plagiarize
Banned
real world use? pinning a FAQ to the side of the screen. I was using a faq on Monday to find the hidden tingle statues in Wind Waker HD. if I could have pinned the directions up next to the game on my TV, I probably would have.
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Xboxone Resolutiongate (Eurogamer)
- Thread starter madmackem
- Start date
real world use? pinning a FAQ to the side of the screen. I was using a faq on Monday to find the hidden tingle statues in Wind Waker HD. if I could have pinned the directions up next to the game on my TV, I probably would have.
well in fairness...it can...if thats an actual design choice...however the situations at hand (BF4 and CoD) are not that type of situations....in these cases the games have the same assets and effects...just one is a much lower res for performance reasons...
Thanks to the power of the new Kinect®, you can control your games even if they have complex inputs, by shaking your heading / blinking / pulling your tongue out, and more.
This allows you to concurrently type with our $100M Xbox One® controller to research walkthroughs and tutorials online with Bing®.
It is to me the biggest mystery behind everything. Exactly why did they ever try to wade into the system power wars? There was no way they were ever going to win that fight, strategically early on they said they "purposefully didn't target the highest end specs." Now, neither did PS4, but everyone knows PR does not say things such as that unless it means your system is not as powerful as the competition. That's why instead of saying that, Sony keeps saying "the most powerful games console ever created."
Microsoft literally put their own heads in the noose, and I have no idea why.
wapplew
Member
To make fans believe? Work pretty well for them. It's about showing confidence on your own product. Being 100 dollar more and weaker is killer blow, they trying to do everything to convince(lie) even some of the fans.
Many still believe secret source, NDA on November 12, 720p is better all that shit.
Tell the same lie 1000 times it become the truth.
Yeah, but that's exactly what did not happen. Now it just blew up in their face and the fallout is even worse. Because most people suspected PS4 was more powerful already, but this is actually a massive difference.
A smart company would have ignored the power wars, let the systems speak for themselves, and talk about their emphasis on things like Kinect and the enhanced multimedia capabilities.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I always find this stance to be rather funny. They're blasting people on Internet message boards who obviously care about the resolution difference, and at the same time telling the average Joes out there that they are too unrefined or just plain stupid to perceive the difference.
I really don't know who they are trying to appeal to with such articles.
wapplew
Member
That's the thing, I don't think they can actually show their pros at the moment.
All those feature with Kinect is OS stuff, and OS is still in crunch mode, they can't live demo it (yet?), all they can do is show mock up and talk.
That All in one voice control multitasking multimedia hub dream is quite compelling if it work as advertise.
But if anything of that dream just like another SIRI gimmick that only work on advertise, they'll be doom.
They really can't risk to show it, at least not in its final form.
They do talk about games, and the only game that feel next gen for them is Ryse
Maybe Forza5 with 1080p@60fps. They pimp Titanfall so hard, but that game also look like current gen(graphics wise). With multiplat games all in 720p form, they better stop showing. Indy is absent until 2014. There are really nothing much they can talk about...
So put yourself in their shoe, what can you do? Stop wasting time to convince PS4 camp and start doing anything to keep your fan base jump ship. Keep their believer hopes up, gonna stop those pre order cancel.
Did the Gamecube have a DVD drive? Did people hold off buying a Dreamcast so they could go buy a Gamecube (hype for the PS2 was crazy). Please stop trying to spin reality so it fits your agenda.
bigboss370
Member
Like Nintendo did with the Wii. You should play to your strengths. Microsoft's messaging has been just awful this year.
bigboss370
Member
FranXico
Member
Good article, and I hope people refer to it when calling out certain reporters.
The only problem is that some members of the press did nothing to resist that urge when it was Microsoft who had the upper hand, unlike now...
A smart company doesnt craft the entire marketing message of their product based on whether the "hardcore" audience will believe their message. Its the most powerful console MS has ever made. The fact that Sony built a competing console that's more powerful doesn't mean they shouldn't market their own product as a nextgen experience. Thankfully GAF isn't in charge of their marketing. Sheesh, the ignorance here is laughable sometimes. Of the potential 200+ Million console players, how many are pixel counters? Why does there message to the people who don't see a noticeable difference between upscaled resolution on the same game with the same features have to be tailored not to offend those who do see a difference? Essentially, why are you so important to MS.
They never hid their specs from anyone.
wapplew
Member
I think the press need the war more than we do. tight race get a lot more attention,
I'm sure they don't want any party to lose before the race begin.
NullPointer
Member
I think they wanted to do exactly this, but were forced to change their messaging after the reveal and always-online fiascos. They shifted towards placating the hardcore with one failed message after another. And then of course Prism took a steaming shit on top of their warm and fuzzy family friendly Kinect ambitions.
MS probably wishes that we all saw the bone as a multimedia device focused on Kinect, but that won't put a $500 box into people's homes this holiday so they've had to start stretching things, obfuscating, delaying and embargo'ing while hoping for the best.
Maybe once you've run out of good options the least-worst option available is to hunker down and hope your opponent self destructs.
They never hid their specs? All we had were spec "leaks" for months until very recently. And when their managers are specifically saying things like "we invented DirectX" and "there's no way we would give up a 30% advantage to Sony", it sounds like Microsoft are the ones dragging Sony into their fight while Sony is simply saying "the most powerful game console ever created".
FranXico
Member
Not sure if entirely related to this thread, but in the Digiexpo, Finland thread, user Melchiah appears to have noticed the effect of crushing blacks in a XB1 demo station:
Has Microsoft told the press anything about the Full RGB issues in the XB1? I mean, surely reviewers should be aware of this until the OS is patched...
Melchiah said:
Has Microsoft told the press anything about the Full RGB issues in the XB1? I mean, surely reviewers should be aware of this until the OS is patched...
Should that somehow change a game's review because a patch may be coming to fix a graphical issue? I guess it should, but that's not how game reviews work. If you fix your game or your system OS later after the game is released, it's too late, reviews are in.
So your impatience means they hid it? They fucking presented at a hot chips conference with every complete detail you'd need to assess the baseline performance of their machine,beyond some functionality of dedicated custom hardware.
Trying to appeal of somebodys opinion is cheap - from a writers standpoint.
If you are writing for single platform site, you can do this and tell everybody how bad the other platform is - but that's not want you want to do unless you are a real fanboy.
If you are with a multiplatform mag or site, you want to give the weaker side a voice.
That's one of the basic motivations of journalists, no matter if you call the writers for gaming sites so.
Leadbetter did this with his XboxOne engineers interview.
You can call this also cheap, because controversial opinions give you clicks, but I don't think that this is the point.
At least they got that story (nobody else did). And you always have to make sacrifices to get one.
IMO it's okay to give them (MS) the benefit of a doubt and let them tell their story when the hardware isn't even out. Leadbetter had a escape plan, as he made sure, that he will discuss it later on when more data (or the hardware itself) is available.
Sure Tech-GAF and everybody knew that the PS4 was more capable. But a story that questions the "known truth" is always interesting.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
They are downplaying it cause most of the consoles money comes from casual gamers and imo they wont care or see much of a diff in the end anyway. Thats what the people in here don't get. I don't think those articles are intended for the more hardcore crowds in the forums.
Of course having the option for both, we want the higher rez. But not having it still isnt gonna stop me from buying a One as well. Its disappointing, but ill also quickly get over it as i buy my multiplaform games on ps4 instead.
Maybe because higher resolution does not make a good game. Maybe because the most powerful console has never won a console race. Maybe because gamers have always said "it's about the games dummy."
Iwata stated that one game can turn the tides. Each manufacturer is desperately searching for that game because in the end, that's always what consoles are remembered for.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
1280 x 720 = 921600
1920 x 1080 = 2073600
Should have said more then double.
It gets confusing as 720 and 1080 are only half the equation.
Uno Venova
Banned
I can't tell if your mocking the poor arguments used in power debates or actually using them.
Pristine_Condition
Member
I totally expect this to be the next genius marketing bullet-point from Microsoft:
"Enjoy the hip "retro" look of Minecraft...in all your games! Only on XBox One!"
people aren't dumb. they can see a difference even if they don't know how to describe it technically. for example, i often hear people say that call of duty just feels better than other shooters. that's it's smoother and they like that a lot. that's the difference between 60fps and 30fps.
1080p will always look better than 720p to anyone who isn't half-blind. you don't have to be a "pixel-counter" to distinguish better from worse.
this discrepancy is very important to microsoft in that they need to downplay it as much as they can because people are not dumb. it's no one's fault that they've done a shit job of launching their console and their console's message from the get-go. The only card they have left is to obfuscate, cross their fingers and come up with a plan B.
I understand you're still spinning your wheels trying desperately to find some way to excuse your company of choice's behavior, but literally every single point of yours in this post is nonsense. Every single one. Usually a single point may be wrong, or someone is just misguided here and there. For you? Every single point is absurd.
Where to even fucking begin. Christ. I'll have to number your "points" because they're each more entertaining than the last and I think they all deserve special attention.
1. As has been said, a "smart" company plays to their strengths, not their weaknesses. Sony has won the power war. It's not up for dispute. And they won it at a $100 cheaper price (no one cares about Kinect until they justify it with actual compelling games; quaint conveniences != +$100, and you can control PS4's UI with your voice using the included headset). Every developer who has gone on record has said the PS4 is easier to develop for, has significantly more power, has way more mature tools.
Microsoft's STRENGTHS when they were designing their "all-in-one-entertainment" device was a system designed around multimedia capabilities and Kinect. That they seem so woefully unprepared to even have a compelling argument to support Kinect until next year (first flagship is coming Spring 2014) is a problem that should never have happened. A company in their position would have recognized their core goals, utilized those strengths to put distance between them and the competition and settled on a path that took them away from revealing just how inferior their system tech was. Instead, they attempted to face the problem head on by posting many articles trying to diminish the PS4's power whilst trying to exaggerate the benefits of XBO's. I'll cover this more in another point, since you actually believe Microsoft misled nobody.
2. Technically, if Microsoft would have released a system exactly as powerful as the Wii U it would have been the "most powerful console they have ever made." This is the most ridiculous non-statement ever in history. It says literally less than nothing about the system you're trying to defend. Try harder so I can be better entertained.
3. "Next-gen" does not only mean power. They could market their machine as a true next-gen machine without wading into territory they're only going to lose at (as they have endlessly since they revealed the XBO, whether your desperate fanaticism allows you to admit it or not).
4. So far, if GAF was in charge of their marketing and planning we would have saved them from a.) their embarrassing original XBO vision and the 180s after b.) their attempts to try to enter a PS4 tech war, which has led to yet more embarrassing news for them c.) resolutiongate, since we would have told Microsoft to get out ahead of it ages ago. And before you say 'b-b-but GAF hardcore blah blah fucking blah', please realize that the reason Microsoft changed was because they had abysmal pre-order numbers while Sony's were skyrocketing. Please understand that it remains the case that Sony is dominating in pre-order numbers, launch allotment, consumer interest, online auctions and much more purely BECAUSE of their horrible decisions that much of GAF would have helped them avoid. And don't even get me started in Europe. XBO is getting fucking thrashed in early indications.
But please, go on. Bubbles are cool. Live in your bubble bro.
5. You don't need to be a pixel counter to notice the difference between 720p and 1080p. You need to simply not be blind. That said, the point is not 'pixel counting.' The point is a real world illustration of the massive gulf in power. And, it must be said, the resolution was only part of the differences... in Battlefield 4, plenty of other features are different as well, all of them advantage PS4. So not only is it outputting a massive resolution gap, but it's doing it at a more consistent framerate and with more impressive effects overall. There is absolutely no way to underplay it without being obscene.
6. As has been said a million times, word-of-mouth is the #1 thing that sells people on gaming products. Word-of-mouth always starts within the hardcore gaming fans and spreads out to their family and other casuals. If Hardcore gamers begin to lament at mass that the PS4 gaming experience is simply superior on a technical level, that is going to leak out - even if those people couldn't themselves tell the difference. They will remember that their friends said it was 'worse' for one reason or another, and they will look at the sticker price, and they'll put two and two together. it doesn't take rocket science. Once again, PS4 is absolutely dominating in the word-of-mouth game. That's why it is important for Microsoft to tailor their message so as not to try to deceive or focus on their weaknesses for their primary message deliverers. We are the ones who spread out and inform.
7. I am not important to MS; millions upon millions of gamers, however, are. We spend the most average money on their products, we raise the biggest stink, we are the ones who made them even moderately successful in the first place. Without our blessing, things are simply that much harder for Microsoft. Without our approval, we go out and tell those who aren't tuned in that it's not worth it. Now it's true it's possible to do it without us, but you're increasing the odds of failure exponentially and for no reason. Since they have an alternative message that is viable and plays to their actual strengths.
8. No, they only intentionally tried to deceive hardcore gamers as to what those specs could actually do and what PS4's specs could actually do so that people who are actually ignorant about technology could be fooled into thinking the gap was tiny or insignificant. It was a lie, everyone knows it was a lie, and even Leadbetter has now had to come out and damage control for letting Microsoft's architect folks pretty much post articles filled with FUD. To deny this is simply to deny facts. Up to you.
HORRORSHØW
Member
I'm saying that resolutiongate is rubbish... It's a red herring and the gaffers are falling for it hook, line, and sinker.
Resolution is not the be all end all measurement that tells me if I'll like the game. It's good for telling us the PS4 is more powerful. Fine, I accept that. Now show me why I'd want to buy them.
All other things being equal,night that kind of implied?
Let me begin by making this clear, this rant is not a reflection on the individual consoles or companies producing them, rather the press which is supposed to be presenting unbiased information to the man on the street. i.e. you and me.
It's the exact opposite of unbiased though. Unbiased would be to report on the facts as they are, and not show favouritism by downplaying or exaggerating strengths and weaknesses.
What the media in general (not all) is doing is to try to make the xbox disadvantages look inconsequential, when they are clearly not. You can bet they'll be praising any perceived advantages over the coming weeks though, even if 99% of people would never use those particular features.
Has this behaviour really gone widely unnoticed since MS entered the console arena? Look at the current launch line ups, and the history behind some of the franchises. Even if the original games were rubbish the sequel is somehow the next mega hit, even before people have had a chance to hold a controller in their hand?
How many times have we seen strange review scores on titles, where the general consensus is its a gem of a game and technically brilliant, but then some subjective comment is uttered and the mark lowered (or sometimes raised) substantially. Of course no-one can argue on facts, as it's a subjective view. Who knows if it's genuine or a clever way of getting the desired result?
It's similar to the way Apple products are championed on the internet, and it works because word of mouth spreads like wildfire particularly amongst non techie people and most end up believing they invented the tech, not copied/bought and refined. A lot of the time it's inferior to other products but it's almost impossible to beat their marketing.
Hopefully with enough backlash, and with people being called out now so publicly on sites like GAF etc. things may just improve a little in future, and we get real, unbiased, and relevant articles which allow us to make informed decisions. How many people need to waste their money buying into products which are not what they thought they were in the meantime?
I get the point of the article, but the author doesn't really support the claim that he knows more than other popular sites in regards to the question of 1080p versus 720p. I am not a tech guru myself, but even I know that changing resolution doesn't result in blurrier textures (especially when the same assets are used, as is the case in cod ghosts on ps4 and xbone), as stated in the article, but rather a blurrier image overall. Again, I believe there is a major gulf between 1080p and 720p, I just hate it when people flock to bad articles like this because they support a statement or two that the authors make.
Last gen Sony had the more expensive console which had the worse versions of games and still ended up out selling them.
This gen Sony has the cheaper machine which has the much better versions of games.
Doesn't look good for MS.
a red herring? what is this red herring leading us away from?
The resolution debacle proves it's point. PS4 is more powerful and the performance of these games proves it. There is no red herring distracting us from some other more important conclusion. It's case and point.
No one was ever arguing that resolution makes games more fun or entertaining. This is a discussion about performance. Pure and simple. PS4 = better performing multi-plats. End of story.
No. I don't see anyone discussing the merits of features and factors outside resolution. So if I'm playing COD on Xbox one at upscaled 1080p or native 1080p on PS4, the game functions exactly the same. So what else should I consider?
Downloadable content
multiplayer options
Dedicated servers
...all of those are publisher controlled
Then console specific there are...
Voice controls
Controllers
Speed of launching game
Etc.
The point being that there are many more things worth considering than native resolution. Native resolution in itself does not make a game enjoyable.
Uno Venova
Banned
Seems like odd points to bring up in resolution focused threads.
Hook a Wii up to a 60" 1080p TV. Let us know how you still feel about resolution having zero effect on enjoy-ability.
Wrong. It's a discussion about power. Power does not equal performance.
NullPointer
Member
You're absolutely right.
Its one quality among several that can make one version of the game stand out as best for a particular person. For some people, resolution is one of the more important qualities they're looking for.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Imagine if either the PS3 or the 360 came out and a majority of the launch titles ran at 480p or 600p, and writers came out in droves to explain that the masses don't really understand what "HD" means or that they all just watch DVDs and stretched SD cable signals without being able to tell so it doesn't matter. Besides, 600p is nearly indistinguishable from 720p to your Average Joe, so I'd rather they do that and keep the framerate higher. Also, games are all about fun, so who cares, and weaker consoles historically sell more so you can't criticize it for being weaker!
Wait, is this an imaginary scenario or the GCNGB on IGN circa early 2006
Wait, is this an imaginary scenario or the GCNGB on IGN circa early 2006
I've been asking this question for about a week now and I'm still yet to get an answer as to whether 480p standard definition games at launch or otherwise would have been acceptable for PS3 / 360.
100 million plus sales and the current Gen console crown says that it didn't seem to matter much. Consumers had a lot of fun at 480i with RCA inputs.
i disagree completely and would have you prove otherwise (if you can, without mental gymnastics, please). for my amusement, of course.
Night Angel
Member
Except when it does. Like now, for instance.
Or maybe a Honda Civic IS better than a GTR.
The Wii is not a good analog for the XB1 for several reasons that have already been pointed out. Disingenuous.
RedAssedApe
Banned
Why would we discuss those things here though? These threads have been about trying to figure out the how big of a graphical difference there is going to be between multi-platform games. Some of us aren't even interested in buying these games being compared for ANY console.
Journalists were screaming for a Wii HD so they wouldn't have to look at 480p upscaled games on their HDTVs.