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Prosecutors decline to charge Caitlyn Jenner in fatal crash

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Opinionatedfish

Opinionatedfish

Member
So, the moral of this story, because she's gonna get wrecked in a civil suit, is this:

If you are a rich "B-List" celebrity. Please pay OTHER PEOPLE to drive you places.

If Caitlyn wants to pay me to drive her around. I'll do it. Although I'm gonna want a fairly sizable amount of money. Just saying.
 
O

onadesertedisland

Member
Simply Sarah said:
I'll say again, just because she's a rich asshole that was at fault here, which is pretty clear from the evidence, doesn't mean she's a rich asshole that actually committed a crime here and could be convicted of it, which the DA felt they do because there wasn't any strong enough evidence that she had acted negligently. This really doesn't seem like it's about Jenner as much as this just isn't the kind of situation that normally results in criminal charges.
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DAs prosecute winnable cases. There was a chance they would not win, hence, the no prosecution. There wasn't even a chance to seek justice, no trial, nothing. Being rich means you can hire attorneys that will pull every card and trick, something that the poor cannot do. A poor person would have been railroaded into taking a plea for vehicular manslaughter because the DA would have almost certainly won in court. The DA would take that case, because it's winnable.
 
spookyfish

spookyfish

Member
Bombasador said:
You honestly don't think her being the face of the trans acceptance movement has anything to do with their decision?
Click to expand...

I think it was more of a case of "affluenza" at the time of the accident. If she had remained Bruce Jenner, I think the outcome would have been the same.
 
K

Kreed

Member
Let's see what I find by clicking on the actual article vs just reading the OP and the bolded parts...

A prosecutor wrote in a one-page sheet declining to file charges that Jenner was traveling slightly below the posted speed limit and began braking less than two seconds before the crash. To prove misdemeanor vehicular manslaughter, prosecutors would have had to show Jenner was negligent and had violated a basic speed law.

Based on the facts, the office determined they "cannot prove beyond a reasonable doubt that suspect's conduct was unreasonable."
Click to expand...

Not seeing anything wrong here.
 
F

Flavius

Member
Hero_of_the_Day said:
Haha. I understand it just fine. It's just a funny sentence. "I hope none of you wind up accidentally killing someone" Well, no shit!
Click to expand...

The implication is obvious, but considering my post en toto...why wouldn't it be? A bunch of people lashing out blindly without considering that there are plenty of people out there who have made mistakes that resulted in the death of others.

Congrats on getting it. I just wasn't expecting a reply reiterating my point while simultaneously questioning it.
 
H

Hero_of_the_Day

Member
Flavius said:
The implication is obvious, but considering my post en toto...why wouldn't it be? A bunch of people lashing out blindly without considering that there are plenty of people out there who have made mistakes that resulted in the death of others.
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I think a lot of people don't find "oops!" to be an acceptable defense for killing someone. She's getting off without criminal charges because it would be too difficult to prove she was negligent, but that doesn't mean she wasn't. As others have said, hopefully a civil suit follows which she will surely lose, or settle when her lawyers tell her she stands no chance of winning.
 
D

DoktorEvil

Banned
Flavius said:
Eeesh. I hope all of you up in arms over this never find yourself in a predicament where you fuck up and someone loses their life over it. Of course it's absolutely terrible that someone lost their life here and I can only imagine how devastated her family and friends are. But to demean and belittle a person, anyone, because of a mistake with consequences everyone with a sane mind understands absolutely were not intended?

Speaks more to all of you than her.

The reality is celebrities are generally treated more harshly when it comes to legal issues than the general public, not less. If Caitlin Jenner hadn't been driving, I seriously doubt charges would have ever been brought in the first instance.

It's a horrible situation for all parties involved. The difference, of course, is that one of those parties paid the ultimate price, while another lives knowing that their actions resulted in someone else's death.

But hey, who gives a shit, right? Fuck her.
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http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1036351

This guy fled the scene of a hit and run with drugs & alcohol in his system. He was at the time the face of the UFC and one of the best MMA fighters in the world.

Result?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=180278720&postcount=559

So no, justice isn't always harsher when it comes to celebrity.

I could also point out Matthew Broderick's case as well.

With that said, the best the victims could get would be a civil suit. There is reasonable doubt that Jenner was acting reasonably when being chased by a paparazzi.
 
F

Flavius

Member
Hero_of_the_Day said:
I think a lot of people don't find "oops!" to be an acceptable defense for killing someone. She's getting off without criminal charges because it would be too difficult to prove she was negligent, but that doesn't mean she wasn't. As others have said, hopefully a civil suit follows which she will surely lose, or settle when her lawyers tell her she stands no chance of winning.
Click to expand...

You and others are clearly conflating a public definition of negligence with a criminal one. Who is arguing this? What you all seem to miss is that criminal negligence is not, by definition, an intentional crime.

So when you're whining and bitching about what a piece of shit someone is, recognize you're directing it at someone who committed a horrible accident.

Where are the fucking brains in this place today? Which part of that is difficult to grasp?
 
H

HawksWinStanley

Member
Hopefully the victim's family makes bank at the end of all this. It has to be rough seeing the face of the person who killed your loved one everywhere. That constant reminder would be torture.
 
G

Gordon Shumway

Banned
810250_o.gif
 
H

Hero_of_the_Day

Member
Flavius said:
You and others are clearly conflating a public definition of negligence with a criminal one. Who is arguing this? What you all seem to miss is that criminal negligence is not, by definition, an intentional crime.

So when you're whining and bitching about what a piece of shit someone is, recognize you're directing it at someone who committed a horrible accident.

Where are the fucking brains in this place today? Which part of that is difficult to grasp?
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You are saying what I said in my post. She wasn't charged because it would be difficult to prove she legally did something wrong, but that doesn't mean she morally didn't. I fully get why she wasn't charged. That doesn't stop me from being angry that her driving like a dumb ass to stop her picture from being taken resulted in someones death.

What you are attempting to argue, I guess, is that no one should be mad at her because it was an accident. Why the shit should that save her from any outrage? The accident wasn't that she was doing something wrong. She was purposefully doing something wrong, and accidentally killed someone as a result. Uhh, yeah, that pisses people off.
 
F

Flavius

Member
Hero_of_the_Day said:
You are saying what I said in my post. She wasn't charged because it would be difficult to prove she legally did something wrong, but that doesn't mean she morally didn't. I fully get why she wasn't charged. That doesn't stop me from being angry that her driving like a dumb ass to stop her picture from being taken resulted in someones death.

What you are attempting to argue, I guess, is that no one should be mad at her because it was an accident. Why the shit should that save her from any outrage? The accident wasn't that she was doing something wrong. She was purposefully doing something wrong, and accidentally killed someone as a result. Uhh, yeah, that pisses people off.
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What was she purposefully doing wrong?
 
G

Garlador

Member
I can't even imagine how painful it is for the family to sit there all this time watching Caitlyn Jenner getting awards, being called a hero, praised from coast to coast, and championed as a role model for countless individuals while being told "sorry she killed your loved one, but we aren't going to pursue this. You see, she's a CELEBRITY. They're not like the rest of us."

That's gotta be some sort of personal hell.

"Wow, that Caitlyn Jenner is great!"
"She killed my family member."
"Yeah, but she's so BRAVE!"
 
K

knkng

Member
PSYGN said:
What the hell, the video's right there. What more evidence do you need?
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Proof of criminal negligence for starters. She rear ended a car, which happened to swerve into oncoming traffic. That's a little bit different from driving on the sidewalk, or something of that nature.
 
C

Cetra

Member
Some of the vitriol in here is blowing my mind. There was a traffic accident, and tragically, someone died. No one intentionally caused this death. It was very unfortunate and tragic accident.

Do we prosecute parents who's children kill themselves or others accidentally because the parent left the gun safe unlocked? Not to my knowledge. The child didn't intentionally set out out to cause a death. It was a very unfortunate and tragic accident.
 
K

KHarvey16

Member
Why are people not reading what the prosecutor said?

And why are people assuming the potential charge here would result in jail time for anyone, celebrity or not?
 
Patapwn

Patapwn

Member
I mean, what good would criminal prosecution do? I understand that society tends to go for the jugular and there is this looming feeling of double standards that can be construed from this decision but even if this wasn't a celebrity case this was obviously an accident. There was most likely some negligence but following through on a vehicular manslaughter charge seems like overkill.

This should be settled the American way, by suing the fuck out of her.
 
G

Gastone

Member
Cetra said:
Some of the vitriol in here is blowing my mind. There was a traffic accident, and tragically, someone died. No one intentionally caused this death. It was very unfortunate and tragic accident.

Do we prosecute parents who's children kill themselves or others accidentally because the parent left the gun safe unlocked? Not to my knowledge. The child didn't intentionally set out out to cause a death. It was a very unfortunate and tragic accident.
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She was driving the car herself, no? If you rear-end a car, and cause a fatal accident, you're 100% responsible. And you're obviously not paying attention to the fucking road and/or traffic. This a grown adult, With a fucking drivers License we're talking about. Not some poor child accidentally finding his dads gun.
 
F

Flavius

Member
Coffee Dog said:
Driving too fast and then not stopping in time.

Was her foot on the gas an accident?
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Are you at all familiar, conceptually or personally, with the conditions under which traffic accidents occur?

Gastone said:
She was driving the car herself, no? If you rear-end a car, and cause a fatal accident, you're 100% responsible. And you're obviously not paying attention to the fucking road and/or traffic. This a grown adult, With a fucking drivers License we're talking about. Not some poor child accidentally finding his dads gun.
Click to expand...

Boggles the mind. You have it backwards.
 
G

Garlador

Member
Cetra said:
Some of the vitriol in here is blowing my mind. There was a traffic accident, and tragically, someone died. No one intentionally caused this death. It was very unfortunate and tragic accident.

Do we prosecute parents who's children kill themselves or others accidentally because the parent left the gun safe unlocked? Not to my knowledge. The child didn't intentionally set out out to cause a death. It was a very unfortunate and tragic accident.
Click to expand...

Yes we do! We charge parents for criminal neglect with firearms. All the time, in fact.
Parents Arrested after Son Shoots Himself
Parents Arrested for Negligence
Parents Charged for Not Securing Firearms

So, yes, we do prosecute parents for children accidentally killing themselves and others.
 
M

Matt

Member
Gastone said:
She was driving the car herself, no? If you rear-end a car, and cause a fatal accident, you're 100% responsible. And you're obviously not paying attention to the fucking road and/or traffic. This a grown adult, With a fucking drivers License we're talking about. Not some poor child accidentally finding his dads gun.
Click to expand...

None of this means it was a criminal act.
 
K

KHarvey16

Member
Just to reiterate:

prosecutor wrote in a one-page sheet declining to file charges that Jenner was traveling slightly below the posted speed limit and began braking less than two seconds before the crash. To prove misdemeanor vehicular manslaughter, prosecutors would have had to show Jenner was negligent and had violated a basic speed law.

Based on the facts, the office determined they "cannot prove beyond a reasonable doubt that suspect's conduct was unreasonable."
Click to expand...
 
F

Flavius

Member
Volimar said:
People having trouble with pronouns or are they just trans intolerant?
Click to expand...

Difficult to tell in a couple of instances. All too obvious in others.

Gastone said:
Please,enlighten me.
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Read your own words. In your contrasting scenario, you shift focus from the negligent party to the victim. You gave dad a free pass for leaving his firearm out loaded where his child could obtain it and then accidentally shoots himself or someone else, right? Speeding and slow to brake? Off to jail with you! Unsecured deadly weapon left in an area easily accessible by a child?

Poor child. <--Your words.

Welp.
 
C

Cetra

Member
Gastone said:
If you rear-end a car, and cause a fatal accident, you're 100% responsible.
Click to expand...

Love how cut and dry you've made that scenario.

I'll keep that in mind the next time a car suddenly slams on it's brakes while I'm behind them, or the like. I'll be sure to remember that if an accident occurs it's because I didn't engage my superhuman reflexes in order to avoid a collision.
 
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