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[PillarEN]

https://www.facebook.com/winningwithwomen/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED

the rally only makes those people double down in many cases it seems. Nit picking at things like trash. Well, it's always baby steps. And the link is an example of people that really don't want to budge or look at a different perspective. The hope is that large acts like the marches/rallies influence those are are teetering or maybe unsure, or are open to a different perspective.

My hope is that the girl in a family that is pro-bigotry and hatred is able to see that there is another outlook that many people will support even if your immediate family doesn't. Cause it can be so hard to break out of the roots ingrained by the closest people to you that they may not even notice. I mean, I have other hopes beyond that, but the feeling of being an outsider or thinking a little differently than your home environment is one that can make one doubt themselves because of their position within their family. This march gives that outsider/different thinker a slimmer of validation to say "I'm not just a weird person who doesn't think like their parents and the rest of my family. There are others who don't feel hatred towards others or those that don't think like them"

 

[Peltz]

Dear white people,

Please shift a little of your focus on fighting the "brown devils" in far-flung countries to helping your brown neighbors who are languishing alongside you.

Sincerely,

Everybody Fucking Else (and moi, a fellow white person)

You do realize that not all white people are a monolithic entity, right? Many of us voted against Trump and even volunteer as advocates on civil rights issues that affect other races.

I do not think women who participated in the march should be criticized for their skin color nor should they be criticized for what 53% of people who voted with the same skin color + gender did on voting day.

 

[Staccat0]

what the fuck does it mean to "stay home and do the work of BE[ing] an ally" mean? tweeting? is that person legitimately arguing that pithy woke tweets are going to do more good than fucking marching?

I kinda hate when we take random nobodies from Twitter and use them as some sort of representative worthy of being messured. That being said, pretty clearly just a person excited to rationalize why they didn't march. Not really worth mentioning honestly.

 

[teruterubozu]

Folks trying to play the blame and shame game is what will help get Trump elected in 2020

Dems have been playing the blame game even before Trump won the election. It goes beyond Trump. We're truly fucked.

 

[besada]

Classic circular firing squad in progress.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

divide and conquer

Basically.

Classic circular firing squad in progress.

This too.

 

[Plum]

When its the majority of the population that's not really generalizing anymore.

53% of those who actually voted isn't even close to a majority. Even if it were (and even if it weren't) you're talking tens of MILLIONS in that other 47%, not some paltry number that doesn't count in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Skellig Gra]

And now we're back to 53% ~= 100% again.

And you are leaving out the 45 million+ that didn't even vote thus not caring enough to help out people less fortunate than them.

 

[LosDaddie]

It's just another shade of the moral absolutism that is leading liberal groups to strangle each other. Agree with every idea they have or you're instantly labeled the enemy.

More like you'll be labeled an "ally"

 

[UCBooties]

This is just the snake eating its own tail. If the aftermath of the election has shown us anything, it is that the tail must be delicious.

We need to be accepting of criticism in good faith. That means we need to have honest introspection when people point out hypocrisy within the movement, but also we need to accept that criticism of a movement's tactics is not implicitly a criticism of the movement's goals. It goes both ways.

We need to pull more people in, encourage empathy, and get the votes we need to turn things around. We need to stop this demand for perfect allies and absolute ideological cohesion. We need to accept good enough and trust that people who are standing with you are doing so in good faith, even if they're views and goals do not align 100% with your own.

 

[Aaronology]

No one is being vilified. It's about learning lessons from your own people to make sure it doesn't happen again. No one is saying you can't march and be an ally.

Disingenuous as hell. This is exactly what is happening.

 

[Cipherr]

So... #NotAllWhiteWomen ?

It's not hard to understand that this sign isn't about the women who were marching, but about the ones who voted for Trump.

No shit, then go hold said sign in some place where those women its aimed at might see it, and reword it while you are at it. But it doesn't belong at the march amongst the people helping us push back against this bullshit.

And minorities getting screwed have every right to be pissed off at them

Yes we do, and we should direct it AT them, and not our fucking allies. This isn't rocket science.

 

[New002]

This isn't the way to go.

 

[Staccat0]

And you are leaving out the 45 million+ that didn't even vote thus not caring enough to help out people less fortunate than them.

Or the people who didn't vote in midterm elections and empowered the tea party and Trumo to crate this world. We can do this all day.

I would love it if anyone could give me some honey with this vinegar. We weren't able to scold America into voting.

 

[GrizzleBoy]

What if we focused our efforts on NOT attacking our allies?

You can't complain of people sitting on the sidelines while fuckery happens, then shit on people who March in the freezing cold because most of their demographic voted in a fucked up way.

As if to say it's one female hillary voters fault trump got In because her sister and aunty voted Trump, therefore she's part of the problem?

That isn't how this works. That is obviously not how this works?

 

[Dash_Riprock]

Ah yes, moral high ground/purity tests. Please go look at the UK right now and see how well this bullshit is working for the Liberals over there.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Disingenuous as hell. This is exactly what is happening.

No it is not. You are refusing to learn and making it be about yourself.

 

[Peltz]

When its the majority of the population that's not really generalizing anymore.

What the hell? Yes it actually is.

Edit: it's not the majority of the population either.

 

[RMI]

Stupid fucking sign and obnoxious tweets.

I don't see how you show up to a women's March with a sign criticizing women. Like wtf.

Obviously women are not a monolithic entity, but this seems misguided.

 

[Chococat]

what a needlessly petty sign to take on a march.

Nah. It has a kernel of truth in it. More white, Latino, Asian, and LBGQT people need to show up at BLM matter marches and protest as well. We all are fighting for many of the same things.

This person with the sign is just so frustrated at the system, they are lashing out. Instead of being angry, we need to take positive steps to help each other.

 

[Cyan]

Here's the other thing.

This is one sign in a huge sea of positivity.

One sign of bad messaging and we'll probably have 5-6 pages of bullshit and anger over it.

The irony is that this woman is wrongly blaming white women that are at a women's march while others blame her, one single black woman, for Trump getting elected.

Heads out of asses people.

Yes, this is also true. Stuff like this always gets unreasonably amplified. On the plus side, we also had a nice 50 page thread on the actual march.

 

[fart town usa]

Yes, let's continue to generalize all white people, men and women, and act as if they are all awful, privileged assholes who have never had to struggle in life and don't oppose Trump or the GOP.

This is the nonsense that caused Hillary to lose and could very likely lead to further losses in 2018.

The Left is eating itself alive right now because so many groups claim to be inclusive but are quick to point the blame at so many other segments of people who genuinely support their cause. It's becoming a joke at this point.
(And yes, I'm sure someone will say I just generalized in the above.)

Hillary lost cause she ran an awful campaign and more people voted for Trump in spite of his hateful rhetoric, not because of it. If Hillary had been campaigning in Wisconsin or Michigan, rather than ARIZONA (LOL) she might have garnered the 50k+ votes that would have won her those two states.

Blame should be squarely placed at the feet of the DNC. It's a shame and an embarrassment that the gate keepers of the democratic party have already let them off the hook.

 

[Griss]

'He will not divide us...'

'...we're going to take care of that ourselves.'

 

[catbird]

WW here who attended the marches.

On one hand... I hope this doesn't lead to more in-fighting from the left.

On the other hand, she isn't wrong. A lot of white women are protected by white privilege and aren't personally affected by issues other women face. That interview with coal mining families who will lose their insurance under Trump? Where they thought, "Oh I didn't think he would really take it from **us**." The status quo works for them. That's how some women think. That's how you have women who oppose abortion except when they or a friend need it, for example. "It's wrong until it effects me."

Another observation: I attended the march in Philly, a black city. Most of the faces were white. Why was that? Maybe there's something we need to talk about... (and people have been talking about).

Also: Most of the signs at the marches are meme'd, packaged into bit size chunks, and are meant to grab your attention. So this sign was effective.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

No it is not. You are refusing to learn and making it be about yourself.

"You're going to take those generalizations and insults and you're going to like them if you want to stay in the circle."

If you expect people to take abuse from their supposed allies while putting their whole hearts into defending them, you've got another thing coming.

 

[poppedcollar69]

I'm becoming more and more convinced this is a toxic mentality, of which I've been guilty of before.

Thank you

 

[Trojita]

The thing is you are going to get at least one person of a thousand at a protest that has a dumb sign or a divisive idea.

 

[Adaren]

And you are leaving out the 45 million+ that didn't even vote thus not caring enough to help out people less fortunate than them.

I don't really know how to respond to this, so I'll just restate facts. Yes, some white women voted for Trump. Yes, some white women didn't vote. Yes (shockingly), some white women voted for Clinton.

And yes, blaming white women in general for the actions of 53% of white women voters is a textbook case of generalizing.

If we can agree on that, then I think we agree on everything. I concur that people who chose not to vote are a big problem.

 

[Dash_Riprock]

So nice to see that Trump has already divided us less than a week into his presidency.

Way to go, libs.

 

[Dude Abides]

Perhaps Torraine Walker should march to the mirror and ask himself why so many black men decided not to vote.

Or no, that would be dumb, because he can't be held to account for the actions of people he had nothing to do with.

 

[ZackieChan]

On one hand I doubt that very many women that were marching voted for trump and then turned around to be part of a march protesting his values and actions. But I also would say that 53% of a population is more than "a few".

The most important thing now is to make sure that people who were complacent on these issues in 2016 for whatever reason becomes more willing to show up in the upcoming elections. And taking the opportunity to educate the (few) Trump supporters who might be able to see the light if pushed enough. White women who cannot stand for this are going to need to roll up their sleeves to help with targeting these people whose minds can be changed, just as its valuable to have white or straight allies helping to educate their personal peers on issues of race or LGBT.

I know a great way to make sure this doesn't happen - do shit like the OP

 

[ElTorro]

From a German perspective, this obsession with groups and identities is really sureal and borderline scary to me. People are individuals first. There is no need to specifically address "white women" when your goal is to convince people that Trump is a bad president. Just call out people who voted for Trump.

 

[HammerOfThor]

53% of the white women who actually came out and voted which was definitely nowhere near 100% of the population of white women. So that 53% is smaller than saying "53% of white women". Its a ridiculous statement to make. Its also a great way to attack your allies over something like this. Its like saying all the white women there voted for Trump. C'mon now.

 

[Cipherr]

Perhaps Torraine Walker should march to the mirror and ask himself why so many black men decided not to vote.

Or no, that would be dumb, because he can't be held to account for the actions of people he had nothing to do with.

Thank you.. I mean Jesus. It's annoying that people can't see how misguided this shit is. We are all angry, but come the fuck on. The rush to fire at allies is just ridiculous.

African Americans didn't have 100% turnout either, I would just as quickly designate someone claiming that I need to "go to the mirror before protesting Trump" to the bushes. That shit is just dumb.

 

[Trojita]

Another observation: I attended the march in Philly, a black city. Most of the faces were white. Why was that? Maybe there's something we need to talk about... (and people have been talking about).

What?

The racial makeup of Philadelphia as of 2014 was:

45.3% White
44.1% Black
7.2% Asian
2.3% from other races
2.4% Mixed Race
0.8% Native American
13.6% of the population were Hispanic and Latino.
(Source: US Census Bureau)

I mean I definitely agree that there should have been more PoC if from what you said there weren't, but I'm not sure where you got your demographics from.

 

[sans_pants]

surely the best way to win people over to your side is to generalize their beliefs and demean them

 

[xxracerxx]

So nice to see that Trump has already divided us less than a week into his presidency.

Way to go, libs.

Nah.

 

[Enzom21]

I know a great way to make sure this doesn't happen - do shit like the OP

So one person holding a sign will make you stop supporting all minorities? Interesting.

 

[Derwind]

53% of white women who voted in the last election isn't a generalization it's a fact.

lol at "Welp 8 more years of trump" comments because of that sign. Calm the fuck down and do some much needed introspection.

Introspection is not going to happen, I wouldn't hold my breath.

Black people need to be responsible for their community, muslim people for theirs....ect

White people? Nah uh, that other white person has nothing to do with me.

 

[Syncytia]

I'm a white straight cis male. I voted for Hillary.

I wish I could have gone to the march here, but I had to work (no "bitch, it's Saturday for me...).

I don't know what to say except I guess that makes me a Trump supporter by virtue of my gender/ethnicity/sexuality because the majority of the demographic I belong to voted Trump? And living in a red state... does that make it worse?

 

[Aaronology]

No it is not. You are refusing to learn and making it be about yourself.

Stop making assumptions about posters just because you can't immediately identify their ethnicity, please.

 

[BotoxAgent]

all my white friends voted Hillary, yas!

 

[TM94]

Genuinely amazing that Trump won the presidency and people still don't get this type of put-down mentality contributed significantly.

 

[Staccat0]

Introspection is not going to happen, I wouldn't hold my breath.

Black people need to be responsible for their community, muslim people for theirs....ect

White people? Nah uh, that other white person has nothing to do with me.

Why are we using the standards of racists to define how we talk about race?

 

[Skatterd]

Just remember that this is how Trump reacted to these marches

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-abortion-men_us_5886369be4b0e3a7356a7910

Keep active.

 

[azyless]

That tweet is pretty obnoxious. I'm gonna take a wild guess and say that the majority of women at these protests weren't Trump voters.
I don't know what "looking in the mirror" is supposed to fix either.

 

[Eumi]

That sign's not too bad. It's pointing out that, out of the larger group the protest is for, a subset of that group did in fact vote against what the protest is for. It's a reminder that not all women are allies here.

Those tweets and that mentality on the other hand is downright toxic. It's an attack on people who are your allies. Unless you can provide some kind of proof that the white wonen marching voted trump it's just a baseless accusation, or more accurately, an accusation based solely on race and ignoring the actual actions of the people.

White Women, as with white people in general, do need to change, but this isn't helping. This is an attack specifically aimed at the people trying to help and do good.

Well, the tweets are. Again, I think the sign is fine.

 

[cackhyena]

Introspection is not going to happen, I wouldn't hold my breath.

Black people need to be responsible for their community, muslim people for theirs....ect

White people? Nah uh, that other white person has nothing to do with me.

I'm waiting for the irony of your own post to hit you.

 

[FuuRe]

From a German perspective, this obsession with groups and identities is really sureal and borderline scary to me. People are individuals first. There is no need to specifically address "white women" when your goal is to convince people that Trump is a bad president. Just call out people who voted for Trump.

This a thousand times, from the outside (not america) really all the validation of segregation in either way only looks classist, elitist, and even racist.

 

[Hypemaster]

We need some code language. Cause just pointing out shit is just going anger people that are not use to it.

Yup, they can't handle the bluntness.