should consider adding a compatibility mode to the pro console in the OS to make it run like the OG PS4. I'm sure the mandate of no lower frame rate was supposed to prevent the need for this. But it hasn't worked and Sony just need to accept that there are some people who can't stand frame drops.
Risk Breaker
Member
So it's a "stress test", a couple of frames lower and with massively improved IQ, but everyone is losing their shit.
Yes, it sucks, but anyone talking about returning their console or Sony being doomed (or this somehow being Sony's fault) is drinking too much console wars kool-aid.
Yes, it sucks, but anyone talking about returning their console or Sony being doomed (or this somehow being Sony's fault) is drinking too much console wars kool-aid.
As long as they (Ubisoft) fix these issues and keep the 1800p I'll be happy.
In other words, you leave that resolution alone, you hear me Ubisoft... You leave it alone!
You can keep telling yourself that. Those of us who bought a 4K HDR TV and a Pro are having a great time!
texhnolyze
Banned
I think the problem here is that devs tend to push the hardware to its very limit when they're aiming to 'lock' it at 30fps. They could actually lock it at 30fps if they use more reasonable settings with better optimizations. When they set it so the game might fluctuate between 35-50fps uncapped, for example, then they can safely cap it at 30fps and it won't ever drop. But with their current settings and optimization, they should've seen that the game fluctuates between sub 30fps and 50fps. Then they cap it at 30fps, which of course lead to drop to below 30fps. They surely have a testing team (or maybe not?), but they still choose to leave it as it is. However, there's also the time factor so perhaps the devs just really have no choice to release the games/patches. It's already the norm to release unoptimized games these days with day 1 patch as a package. When you think about it, unoptimized Pro patch is not that special.
Just to clarify, for those of us with a PS4 Pro and 1080p TV will this game render at the higher resolution, then downsample that image to appear on a 1080p display (similar to how Uncharted 4 works).
Sorry if this has been answered, I searched through the topic and couldn't find a definitive 'yes/no' on that.
Sorry if this has been answered, I searched through the topic and couldn't find a definitive 'yes/no' on that.
I believe these problems with framerate will be sorted out once developers have spent more time with the platform. If things don't change for the better, Sony should step in and do something. After all, it's their platform. There has to be a way for them to enforce stable performance. Of course the question whether they want to or not is another matter entirely.
Yes, and image quality is stunning on a 1080p TV.
Of course panics and hyperbole is wrong.
But it is indeed very disappointing and I can understand the frustration.
Sony markets the Pro as the console to choose if you want to avoid bad image quality and bad framerate. And at the moment at least, it seems that only half the promise is realized. And it is quite shitty that the console's first showing presents such issues.
I am also one of the guys that believe time will short these things out. But as it is, I would be frustrated as hell myself.
Thanks dude. Looking forward to finishing work and getting started on the game tonight.
Opus Angelorum
Member
It's not unreasonable to expect the frame rate to be at worst the same as the PS4.
SpideySenses
Member
I know it's only a first look but it's disappointing that DF are so focused on the Pro now, if this was released a month ago it would have been how do entirely different platforms perform, now it's how pretty is the prettiest version. I guess that's where their audience is now and priorities will switch back when the Scorpion releases.
Yep, it's effectively a new console launch so with that is going to come some little issues here and there. Devs haven't had time, or reason to dedicate the resources, to making these 100% polished boosts in visuals/performance.
I can say though that this is the game that made my Pro purchase feel worthwhile. On Thursday when I got the thing I had nothing to play on it but a bunch of old titles (I have this year's big holiday shooters on XB1). Game looks stunning, is a lot of fun, and performance wise feels pretty solid to me minus a few small hiccups here and there. I feel like if the normal version was doing this they'd bring it up as being minor, but when the normal version isn't dropping those 1-2 frames it's 'very disappointing'. Maybe I'm just getting old, but unless it's something horrible like Just Cause 3, this stuff is barely noticable in general use. I'd take 1800p and 1-2 fps drops on odd occasions over dropping that res down to clear up the 1-2fps dips, the game looks awesome on my 4k OLED.
Backfoggen
Banned
You would definitely notice it. But I would agree that they shouldn't push resolution to a point where a game runs worse than on standard PS4.
As an OG owner it really sucks. DF are the best source for performance info on consoles; if they continue like this then they won't be. It definitely isn't helping the accusations of Sony bias I've seen in the past.
Patch 1.03 is out and should fix the framerate.
http://thisgengaming.com/2016/11/15/watch-dogs-2-patch-1-03-is-now-live-may-fix-framerate-issues/
http://thisgengaming.com/2016/11/15/watch-dogs-2-patch-1-03-is-now-live-may-fix-framerate-issues/
HazySaiyan
Banned
It is a big deal because people have paid a premium for new hardware and are getting worse performance. That's not nothing, this shouldn't be happening. Period.
And you might not care but I personally notice frame drops, especially below 30, which absolutely affect the experience. Increased IQ isn't worth the trade off a worse running game.
Equanimity
Member
D2 on PS4 Pro has better performance and no screen tearing in comparison to the base model: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ9HGjcrEGs
But both versions suffer from horrible input lag and low FOV, and plethora of other issues.
PS4 Pro specs were leaked by a dev quite some time ago weren't they? Doesn't the Pro share similar APIs with the base model?
Nice. I hope this fixes the screen tearing and small drop in frame-rate in the stress areas.
Backfoggen
Banned
There is nothing implying this fixes frame rates
Always-honest
Banned
Mn, would be great if someone was able to tell exactly what this patch does>
People will be lurking this thread untill they're sure they can piss vinegar again
It's kinda ridiculous that when you look at patch notes via update history on ps4 it says 'go to watchdogs.com for details', then there's nothing there. All other games have notes on patches, shouldn't be a hassle to include a few lines of text of what is fixed/added.