Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
I'm not surprised at Ward lashing out at Nintendo, but I'm surprised he's gone after EA too. It's rare to see such unfiltered honesty.
people forget what EA was able to do to the Dreamcast and how that ended well for SEGA
Now that we got the "table scraps" argument out of the way, Nintendo had to play the hand they were given. The game was in development already, it's an old port, but (especially from Nintendo's perspective) there wasn't much else on the horizon that held promise. What other great games would Nintendo want to co-promote at that point in time? This could have been the game that mended the rocky relationship between Nintendo and EA.
The question for me is: When and how did the relationship break down prior to that? I'm unwilling to apportion easy blame for the promotion catch-22 on both parties, but the real culprit would have been that breakdown, and that's what I want to know the circumstances of.
Just to point out a couple misnomers in the twitter posts, Mutant Mudds probably sold more on eShop because it was released on eShop much, much earlier than on Steam. It came out on Steam roughly five months after the Wii U release and almost two years after the 3DS release.
I do find the "lack of promotion" argument odd, since NFS was given space in the Nintendo Direct of that period. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJom45R8AuE
Nintendo has about 1996 levels of third party support. Amazing.
EA gave the Xbox One tons of exclusive, and that decision is going to hurt them financially. You don't think (hindsight being 20/20) that they would have put Titanfall on PS4 if they could? Or put Ultimate Team on the PS4 version of FIFA 14 instead of just XB1?
Back on topic, this is a story of Nintendo always refusing by and large to not do 3rd party marketing except for specific campaigns. Its one of the major differences between Sony and MS, and speaks to why 3rd parties prefer MS/Sony. Those platform holders will more likely subsidize your game in some fashion.
I'm not going to say that Nintendo's policy of letting 3rd parties fend for themselves historically may or may not be a correct decision, (especially if the game in question is a late port that isn't going to sell), but fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck, Nintendo's policy on this needs to change if they're going to operate in the sphere of platform holders. Its all about creating awareness of the games on your platforms, which Nintendo needs to work on, badly.
And my last thought on this, if W101, a game Nintendo fully owned and funded couldn't get a national marketing campaign, no way in hell was N4S was going to get it. No offense to Alex, and Criterion, but if they wanted a chance of anything like that, it would have to be some special exclusive game, DLC, or something that Nintendo could really market. And despite all the nifty little features the Wii U had, the Wii U version of Most Wanted wasn't that.
Sony and Microsoft's games divisions haven't been profitable ever.
When you raise the point about Wonderful 101 marketing you really made the point that Nintendo is stupid about marketing in general
Wii U marketing sucked balls and the sales prove it, still indie games seem to sell well on the eShop and Alex Ward's new company could have benefited from this instead of holding a grudge about what went on between EA and Nintendo he was in the worst spot he should understand this but hey it is his company I wish him the best.
nothing should sell well on Nintendo platforms if we look at Nintendo marketing
but we got JUST DANCE to thank for Ubisoft still willing to port to Nintendo
Nintendoom is alive and well but one company you should never bet against is Nintendo
eShop can only get better so any indie can still find money to be made there
Nintendo markets third party games. See, Rayman Legends...
Just to point out a couple misnomers in the twitter posts, Mutant Mudds probably sold more on eShop because it was released on eShop much, much earlier than on Steam. It came out on Steam roughly five months after the Wii U release and almost two years after the 3DS release.
Small update with the first two months of Steam sales:
Descent first few days but then it dropped of quickly. The 3DS legs continue to be ridiculous though, and sold more than the steam version in the same time even though it's been out for over a year (this chart doesn't include japanese sales):
That's because they know a game like that would sell on Nintendo hardware
to be honest he really had me hyped about this game even when it was months late the PR tour he did for the game really helped spin that it was the best version even sold you on the PC textures used in the Wii U version
Alex Ward did a great job selling me on that game
I wish him the best now that he is away from EA and Nintendo
so hopefully you guys will buy his game on those other platforms
Yet Nintendo featured NFSMWU on Nintendo directs and the game is featured prominently on the eshop al the time, that's more support then EA ever gave it.
Yet it's Nintendo that is all to blame right?
It wasn't that Nintendo was stupid, they made a conscious decision to hoard their advertising and marketing dollars for the 2nd half of 2013 to try to promote their big budget 1st party titles the best way they can. Even if somebody at Nintendo was impressed at Most Wanted, it was released in March 2013, during the first half of the year when Nintendo wasn't doing any promoting at all for games.
Looking back at it, the only 3rd party game that did well on Wii U at the time was probably Monster Hunter 3U, and that's because Capcom kept expectations in check, got good word of mouth from fans of the series, and tried really hard to grow the sales organically. The one thing they did not do blanketed the airwaves with ads. It was very much a modern ad campaign done on the cheap, and that mostly worked.
Yet Nintendo featured NFSMWU on Nintendo directs and the game is featured prominently on the eshop al the time, that's more support then EA ever gave it.
Yet it's Nintendo that is all to blame right?
This thread is great.
Mod parade at the start.
Overly zealous distancing of the twitter ranter's Nintendo fan cred.
People still questioning Ward's platform decisions, when they're his savings and his livelihood on the line.
Blame for all (but mainly EA). Mixed with some "Good work, Nintendo, spurn those bastards." Rather than recognition that the only entity that can break this cycle is Nintendo themselves.
To be honest, I wish he reconsiders his stance with Nintendo, and for NCL to get their act together. It'll be hard, no doubt, but still...
This thread is great.
Mod parade at the start.
Overly zealous distancing of the twitter ranter's Nintendo fan cred.
People still questioning Ward's platform decisions, when they're his savings and his livelihood on the line.
Blame for all (but mainly EA). Mixed with some "Good work, Nintendo, spurn those bastards." Rather than recognition that the only entity that can break this cycle is Nintendo themselves, because as highlighted nicely in charlequin's post third parties are the ones with leverage in the relationship.
oh yeah mang, a 30 second reel is really touting the game
Nintendo had a good opportunity to help advertise the game as the definitive version, but they threw it away.
Shame, Criterion was/is the only decent EA dev left.
Sony and Microsoft's games divisions haven't been profitable ever.
you are right, it is technically EA's obligation to publish, distribute and promote their game, Nintendo could have not do anything against EA don't releasing on UE. Probably they already cover their expenses in the US release. It was up to Nintendo to secure a succesful launch everywhere and keep publishers interested.EA is the company that made people work their asses off for a game they didn't even plan on marketing themselves. How is this Nintendo's fault? You can't expect others to do your work for you.
To be honest, I wish he reconsiders his stance with Nintendo, and for NCL to get their act together. It'll be hard, no doubt, but still...
I'm sorry but I remain relatively incredulous to the idea that some sort of "feud" exists and EA ceased Wii U development out of wholly irrational sentiment.While there's a lot more Nintendo could do all around for third party support in general, in this instance it doesn't appear they could do much. Something happened between them and EA to basically cause EA to completely abandon the system without any actual commitment (certainly not an unpresented partnership.) Either way, its really unfortunate that Criterion got fucked over between this stupid feud.
Why would Nintendo advertise a late NFS port? lol
That's probably more up to Nintendo. It was mentioned earlier that initially Just Add Water (Oddworld) had no plans of releasing games on the Wii U, but Nintendo apparently approached them and changed their minds.
We can only compare released software, which has either performed in-line with other consoles (Giana Sisters) was sales leader (Mutant Mudds, Trine, Runner 2, etc). Additionally, we know Two Tribes saw profit on their releases and Unepic reached profitability in three days.
No, we can't make sweeping statements about profit viability but we really can't do that anywhere. Aside from some snippets we get from devs/publishers we really don't know.
Just for a moment, let's ignore the bumpy ride that was the PS3. You don't think that the PSX and PS2 were profitable endeavors for Sony?
Yeah mang, and EA did something? you know, the actual publishers of the game and funders of Criterion?
Some of you are so fixated on blaming everythign on Nintendo you even gloss overe the fact that
the actual publisher didn't do anything themselves, as even Alex Ward himself stated.
Why would Nintendo advertise a late NFS port? lol
Right? Anyone could tell there was no point in porting that game months later.
Yeah mang, and EA did something? you know, the actual publishers of the game and funders of Criterion?
Some of you are so fixated on blaming everything on Nintendo you even gloss over the fact that
the actual publisher didn't do anything themselves, as even Alex Ward himself stated.