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Star Wars Mafia |OT| A Wretched Hive of Scum and Villainy
- Thread starter MattyG
- Start date
Zippedpinhead
Member
Go back to day 1 mentalities? That essentially says that we have learned nothing and need to just guess again, I don't buy that one second. Normally trying to persuade us to discount active and recent events to refocus our perspective is a Hutt tactic to throw us off an existing vote. If your record for interest and insight wasn't so good, I would be voting for you.
Thoughts: barrylocke, he was been a bandwagon follower on day 1, has been largely absent until today (as much as I have at least). I'm not sure where leader barrylocke went, hopefully he is back...
I'm voting setre, I have been thinking on his story since the start of this day and I just don't buy it anymore
vote= Setre
Oh and Matt attack - really just a regular rebel. Your gut is wrong. But if you do detain me, at least I'm not a power role.
Thoughts: barrylocke, he was been a bandwagon follower on day 1, has been largely absent until today (as much as I have at least). I'm not sure where leader barrylocke went, hopefully he is back...
I'm voting setre, I have been thinking on his story since the start of this day and I just don't buy it anymore
vote= Setre
Oh and Matt attack - really just a regular rebel. Your gut is wrong. But if you do detain me, at least I'm not a power role.
Barrylocke
Member
Did Setre ever say why he detected who he did? Keep im mind that he apperently thought he was investigated suspicious people as a cop.
Zippedpinhead
Member
More clarification, it mainly comes down to "why eJawa?" He really didn't lead the conversation yesterday, he has been active but not too active, and it would have made more sense to confirm someone like quantumbro who said he had a job that had a night activity and couldn't easily be confirmed.
My gut says that a person with a reasonable power role will try to confirm highly active players first (your palmers, czartims, terrabytes, and worthys before heading off into semi active players. The only person who acted and "said" that last game turned out to be mafia, in a classic blunder. Took another Maria's job, changed some actions to throw off mafia suspicion, and then got caught eventually when other powers confirmed his "throw offs" didn't occur.
If I'm wrong detain me tomorrow, at least then we don't make another town power role detain.
My gut says that a person with a reasonable power role will try to confirm highly active players first (your palmers, czartims, terrabytes, and worthys before heading off into semi active players. The only person who acted and "said" that last game turned out to be mafia, in a classic blunder. Took another Maria's job, changed some actions to throw off mafia suspicion, and then got caught eventually when other powers confirmed his "throw offs" didn't occur.
If I'm wrong detain me tomorrow, at least then we don't make another town power role detain.
Barrylocke
Member
Doesn't setre lying about his role seem like an easy backfire? If palmer or ejawa were a benevolent person with a role (doctor for instance), that could blow up in his face fast.
How was my ejawa vote a bandwagon?
The last sentence doesn't sit with me well at all. Why would you take the chance of dying?
Zippedpinhead
Member
I was referring to your vote on me day 1, I actually like your vote for eJawa, he is just as suspicious as anyone else at the moment.
I meant in the sense of voting for who you feel is posting suspiciously, not randomly. Last game town had a really bad habit of always voting the easy target, and it took 8 days to lynch a scum. Easy targets give mafia a risk free vote. If mafia is playing well, it won't feel easy. Obviously they don't always play well, but it's worth keeping in mind.
I do think Setre as scum is a real possibility. I do not think he is lying about having the role though (or if he is it's a RNH scenario.) The only reason I am not voting for him today is it will be easier to catch him in a lie as time goes on, and catching him in a lie gives us more potential data to dissect in terms of he chose at night. Also if we are wrong we are risking another town power role, which we're running low on. That's why I am more interested in the posters flying under the radar with filler content.
Zippedpinhead
Member
Because unlike exmachina and blarg' death mine won't hurt the town. Its not as good as a "no detain" vote (you do lose another town vote), but it's better than a power role imploding.
Again I'm part of the rebel alliance, and the filthy hutt's want to distract you with my lack of posts.
Zippedpinhead
Member
Alright,
unvote=setre
Don't make me regret this setre, use your power wisely tonight...
unvote=setre
Don't make me regret this setre, use your power wisely tonight...
Matt Attack
Member
From my perspective, every mislynch does hurt the town- even if you're an Ordinary Rebel like you claim. You are right in that it's usually worse to detain a town power role, but we probably shouldn't downplay any rebel detainment.
johnnyquicknives
Member
I'm pretty sure that yesterday it was suggested that setre watch eJawa (amongst some other mid-activity players) because at the time we thought he was a cop (not tracker) and we thought we could semi-confirm Quantum (at least his power if not his alignment) by getting someone to confirm a shield/gun was recieved. Basically things that made sense yesterday but were all messed up this morning when Setre realised his actual role and Quantum got robbed.
I pretty much believe Palmer just now, I'm not convinced he's told us the whole truth but I think it's less likely that he will be able to damage us outright (ie. with a night kill). So for now I think we leave him alive and remain wary of his arguments.
So back to my previous post.
raindoc - his outbursts were very reminiscent of egruntz and actually made me trust him a little more. I'm still a bit concerned because I generally find I disagree with him, but right now he's skewing more town than some others for me.
Like I said Oceanic has improved a bit, I'd probably leave him and MattAttack today.
That leaves eJawa and Makai.
I think right now I'm inclined to
VOTE: Makai
- he built up a high post count on day one, but really didn't say a whole lot in them.
- his posts are generally fairly short and non-specific
- posts more often when theres the opportunity to post either: more generally (day 1), about something very specific/narrow (Quantums role) or to play squares against Blarg.
I pretty much believe Palmer just now, I'm not convinced he's told us the whole truth but I think it's less likely that he will be able to damage us outright (ie. with a night kill). So for now I think we leave him alive and remain wary of his arguments.
So back to my previous post.
raindoc - his outbursts were very reminiscent of egruntz and actually made me trust him a little more. I'm still a bit concerned because I generally find I disagree with him, but right now he's skewing more town than some others for me.
Like I said Oceanic has improved a bit, I'd probably leave him and MattAttack today.
That leaves eJawa and Makai.
I think right now I'm inclined to
VOTE: Makai
- he built up a high post count on day one, but really didn't say a whole lot in them.
- his posts are generally fairly short and non-specific
- posts more often when theres the opportunity to post either: more generally (day 1), about something very specific/narrow (Quantums role) or to play squares against Blarg.
I can't speak for him, but if I was in his place, investigating someone who helped detain 2 power roles, while being a middling poster at best, is a good place to start. For now I choose to believe him.
Setre
Member
I got a few more follow up PMs after that one.
Suspicious activity means there was a night action performed. No suspicious activity means there wasn't. It will also report suspicious activity done to the target but it's still under "Suspicious Activity".
Yep, I thought I was the cop. I chose Palmer Night 1 because he kept going back and forth on voting on people. He started off not wanting to detain anyone, like me, and then began rapidly voting for different people, myself included. I thought it was suspicious and I admit I was a bit peeved he voted for me so if I found out he was a Hutt and I could be all smug about it.
Went for eJawa the second night because he was one of the people suggested I go after. I also looked back through his post history and he had voted for everyone who'd been detained. He was posting but not a lot and seemed to be flying under the radar.
I was admittedly much more confident about Setre's allegiance when we purportedly had two cops and two armorers, but Im sticking with him because most of you relented way too easily. I am not going to be fooled by anyone claiming "it's my first game." This is my first game as well - I read Day 1 of Animal Crossing and played a few rounds of Town of Salem to prepare. Cop -> Tracker -> Motion Detector is a huge difference and I don't think I would have made that mistake if I got that role. The wiki page on roles is pretty easy to follow: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Category:Roles_Main_Page
I do not trust anyone who role-claimed this early and Setre role-claimed for no good reason. Seems like an insane tactic for a rebel to claim a power role when Hutts can target him at night. I hope one of you is some sort of Bomb role.
I do not trust anyone who role-claimed this early and Setre role-claimed for no good reason. Seems like an insane tactic for a rebel to claim a power role when Hutts can target him at night. I hope one of you is some sort of Bomb role.
AbsolutBro
Member
I've been rereading the thread and my brain just won't let me get past this.
Quantumbro: what did you see that made you change your mind about Blargonaut?
I know Blargo was one of us. I know it doesn't change anything. I'm rereading the thread (again and still) and that just bothers my brain that I can't figure out his puzzle. I don't know that I can wait for the whole thing to be over to ask him! D:
Quantumbro: what did you see that made you change your mind about Blargonaut?
I know Blargo was one of us. I know it doesn't change anything. I'm rereading the thread (again and still) and that just bothers my brain that I can't figure out his puzzle. I don't know that I can wait for the whole thing to be over to ask him! D:
Seriously, that whole straw thing just left me confused. Everything about it... I dunno.
Barrylocke
Member
Which is why I frankly ignored the majority of the blargonauts posts, and one of the reasons why it took me so long to get started with this day. I knew that most of the talking points of the day would have sprung off of blargs Shenanigans yesterday. And frankly my mind just blanks out when I read those posts for too long.
AbsolutBro
Member
Looking at voting patterns from day 2 is really hard because of the whole Blargonaut thing. I mean, we had basically the same issue with Exmac on day 1, but to a much smaller degree since the presence of Imperial Agents hadn't been revealed by swamped's death yet.
Plenty of people piled onto Blargonaut, some unvoted with no real explanation. Palmer was all over the fucking map on votes, voting for like 6 people over the course of the day.
Making it a little hard to suss out patterns to compare with the votes so far today.
Plenty of people piled onto Blargonaut, some unvoted with no real explanation. Palmer was all over the fucking map on votes, voting for like 6 people over the course of the day.
Making it a little hard to suss out patterns to compare with the votes so far today.
Sorry, I've been voting for people to prod them into action, generally. I haven't gotten a strong Hutt feeling from anyone, unfortunately. Looking back, Makai playing that game with Blarg strikes me the most. It was only in the Hutt's interest to play along with that to see what he'd say.
QuantumBro
Banned
Unvote: Palmer_v1
I could've sworn I did this before, but apparently not.
Also, since the day is almost over, should I give away a gun or a shield during the night? Just keep in mind, I'm probably going to be dead in the morning.
Well I never voted for him in the first place, I wanted to figure out his whole puzzle first, which I never did end up doing, so I'm waiting for his explanation too.
This was basically how I was during that last part of day 2:
I could've sworn I did this before, but apparently not.
Also, since the day is almost over, should I give away a gun or a shield during the night? Just keep in mind, I'm probably going to be dead in the morning.
Well I never voted for him in the first place, I wanted to figure out his whole puzzle first, which I never did end up doing, so I'm waiting for his explanation too.
This was basically how I was during that last part of day 2:
I knew dueling would draw attention to myself but I am competitive and its hard for me to resist a 1v1 challenge. I was confident I would win because a 3x4 table favors player 2 and I had studied the tactics. It also promised to give us information on the most bizarre (suspicious) player in the game. Regardless of its authenticity, his claim would give us a lot to work with in determining his allegiance. I was expecting him to claim some sort of benevolent third party role like Palmer did. I had no idea that he would claim Undercover Imperial or that he was actually a cop. Probably nobody else did, either. For a little bit, we all believed I had miraculously rooted out a Hutt. I won 8-4 and it was damn fun. 8)
- You randomly callout people in the hopes that they divulge incriminating information under duress. This seems pretty worthless to me. You need focus for cross-examination.
- I am on the lookout for inconsistencies between and within peoples stories. Anyone caught in a lie should be detained. Period. Detaining liars encourages people to play with their cards on the table instead of concocting insane ploys like Blargs Imperial role-claim.
You have admitted to lying and we should detain you for that alone. The only reason Im voting for Setre first is because his lie is more serious (although his might be a simple mistake, so Im torn here). I sincerely believe that you are a neutral party, but there is a good chance you are a Serial Killer or similar. I also distrust QuantumBro because of his abandoned gun gambit. Maybe you can explain what you were trying to do there, Quantum? My guess was your role is actually Watcher and you intended for the Hutts to be lured into killing the gun recipient while you uncovered the killers identity. I dont want to detain him because we are gonna need him if he really is an armorer. One of his recipients could confirm him, but I dont know if we could do this safely.
There is a fundamental difference in our play-styles:
- You randomly callout people in the hopes that they divulge incriminating information under duress. This seems pretty worthless to me. You need focus for cross-examination.
- I am on the lookout for inconsistencies between and within peoples stories. Anyone caught in a lie should be detained. Period. Detaining liars encourages people to play with their cards on the table instead of concocting insane ploys like Blargs Imperial role-claim.
You have admitted to lying and we should detain you for that alone. The only reason Im voting for Setre first is because his lie is more serious (although his might be a simple mistake, so Im torn here). I sincerely believe that you are a neutral party, but there is a good chance you are a Serial Killer or similar. I also distrust QuantumBro because of his abandoned gun gambit. Maybe you can explain what you were trying to do there, Quantum? My guess was your role is actually Watcher and you intended for the Hutts to be lured into killing the gun recipient while you uncovered the killers identity. I dont want to detain him because we are gonna need him if he really is an armorer. One of his recipients could confirm him, but I dont know if we could do this safely.
Unvote: Palmer_v1
I could've sworn I did this before, but apparently not.
Also, since the day is almost over, should I give away a gun or a shield during the night? Just keep in mind, I'm probably going to be dead in the morning.
Well I never voted for him in the first place, I wanted to figure out his whole puzzle first, which I never did end up doing, so I'm waiting for his explanation too.
This was basically how I was during that last part of day 2:
I thought I was this:
but ended up more like this:
It's not random. I'm picking someone from the lowest 3-4 posts every time, barring Rymuth cause he seems to just genuinely not be there. Inactivity aids Hutts. If we don't pressure them, it would let all of them simply sit and watch while we slowly tore down active people for the stupidest shit, i.e. exmachina on Day1.
Also, it's a fucking game and I like to see people participate. I've said it lots of times before, but I'm willing to make suboptimal choices in favor of fun. I don't think I will ever change my stance on that.
God help the inactives if I ever do end up a Serial Killer.
QuantumBro
Banned
My goal was to give the town someone they could rally behind and trust. I changed my mind since Blarg caused a lot of chaos and confusion and I figured it might not be the best idea to add a gun to the mix. IIRC, you didn't like the idea of a gun being handed out to someone.
The funny thing is, I'm not even sure that the person received a shield since there's no confirmation on my end. I'm afraid that I'm going to announce that so and so has the shield and their going to be like, "uh no I don't" and then I'll get detained.
I thought I was this:
but ended up more like this:
Lol. At least the good thing about dying is that Blarg has probably already explained everything in the dead thread.
Do you remember how active the Mafia players were in the last game?
Just couldn't resist it, eh?
Before the ultron reveal, RNH and LoC were frequently on my lists of inactivity. Traube and pants were more middle of the pack and escaped my suspicion until karkador went after after pants and traube got bussed by either rnh or loc.
I think it's a mistake to make comparisons to previous games. There are no consistent patterns because human behavior is just too volatile with this small of a group. Compare Animal Crossing to Star Wars for proof.
100% give a shield. If we give a Hutt a shield, we can still detain them. But some rebel's day will be ruined if we give a Hutt a gun. Actually, a rebel would still be the likely victim of a gun fired by a rebel. And the possible existence of a thief makes gun an even less attractive option. Also, chin up. Your odds do seem bad, but then again Hutts went after Terrabyte instead of TWE/Zubz. And maybe there's even a Doctor in the house (I doubt it. Town is stacked as-is).
Lol, I'm far more of an open book than people realize. My life would be a lot simpler if i was a serial killer. Instead, i get to babysit a rather intractable player. For fun's sake, maybe my prodding of inactives has a purpose?
Agreed.
Also, none of my actions yesterday make a goddamn bit of sense if I was a serial killer, anyway. I would have stayed silent while blarg went nuts, and then just tried to kill quantum, since he seems like the biggest hindrance to an SK.
Maybe setre should watch me again so you know im not responsible if he dies tonight(he wont).
Maybe setre should watch me again so you know im not responsible if he dies tonight(he wont).
SK: watch me! watch me! watch me!
*nothing happens*
SK: See? I told you!
N1 exuse all over the place again. You guys should bookmark this page. It will be one of the main dishes on the post-game crow-eating menue.
QuantumBro
Banned
There's definitely a Hutt among redhood56, Zippedpinhead, and OceanicAir. They've reminded me a lot of RNH and LoC's playstyle in the last game.
No harm in checking though
But what if I know someone's a rebel, wouldn't it be best to give them a gun, just in case there's a time where they'd lose if they didn't have it?
I think there's something funny about Palmer, but I don't think he's a serial killer. I find it unlikely that he wouldn't have killed on either night 1 or 2, but he's definitely hiding stuff. The role just sounds really shitty for him, has to protect someone, but can't do anything to help them and he's not on the town's side. Could be our second undercover imperial.
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
I was trying to save him :c
You get out of here! Well take care of traube for you this time.
A new day dawns...
Day 3 officially begins...
Can we get official vote counts?
Matt Attack
Member
I don't think Palmer is an serial killer at this point in time, and I will gladly eat my share of crow if I'm wrong.
Just hook somebody up with a shield. It's still an incredibly useful item, and it won't likely lead to an accidental rebel death.
Just hook somebody up with a shield. It's still an incredibly useful item, and it won't likely lead to an accidental rebel death.
Think this over guys:
KILLING PALMER:
Best case scenario: We get rid of the SK
Worst case: We "loose" a neutral role that could protect one of us under very special circumstances only.
KILLING SETRE OR QUANTUMBRO:
Best case: One less Hutt
Worst case: We loose another powerful townie (investigator or armorer).
KILLING PALMER:
Best case scenario: We get rid of the SK
Worst case: We "loose" a neutral role that could protect one of us under very special circumstances only.
KILLING SETRE OR QUANTUMBRO:
Best case: One less Hutt
Worst case: We loose another powerful townie (investigator or armorer).
Did anyone perform an action on Palmer N1 or ejawa on N2? You don't have to say the action just that it happened.
I think QB should go through the lists a couple pages back and give someone generally trusted a shield. Guns would be okay if we weren't down a cop and armorer. Shields might give us more time.
Setre should track someone he hasn't yet that people are suspicious of. That role is pretty useless though, doubt we get much from it unless we have another role that we can crosscheck.
Doctor (if we have one), should randomly protect one of the following: QB, Setre, Zubz, Worthy.
Speaking of combat buddies: It annoys me that you two have voted for someone different each day. The whole point of your role is you are a team that can discuss and block vote. This counter-acts mafia's ability to block vote. Right now you two might as well be ordinary rebels that give us -2 if nked.
Setre should track someone he hasn't yet that people are suspicious of. That role is pretty useless though, doubt we get much from it unless we have another role that we can crosscheck.
Doctor (if we have one), should randomly protect one of the following: QB, Setre, Zubz, Worthy.
Speaking of combat buddies: It annoys me that you two have voted for someone different each day. The whole point of your role is you are a team that can discuss and block vote. This counter-acts mafia's ability to block vote. Right now you two might as well be ordinary rebels that give us -2 if nked.
Zippedpinhead
Member
Only eleven hours left? Crap, makai, oceanic air, redhood, eJawa, myself... (Not voting for Palmer or quantumbro for similar reasons as to why I have changed my mind on setre after convincing)
vote=Makai
It's as good a vote as any, and it's the only action I have. I don't want to have another day slip by me. I'm primarily voting for him because I disagree with his assessment on lieing and why we should vote based on that. For example, I think blarg' imperial gambit made sense for his role, and in a different players hands (like karkador did last game with a different but more deadly role) could have worked out. He was aligning himself so that the hutt's would not attack him at night, so that he could work out who they were by his role. I think he overplayed day 1, and that made it easier for us to kill him day 1, when he finally told the lie.
vote=Makai
It's as good a vote as any, and it's the only action I have. I don't want to have another day slip by me. I'm primarily voting for him because I disagree with his assessment on lieing and why we should vote based on that. For example, I think blarg' imperial gambit made sense for his role, and in a different players hands (like karkador did last game with a different but more deadly role) could have worked out. He was aligning himself so that the hutt's would not attack him at night, so that he could work out who they were by his role. I think he overplayed day 1, and that made it easier for us to kill him day 1, when he finally told the lie.
HELL NO! We have one option that is unlikely to result in the loss of a rebel: Palmer.
Stop taking stupid risks.
Please.
I'm willing to vote any of these people today:
OceanicAir
Zippedpinhead
Barrylocke
Makai
eJawa
redhood56
I feel like 3 hutts are on that list assuming QB, Setre, and Palmer are telling the truth (which of course they might not be, but we'll learn more on that soon.) My biggest fear right now is that the other IA decided to play pro-town the hopes of sliding by. I'm not sure how to counter that in our current state.
At this point Rymuth should just be mod killed, it's unfair that we went 2 game days with one player not participating at all, I don't want to have to get a read on a new player this late in the game.
I have a dentist appointment this afternoon. I should be home for the deadline, but I'm not 100% sure.
OceanicAir
Zippedpinhead
Barrylocke
Makai
eJawa
redhood56
I feel like 3 hutts are on that list assuming QB, Setre, and Palmer are telling the truth (which of course they might not be, but we'll learn more on that soon.) My biggest fear right now is that the other IA decided to play pro-town the hopes of sliding by. I'm not sure how to counter that in our current state.
At this point Rymuth should just be mod killed, it's unfair that we went 2 game days with one player not participating at all, I don't want to have to get a read on a new player this late in the game.
I have a dentist appointment this afternoon. I should be home for the deadline, but I'm not 100% sure.
OceanicAir
Member
I really don't think that it is that hard to lie about the specific role that he has. The only people that could clear him is a doctor (if it exists), second armourer (if there is one), or a mafia (his word against the mafia). And for the first two it would mean that they would out themselves to speak against it and I don't think that that Setre's role is more important than a doctor/armourer/armoured rebel.
That i only if Palmer/anybody is a serial killer. I am not going to vote Palmer (today at least) because of the possibility he is telling the truth. I'd basically have to see if there is only one kill again tomorrow. If more than one person dies tomorrow then I am all for detaining him. But now that I think about it, that would mean I have to afford Setre the same opportunity.
unvote: Setre
But seriously Rymuth hasn't posted since the beginning of day 2, wasn't exactly a hive of activity during that time, and hasn't been replaced. By day 4 if they are replaced we would have to wait until at least day 5 (possibly more) to get feel on the the replacement's playstyle. And if they're hutt/imperial we are just leaving them alive for no reason. Unless someone else jumps out I am going to just vote to remove Rymuth from the game, it's frustrating to see someone sign-up for a game and not continue with it even though they are posting elsewhere.
AbsolutBro
Member
There's just one problem with that though. We don't win by protecting rebels. We win by eliminating the opposition:
Emphasis mine. You want to protect the rebel players, and that's good. But remember that we all win when the hutt players are gone. Dead, alive, detained. It doesn't matter; if the Hutts are gone we win.
What I'm getting at is that while both protecting each other and eliminating our enemies are important, we need to hunt the hutts more than we need to save each other.
We are down to 23 - LoC, Swamped, Exmac, Blargo, TB = 18 players. We've lost 4 rebels and 1 Hutt. On the outside, that would leave 5 hutts and 13 rebels. Remember that according to swamped's role text:
[/quote][Hutts] win when Hutt Mob-aligned players are at least half of the remaining players.[/quote]
Every hutt we eliminate forces the hutt players to eliminate ~2 rebels to compensate.
If there are 5 hutts, they need to get us to 10 total players.
If we kill one, they have to get us to 8 total players.
Right now we are at 18 players. Even assuming the outside 5 hutts, that means that 8 players have to be eliminated with 0 hutt losses for them to win. If we detain a hutt, they have to get rid of 10 people with no further losses.
Palmer being 3rd party does not matter to the Hutts. They win when they are half the remaining players, regardless of affiliation. If we detain him today, and he's not a hutt, we've done part of their job for them by eliminating a non-hutt player.
TL;DR: it's better to try to eliminate hutts than it is to protect rebels.
AbsolutBro
Member
it is killing me that I can't edit to fix that fucking quote tag.